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203. Heaven Bound with Robert Wolgemuth **Transcription Below** "Very truly I tell you, unless a kernel of wheat falls to the ground and dies, it remains only a single seed. But if it dies, it produces many seeds." John 12:24 (NIV) Questions and Topics We Discuss: Why is this Scripture is especially meaningful to you: "Unless a kernel of wheat falls to the ground and dies, it remains only a single seed. But if it dies, it produces many seeds." John 12:24b What have you learned about Heaven through your own loss of your late wife? In your unique line of work, will you share specific stories of interesting people you have encountered and lessons learned from them? Robert Wolgemuth has been in the media business for thirty-nine years. A former president of Thomas Nelson Publishers, he is the founder of Wolgemuth & Associates, a literary agency exclusively representing the writing work of more than one hundred authors. Robert is a speaker and best-selling author of over twenty books. His books include, She Calls Me Daddy, the notes to the Dad’s Devotional Bible, The Most Important Place on Earth, She Still Calls Me Daddy, and What’s in the Bible: The Story of God through Time and Eternity, co- written with R.C. Sproul. His other collaborative works include Men of the Bible and The Most Important Year in a Man’s Life. Robert is known as a champion for the family, effective communication, leadership, listening skills, relationship building, and biblical truth. Among his professional accomplishments, he has served two terms as the Chairman of the Evangelical Christian Publishers Association. A 1969 graduate of Taylor University, from where he received an honorary doctorate in May 2005, Dr. Wolgemuth has two grown daughters, two sons-in-law, and five grandchildren. Robert is married to Nancy DeMoss Wolgemuth, who is the host of the daily radio/podcast, “Revive Our Hearts.” She is also an accomplished author and speaker. Nancy and Robert live in Michigan. Finish Line on Amazon or from Revive Our Hearts Thank You to Our Sponsor: Midwest Food Bank Connect with The Savvy Sauce on Facebook or Instagram or Our Website Please help us out by sharing this episode with a friend, leaving a 5-star rating and review, and subscribing to this podcast! Gospel Scripture: (all NIV) Romans 3:23 “for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God,” Romans 3:24 “and are justified freely by his grace through the redemption that came by Christ Jesus.” Romans 3:25 (a) “God presented him as a sacrifice of atonement, through faith in his blood.” Hebrews 9:22 (b) “without the shedding of blood there is no forgiveness.” Romans 5:8 “But God demonstrates his own love for us in this: While we were still sinners, Christ died for us.” Romans 5:11 “Not only is this so, but we also rejoice in God through our Lord Jesus Christ, through whom we have now received reconciliation.” John 3:16 “For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life.” Romans 10:9 “That if you confess with your mouth, “Jesus is Lord,” and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved.” Luke 15:10 says “In the same way, I tell you, there is rejoicing in the presence of the angels of God over one sinner who repents.” Romans 8:1 “Therefore, there is now no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus” Ephesians 1:13–14 “And you also were included in Christ when you heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation. Having believed, you were marked in him with a seal, the promised Holy Spirit, who is a deposit guaranteeing our inheritance until the redemption of those who are God’s possession- to the praise of his glory.” Ephesians 1:15–23 “For this reason, ever since I heard about your faith in the Lord Jesus and your love for all the saints, I have not stopped giving thanks for you, remembering you in my prayers. I keep asking that the God of our Lord Jesus Christ, the glorious Father, may give you the spirit of wisdom and revelation, so that you may know him better. I pray also that the eyes of your heart may be enlightened in order that you may know the hope to which he has called you, the riches of his glorious inheritance in the saints, and his incomparably great power for us who believe. That power is like the working of his mighty strength, which he exerted in Christ when he raised him from the dead and seated him at his right hand in the heavenly realms, far above all rule and authority, power and dominion, and every title that can be given, not only in the present age but also in the one to come. And God placed all things under his feet and appointed him to be head over everything for the church, which is his body, the fullness of him who fills everything in every way.” Ephesians 2:8–10 “For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith – and this not from yourselves, it is the gift of God – not by works, so that no one can boast. For we are God‘s workmanship, created in Christ Jesus to do good works, which God prepared in advance for us to do.