Technology

The Rollup

Where digital assets and finance converge. Live from the financial capital of the world.

Website: https://therollup.co/

Latest Episodes:

2025 Year in Review: Why RWAs are Taking Off in 2026 with Chris Yin and Teddy Pornprinya of Plume Dec 21, 2025

Show notes

Real-world assets exploded from $5B to $20B in 2025, and 2026 could hit $400B.

In this episode of Money Moves Fast, we sit down with Chris Yin and Teddy Pornprinya of Plume Network to review 2025's explosive RWA growth and predict what's coming in 2026.

Chris and Teddy break down the duration vs liquidity trade-off, private credit's $22B onchain opportunity, and why fed rate cuts are setting up the coming RWA explosion.

We discuss:

- Why CLOs Are The New T-Bills

- How Plume Captured 50% of All RWA Users

- The Duration vs. Liquidity Trade-Off

- Private Credit's $22B Onchain Opportunity

- Permissionless Access to Institutional Products

- Fed Rate Cuts & The Coming RWA Explosion

- Best Ways to Capture the 5-10x Upside

Timestamps:

00:00 Intro

00:47 Polygon Ad

01:05 2025 Year in Review

02:51 Understanding CLOs & Triple-A Ratings

05:48 Janus Henderson's $500M Deployment

07:17 Rate Cuts & Yield Hunting

10:28 Plume's Permissionless Strategy

13:11 Network Dominance: Ethereum vs. The Rest

16:04 Duration Risk Explained

18:06 Active Address Leadership

22:46 Who Are Plume's Users?

25:23 RWA Looping Strategies

26:55 Halliday Ad, Trezor Ad, Hibachi Ad

28:02 Covering Duration Risk

30:13 User Base: KYC vs. Permissionless

34:22 Fed Rate Cuts & 2026 Outlook

36:19 infiniFi Ad, YEET Ad, Kalshi Ad

37:21 The Coming Nuclear Growth Phase

39:04 How to Get Exposure to RWA Growth

40:55 Top Infrastructure Plays

42:14 Closing Thoughts

Website: https://therollup.co/

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𝗗𝗜𝗦𝗖𝗟𝗔𝗜𝗠𝗘𝗥: 𝘐𝘯𝘷𝘦𝘴𝘵𝘪𝘯𝘨 𝘪𝘯 𝘤𝘳𝘺𝘱𝘵𝘰𝘤𝘶𝘳𝘳𝘦𝘯𝘤𝘺 𝘢𝘯𝘥 𝘋𝘦𝘍𝘪 𝘱𝘭𝘢𝘵𝘧𝘰𝘳𝘮𝘴 𝘤𝘰𝘮𝘦𝘴 𝘸𝘪𝘵𝘩 𝘪𝘯𝘩𝘦𝘳𝘦𝘯𝘵 𝘳𝘪𝘴𝘬𝘴 𝘪𝘯𝘤𝘭𝘶𝘥𝘪𝘯𝘨 𝘵𝘦𝘤𝘩𝘯𝘪𝘤𝘢𝘭 𝘳𝘪𝘴𝘬, 𝘩𝘶𝘮𝘢𝘯 𝘦𝘳𝘳𝘰𝘳, 𝘱𝘭𝘢𝘵𝘧𝘰𝘳𝘮 𝘧𝘢𝘪𝘭𝘶𝘳𝘦 𝘢𝘯𝘥 𝘮𝘰𝘳𝘦. 𝘈𝘵 𝘤𝘦𝘳𝘵𝘢𝘪𝘯 𝘱𝘰𝘪𝘯𝘵𝘴 𝘵𝘩𝘳𝘰𝘶𝘨𝘩𝘰𝘶𝘵 𝘵𝘩𝘪𝘴 𝘤𝘩𝘢𝘯𝘯𝘦𝘭, 𝘸𝘦 𝘮𝘢𝘺 𝘦𝘢𝘳𝘯 𝘢 𝘤𝘰𝘮𝘮𝘪𝘴𝘴𝘪𝘰𝘯 𝘰𝘳 𝘧𝘦𝘦 𝘢𝘴 𝘢 𝘴𝘱𝘰𝘯𝘴𝘰𝘳𝘴𝘩𝘪𝘱, 𝘪𝘧 𝘵𝘩𝘪𝘴 𝘪𝘴 𝘵𝘩𝘦 𝘤𝘢𝘴𝘦 𝘸𝘦 𝘸𝘪𝘭𝘭 𝘢𝘭𝘸𝘢𝘺𝘴 𝘮𝘢𝘬𝘦 𝘴𝘶𝘳𝘦 𝘪𝘵 𝘪𝘴 𝘤𝘭𝘦𝘢𝘳. 𝘞𝘦 𝘢𝘳𝘦 𝘴𝘵𝘳𝘪𝘤𝘵𝘭𝘺 𝘢𝘯 𝘦𝘥𝘶𝘤𝘢𝘵𝘪𝘰𝘯𝘢𝘭 𝘤𝘰𝘯𝘵𝘦𝘯𝘵 𝘱𝘭𝘢𝘵𝘧𝘰𝘳𝘮, 𝘯𝘰𝘵𝘩𝘪𝘯𝘨 𝘸𝘦 𝘰𝘧𝘧𝘦𝘳 𝘪𝘴 𝘧𝘪𝘯𝘢𝘯𝘤𝘪𝘢𝘭 𝘢𝘥𝘷𝘪𝘤𝘦. 𝘞𝘦 𝘢𝘳𝘦 𝘯𝘰𝘵 𝘱𝘳𝘰𝘧𝘦𝘴𝘴𝘪𝘰𝘯𝘢𝘭𝘴 𝘰𝘳 𝘭𝘪𝘤𝘦𝘯𝘴𝘦𝘥 𝘢𝘥𝘷𝘪𝘴𝘰𝘳𝘴.

How AI Agents Are Replacing Hedge Fund Managers with Pei Chen of Theoriq Dec 20, 2025

Show notes

AI agents are moving from demos to managing real capital and replacing hedge fund managers in the process.

In this episode of AI Supercycle, we sit down with Pei Chen of Theoriq to explore how AI agents are transitioning from proof-of-concepts to autonomous economic agents managing real money.

Pei breaks down the trust problem around letting AI control our money and what happens when white-collar jobs get disrupted first.

We discuss:

- AI going from demos to managing real capital

- Why Gemini dominated 2025's model wars

- How AI agents are replacing hedge fund managers

- Theoriq's Alpha Vault: 25% returns through agent coordination

- The trust problem: when should we let AI control our money?

- White-collar jobs getting disrupted first

- AI building AI: the inception problem

- Future of junior engineering roles with AI

Timestamps:

00:00 Intro

01:30 Theoriq's TGE week recap

04:02 Intelligence layer architecture

09:19 One word to describe 2025 in AI

14:15 AI meeting the real economy

16:02 Bootstrapping DeFi liquidity with agents

19:48 White-collar jobs getting disrupted first

21:01 Hibachi Ad, Trezor Ad, Yeet Ad

23:09 Best AI model prediction for market analysis

27:13 Distribution vs integration in 2025

32:45 Which AI codes best?

34:33 InfiniFi Ad, Halliday Ad, Kalshi Ad

35:36 AI building AI: the inception problem

37:51 Future of junior engineering roles

Website: https://therollup.co/

Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/1P6ZeYd...

Podcast: https://therollup.co/category/podcast

Follow Rob on X: https://www.x.com/robbie_rollup

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Join our TG group: https://t.me/+TsM1CRpWFgk1NGZh

The Rollup Disclosures: https://therollup.co/the-rollup-discl

Stablecoins in 2025: The Breakout Year In Review (And What Comes Next...) Dec 19, 2025

Show notes

Stablecoins led one of the most important years in crypto progress.

Supply surged. Yield went onchain. Tokenization exploded. Now, a handful of protocols started to separate themselves from the rest.