“ Ephesians 2:13 “But now in Christ Jesus you who once were far away have been brought near through the blood of Christ.“ Philippians 1:6 “being confident of this, that he who began a good work in you will carry it on to completion until the day of Christ Jesus.” **Transcription** [00:00:00] <music> Laura Dugger: Welcome to The Savvy Sauce, where we have practical chats for intentional living. I'm your host Laura Dugger, and I'm so glad you're here. [00:00:18] <music> Laura Dugger: Thank you to an anonymous donor to Midwest Food Bank, who paid the sponsorship fee in hopes of spreading awareness. Learn more about this amazing non-profit organization at MidwestFoodBank.org. Robert Wolgemuth is my guest today, and this is a conversation we all need to hear. We get to talk about heaven and loss and his latest book, Finish Line. Robert is a wonderful storyteller, and this conversation will linger in your mind long after it ends. I hope that you are richly blessed by spending your time with me, as now we get to hear Robert's story. Here's our chat. Welcome to The Savvy Sauce, Robert. Robert Wolgemuth: Thank you, Laura. It's an honor to be with you. Laura Dugger: Well, I'd love to start with just getting a little bit of context. [00:01:18] So, will you take us back to when you surrendered your life to Jesus? Robert Wolgemuth: Yes, I would be happy to. You know, you hear stories about praying at your mother's knee. That's exactly what happened to me. My mother and dad, three siblings at the time, lived in South Central Pennsylvania. And my daddy was the pastor of a church. And we went to a movie. Now, that's a crazy thing because we didn't go to movies. My first movie I was a senior in high school. But we went to a movie, it was like in the community center, and it was a movie called Mr. Texas. And it was the story of a singer-songwriter named Red Harper. And it was his story of coming to faith in Christ. And so, when the movie was over, I was on the back row... I mean, this is what you read about, right? I was in the back row, and I said to my mother, my precious mother, "I would like to receive Jesus as my Savior." So, I knelt, literally, in the dark, in the back of the auditorium, and prayed to receive Christ. [00:02:22] A really fun side note. Erwin Lutzer, who was for years the pastor of Moody Church in downtown Chicago, and I were sharing stories of our conversions, and he said, "I know this sounds crazy." He said, "Well, I was a little boy, and I went to see a movie called Mr. Texas." And I said, are you serious? So, the very same story Dr. Erwin Lutzer and me have in coming to faith in Christ because of a movie, which is amazing, actually. So, I had the privilege of growing up in a Christian home, and I'm so thankful for that. My parents loved each other, and they loved us, and they had a vision for missions around the world. And so, we spent a couple years on the mission field. So, I'm very grateful. But because of my family, I was able to be exposed to the gospel. And that's how it started. Laura Dugger: Wow, that is incredible. You also have a fascinating career. Will you tell us more about the work you get to do? [00:03:22] Robert Wolgemuth: Fascinating career. You mean I've not been able to hold down a job, so I've got a great resume? Is that what you're saying? Well, right out of college, I spent five years actually working for Youth for Christ, the ministry called Youth for Christ, with high school students. I gained an amazing appreciation for people who are in youth work, especially lifetime youth work. If you can be successful in youth work, you can do anything. And so I had six years of that and the joy of leading young people to Christ. Then at the end of that six years, I was invited to join Youth for Christ in the magazine division, publishing a magazine called Campus Life Magazine. That was my first exposure to the publishing world. I got to work alongside people like Tim Stafford and Philip Yancey. I mean, what a joy. And those guys continue to be close friends 60 years later. [00:04:23] So, that was my introduction to the publishing business. And then, after a few years of that, I was invited to come to Waco, Texas, and join Word Publishing. That was book publishing, but first it was magazine publishing. So, this was book publishing. And so, I haven't left that industry. That was my introduction to it and I'm still doing the same thing. I mean, not the same thing, but still in the same industry. In fact, I tell young people sometimes when I'm invited to speak at graduate schools or colleges, if you can find an industry that you love, stay there. Because I have 60 years of friendships with people in this industry. And it's amazing. I'm so grateful for that. Lots of younger people skip from one industry to the other, one job to the other. But if you find one that you like, and you feel like you could spend your lifetime doing that, stay there. [00:05:24] So, I went from Waco, Texas, to Nashville, Tennessee. I was the president of Thomas Nelson Communications, which was the non-Bible publishing at Thomas Nelson. And eventually, with a colleague named Michael Hyatt, started an