In this episode, the StableWatch team breaks down what actually happened in stablecoins this year, why growth accelerated so fast, and which yield-bearing models we think matter heading into next year.

We review the data, apply numbers to narratives, and make clear predictions for 2026 across yield, RWAs, and onchain credit.

We discuss:

• How yieldcoins grew from $7B to $22B+

• Which models are winning: Ethena, Sky, Maple, Ondo, Securitize (And why...)

• Why Sky’s yield compressed while Ethena surged

• How tokenization quietly became one of crypto’s strongest narratives

• RWAs, onchain credit, and where real demand is coming from

• Why DeFi benefits when risk-free rates fall

Timestamps:

00:00 Intro

00:36 The Stablecoin Shift

03:23 How StableWatch Started

07:42 2025 Review: $75.8B → $228B

12:27 Sky vs Ethena: Winners & Losers

16:57 Haliday Ad InfiniFi Ad Yeet Ad

19:27 Why Stablecoins Track Crypto Markets

24:09 RWAs, Credit & Tokenization

28:47 Why Risk-Free Rates Matter

30:47 Kalshi Ad Trezor Ad Hibachi Ad

35:47 2026 Predictions: Who Wins Next

42:38 Rate Cuts & the Next DeFi Boom

49:51 StableWatch’s Vision for 2026

Website: https://therollup.co/

Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/1P6ZeYd...

Podcast: https://therollup.co/category/podcast

Follow Rob on X: https://www.x.com/robbie_rollup

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Join our TG group: https://t.me/+TsM1CRpWFgk1NGZh

The Rollup Disclosures: https://therollup.co/the-rollup-discl

What Altcoins Are Actually Worth Holding with Lark Davis Dec 17, 2025

Show notes

The vast majority of altcoins won't return to all-time highs and they don't deserve to.

In this episode, Lark breaks down his portfolio strategy and reveals which assets are actually worth holding for the next 10 years.

We also covered Wall Street's tokenization wave, the XRP vs Chainlink banking debate, and why retail is getting left out of the biggest wealth transfer in crypto history.

We discuss:

- Why Most Altcoins Are Fundamentally Overvalued

- The Token vs Equity Problem Destroying Value

- Concentration Over Diversification Strategy

- Wall Street's Tokenization Wave (And How Retail Gets Left Out)

- XRP vs Chainlink: Who Really Owns Banking?

- The 10-Year Assets Worth Holding

Timestamps:

00:00 Intro

02:39 The Weird Year for Crypto

06:10 Altcoin Reality Check

08:25 Portfolio Management in Bear Conditions

09:25 YEET Ad, Trezor Ad, Halliday Ad

10:03 Institutional Adoption vs Price Action

18:19 The Four-Year Cycle Debate

23:45 Token vs Equity Dynamic

28:42 Kalshi Ad, Hibachi Ad, infiniFi Ad

29:14 The 10-Year Amazon Bet

34:49 XRP Valuation Discussion

36:51 Chainlink's Fundamental Edge

Website: https://therollup.co/

Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/1P6ZeYd...

Podcast: https://therollup.co/category/podcast

Follow Rob on X: https://www.x.com/robbie_rollup

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Join our TG group: https://t.me/+TsM1CRpWFgk1NGZh

The Rollup Disclosures: https://therollup.co/the-rollup-discl

Why AI Agents Still Fail at Simple Tasks with Teng Yan Dec 14, 2025

Show notes

AI promises autonomous agents that book flights and handle tasks. We're not there yet but 2026 might change everything.

In this episode of AI Supercycle, we sit down with Teng Yan of Chain of Thought to explore when AI agents will actually work autonomously and who really owns the AI powering them.

Teng breaks down the data center space race, crypto-AI infrastructure traction, and whether we're heading toward an AI privacy crisis in 2026.

We discuss:

- Why Model Improvements Are Accelerating Fast

- The Truth About Prompt Engineering

- Are We Facing an AI Privacy Crisis?

- When Will Agents Actually Work Autonomously?

- The Data Center Space Race: Bubble or Breakthrough?

- Crypto-AI Infrastructure: What's Actually Getting Traction?

Timestamps:

00:00 Intro

00:37 Near Protocol Ad

01:56 Teng's AI Background & Journey

06:15 2025: The Year AI Leveled Up

08:44 Haliday Ad, infiniFi Ad, YEET Ad

09:16 Model Improvements Across the Stack

14:22 Prompt Engineering Myths Debunked

18:45 Giving Models Context

22:10 Testing Across Multiple LLMs

24:30 AI Privacy: Crisis Brewing?

27:37 Kalshi Ad, Hibachi Ad, Trezor Ad

28:11 Near's Private AI Solution

32:40 Agent Landscape Reality Check

38:25 Why Agents Still Fail at Simple Tasks

42:15 2026: Year of the Agent?

45:30 Ethics of For-Profit AI Giants

51:20 The Data Center Bubble Question

55:45 Bit Tensor & Crypto-AI Traction

59:30 What to Watch in Blockchain AI

Website: https://therollup.co/

Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/1P6ZeYd...

Podcast: https://therollup.co/category/podcast

Follow Rob on X: https://www.x.com/robbie_rollup

Follow Andy on X: https://www.x.com/ayyyeandy

Join our TG group: https://t.me/+TsM1CRpWFgk1NGZh

The Rollup Disclosures: https://therollup.co/the-rollup-discl

How DTCC's SEC Approval Changes Everything For Onchain Finance with Sam Kazemian and Rob Montgomery Dec 12, 2025

Show notes

Do Kwon's getting 15 years. DTCC just unlocked quadrillions for tokenization. And the stablecoin chain wars are heating up.

In this episode of Stabled Up, Sam Kazemian of Frax Finance and Rob Montgomery of InfiniFi break down how DTCC's SEC approval changes everything for onchain finance.

Sam and Rob reveal the dynamics reshaping payment chains and why Korean Won, Brazilian Riyal, and Turkish Lira going onchain matters more than you think.

We covered:

- Sam's Untold Terra War Room Stories

- How DTCC's SEC Approval Changes Everything

- The Explosive Race Between Tempo, Stable & Plasma

- Why 2026 Is The Year of Non-USD Stablecoins

- Korean Won, Brazilian Riyal & Turkish Lira Going Onchain

- Invoice Financing's 24% APR Opportunity

- Winner-Take-All Dynamics in Payment Chains

Timestamps:

00:00 Intro

00:37 Polygon Ad

01:19 Mark's Role at Kraken

02:19 The Problem with Traditional Banks

03:40 Neo Banking Revolution

05:30 crack App Vision & Features

08:53 What Makes a Great Neo Bank

11:11 Kalshi Ad, Halliday Ad, Trezor Ad

11:40 Financial Super Apps

14:01 Bakkt Acquisition & X Stocks Thesis

17:17 X Stocks Growth & Adoption

19:03 Democratizing Global Markets

20:32 The crack App Ecosystem

22:08 Next Gen Users & On-Chain Yields

24:05 Competition Analysis

26:09 YEET Ad, infiniFi Ad, Hibachi Ad

26:49 Yeet Ad

27:20 crack Card Breakdown

29:21 Cashback & Rewards Structure

31:08 Network Effects Across Products

33:27 2026 Vision & Culture

34:15 Closing Thoughts

Website: https://therollup.co/

Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/1P6ZeYd...

Podcast: https://therollup.co/category/podcast

Follow Rob on X: https://www.x.com/robbie_rollup

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Join our TG group: https://t.me/+TsM1CRpWFgk1NGZh

The Rollup Disclosures: https://therollup.co/the-rollup-discl

How Kraken Is Building the Anti-Bank with Mark Greenberg Dec 12, 2025

Show notes

Banking still sucks. Kraken is fixing it.

In this episode of Money Moves Fast, we sit down with Mark Greenberg of Kraken to explore how neo banks are replacing traditional finance and why Kraken's Krak app might be the catalyst.

From spending any asset anywhere to tokenized equities on Solana and Ethereum, Mark breaks down Kraken's vision for democratizing access to global markets, why DeFi yields crush traditional savings accounts, and how the Krak Card delivers 1% cashback in crypto.

We covered:

- Why Neo Banks Are Replacing Traditional Finance

- The Krak App: Spend Any Asset, Anywhere

- X Stocks: Tokenized Equities on Solana & Ethereum

- How Kraken Acquired Backed to Scale Tokenization

- DeFi Yields vs. Traditional Savings Accounts

- The Krak Card: 1% Cashback in Crypto

- Democratizing Access to Global Markets

Timestamps:

00:00 Intro

00:37 Polygon Ad

01:19 Mark's Role at Kraken

02:19 The Problem with Traditional Banks

03:40 Neo Banking Revolution

05:30 Krak App Vision & Features

08:53 What Makes a Great Neo Bank

11:11 Kalshi Ad, Halliday Ad, Trezor Ad

11:40 Financial Super Apps

14:01 Bakkt Acquisition & X Stocks Thesis

17:17 X Stocks Growth & Adoption

19:03 Democratizing Global Markets

20:32 The Krak App Ecosystem

22:08 Next Gen Users & On-Chain Yields

24:05 Competition Analysis

26:09 YEET Ad, infiniFi Ad, Hibachi Ad

26:49 Yeet Ad

27:20 Krak Card Breakdown

29:21 Cashback & Rewards Structure

31:08 Network Effects Across Products

33:27 2026 Vision & Culture

34:15 Closing Thoughts

Website: https://therollup.co/

Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/1P6ZeYd...

Podcast: https://therollup.co/category/podcast

Follow Rob on X: https://www.x.com/robbie_rollup

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Join our TG group: https://t.me/+TsM1CRpWFgk1NGZh

The Rollup Disclosures: https://therollup.co/the-rollup-discl

The Four-Year Cycle Is Dead with Michael Anderson and Vance Spencer Dec 11, 2025

Show notes

Retail has been replaced. Institutional capital now controls 90% of crypto.

In this episode, we sat down with Michael Anderson and Vance Spencer of Framework to discuss why 3-4 crypto projects will actually survive, why Bitcoin dominance doesn't matter anymore, and what the Clarity Act means for DeFi's institutional unlock in 2026.

We covered:

- Why The Four-Year Cycle Just Broke

- How 25 BPS Rate Cut Changes Everything

- ETH Breaking All-Time Highs Before Bitcoin?

- The Clarity Act: DeFi's Institutional Unlock

- Only 3-4 Crypto Projects Will Actually Survive

- Why Bitcoin Dominance Doesn't Matter Anymore

- Yield Coins, Duration Risk & Sky's Role in 2026

Timestamps:

00:00 Intro

02:19 25 BPS Rate Cut Analysis

05:23 Breaking The Four-Year Cycle

09:29 January's Potential Catch-Up Trade

10:00 Institutional vs Retail Capital Shift

12:42 Vance on The Revenue Meta

14:40 Michael on Market Structure Bill

18:32 Trezor Ad, Halliday Ad

19:04 Winners & Losers of Clarity

23:05 ETH vs BTC Thesis

29:33 Benjamin Cowan's TA Scenario

31:05 Hibachi Ad, InfiniFi Ad, Yeet Ad

31:35 Bitcoin Dominance Discussion

35:13 DeFi & Value Transfer Fundamentals

38:39 Vance on Attention Tokens

39:47 Yield Coins & Duration Strategy

42:10 Clarity Act Timeline & Impact

Website: https://therollup.co/

Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/1P6ZeYd...

Podcast: https://therollup.co/category/podcast

Follow Rob on X: https://www.x.com/robbie_rollup

Follow Andy on X: https://www.x.com/ayyyeandy

Join our TG group: https://t.me/+TsM1CRpWFgk1NGZh

The Rollup Disclosures: https://therollup.co/the-rollup-discl

What Happens When Your AI Actually Belongs To You? With Illia Polosukhin Dec 07, 2025

Show notes

An AI agent with no hidden motives or data harvesting dream or reality?

In this episode of AI Supercycle we sit down with Illia Polosukhin of NEAR Protocol to explore what happens when your AI actually belongs to you.

With $7B flowing through NEAR Intents and the launch of NEAR AI Cloud, Illia explains how hardware-enabled privacy unlocks AI agents that users actually own and control.

We discuss:

- NEAR AI Cloud & Private Chat Launch

- How Intel & Nvidia Hardware Enable True Privacy

- $7B Flowing Through NEAR Intents

- AI Agents Reshaping DeFi Yield

- Why Privacy Enables Better AI Products

- Web2 Integration Coming Soon

- Treasury Companies as Network Stakeholders

Timestamps:

00:00 Intro

01:44 NEAR AI Cloud Launch

02:38 Privacy Zeitgeist Returns

04:38 Why Privacy Matters for AI

05:05 Hibachi Ad, Trezor Ad, Yeet Ad

06:08 Can NEAR Access Your Data?

07:27 Human Behavioral Trends with AI

10:12 AI Cloud Infrastructure Breakdown

12:35 Hibachi Ad, Treasure Ad

13:00 NEAR Intents $7B Volume

14:04 AI & Web2 Integration Alpha

16:41 Kalshi Ad, Halliday Ad, infiniFi Ad

17:55 AI as Your Personal Assistant

19:42 AI Agents & DeFi Yield

23:00 Does Silicon Valley Care About Privacy?

27:23 Memory & Context Management

29:40 Training Private AI Models

32:45 Infinitely Ad, Ecom Ad, Polymarket Ad

34:05 MCP & X402 Standards

37:12 2026: NEAR Token Economics

41:54 Treasury Companies & Network Alignment

Website: https://therollup.co/

Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/1P6ZeYd...

Podcast: https://therollup.co/category/podcast

Follow Rob on X: https://www.x.com/robbie_rollup

Follow Andy on X: https://www.x.com/ayyyeandy

Join our TG group: https://t.me/+TsM1CRpWFgk1NGZh

The Rollup Disclosures: https://therollup.co/the-rollup-discl

Tokenization's Inflection Point with Keyrock's Juan David Dec 06, 2025

Show notes

Eight years ago, saying "the future is tokenized" took real conviction. Now it's consensus.

In this episode of Money Moves Fast, Andy and Rob sit down with Juan David of Keyrock to explore how crypto is finally returning to fundamentals after years of speculation.

Juan David breaks down what separates real business models from protocol theater and why the adjacent trade matters more than you think.

We discuss:

- Building Institutional Crypto Infrastructure Since 2017

- Why Regional Stablecoins Haven't Scaled (Yet)

- Market Making, Money Markets & Protocol Revenue

- The Adjacent Trade: What Benefits from Stablecoin Growth?

- Onchain FX & Yield Access for Emerging Markets

- Return to Fundamentals: Real Business Models Matter

Timestamps:

00:00 Intro

00:00 Polygon Ad

01:56 Buenos Aires & Keyrock Origins

05:45 Institutions vs. Institutional Allocators

06:37 Trezor Ad, Halliday Ad, InfiniFi Ad

10:57 Custody Solutions That Actually Work

11:29 Tokenization's Inflection Point

14:04 Stablecoin Liquidity Challenges

16:39 Token Buybacks & Revenue Meta

18:03 Money Markets & Exchange Protocols

19:55 Hibachi Ad, Kalshi Ad, Yeet Ad

20:20 Return to Fundamentals Discussion

22:19 Onchain FX & Country Risk Management

22:49 Lower Frequencies Music Selection

23:17 Closing Thoughts

Website: https://therollup.co/

Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/1P6ZeYd...

Podcast: https://therollup.co/category/podcast

Follow Rob on X: https://www.x.com/robbie_rollup

Follow Andy on X: https://www.x.com/ayyyeandy

Join our TG group: https://t.me/+TsM1CRpWFgk1NGZh

The Rollup Disclosures: https://therollup.co/the-rollup-discl

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