agency, a literary agency, representing authors. So, I bought him out in 98 and spent the rest of my career so far representing authors as an agent. So, I've had the privilege of speaking into the lives of people whose names you would know, and receiving from them wisdom and understanding and friendship. So, it's been a thrill. Laura Dugger: I can imagine that it is. Are there any specific stories that come to mind of those friends that you've encountered, or even specific lessons that you've learned from soaking in all that wisdom? Robert Wolgemuth: Well, yeah, there is a story. I don't know if you follow country music. [00:06:25] So, my late wife, Bobbie, and I lived in Nashville for 17 years. And if you're not a country music fan when you go there, you're exposed to it whether you want to or not. So, I taught a large Sunday school class at First Presbyterian Church in Nashville. And one day, one of my friends came up to me and said, "Did you know that Denise Jackson is in our Sunday school class? I said, "Okay, who's Denise Jackson?" And she said, "Well, she's the wife of Alan Jackson." And I said... You know what I'm going to say, don't you? I said, "Who's Alan Jackson?" There are people right now listening, Laura, who've just hit the end key. They don't want to listen to somebody who doesn't know who Alan Jackson is. So, with apologies, I was pretty new in Nashville, and I had no exposure to country music. Well, long story short, and a wonderful story, really, a couple weeks later, Denise approached my late wife, Bobbie, and introduced herself. [00:07:28] Of course, my wife said the same thing I said. Denise said, "My name is Denise Jackson." And Bobbie said, "Oh, that's wonderful. Do I know you?" "Well, I'm the wife of Alan Jackson." "Well, that's great. Who's Alan Jackson?" Well, the truth is that that was during the time that they were separated. So, long conversations ensued, including Denise saying to Bobbie, "I would love for you to pray for my husband to come back." They were separated. And Bobbie said, "Oh, I have a much bigger prayer than that. My prayer for you, Denise, would be that you become the woman God created you to be." I mean, that was it. Well, to fast forward, eventually, Alan and Denise decided to reconcile, and they asked me to actually do the service where they renewed their vows. Really incredible thing. And then because I'm an agent and I'm in the publishing business, Denise said, "I'd love to write a book to tell this story." [00:08:34] And so she wrote a book called It's All About Him, with a picture of Alan and Denise on the cover. The "Him" in All About Him was Jesus. But when you look at the book, you think, she's writing a book about her husband. In a week, that book was number one New York Times bestseller. Which, if you know the industry, you know that that's it. That's winning the Super Bowl, right? So the book did incredibly well. We paired her with a wonderful writer, Alan Vaughan. There are other stories. That's one of my happy stories, really happy stories, about the industry, about being involved in book publishing as an agent. And then I also had a publishing company with a guy named Michael Hyatt, who some of your listeners will know. So there are lots of stories. We could spend a week just telling fun stories about God's kindness and how He's led my path, an unexpected path. I didn't have any idea what a literary agent did. [00:09:36] And now I've spent 20-some years doing that. So it's been a joy. It's an opportunity to take the message of people who know the Lord, who have been gifted as teachers, writers, people who know the gospel, know the Bible, and take their word, take their message to a broader audience. That's been a joy to do. That's how I've spent my career. Laura Dugger: Thank you for letting us in on that. That is really interesting to hear the whole story. Your life has taken quite a few unexpected turns. I'd love for you to elaborate on why this scripture is especially meaningful to you from John 12:24, that says, "...unless a kernel of wheat falls to the ground and dies, it remains only a single seed. But if it dies, it produces many seeds." Robert Wolgemuth: I love that text because... I've just written a book called Finish Line. [00:10:39] The subtitle is Dispelling Fear, Finding Peace, and Preparing for the End of Your Life. I tell the story in that book of the death of my late wife, Bobbie, in 2014. And there are lots of twists and turns about the story that I tell in the book. Probably the most interesting one to your audience would be that Bobbie knew a lady named Nancy Lee DeMoss because I was Nancy's agent. I helped her with her publishing work. And Bobbie and Nancy became friends. Nancy was single, 57 years old, never married. And before she died, Bobbie thought it would be cool if after she dies I would marry Nancy. So she told two friends that she hoped that Robert would marry Nancy Lee DeMoss. But she never told me that. So several months after Bobbie was gone, I reached out to Nancy because I had been her agent. [00:11:42] And now I'm single, and she's always been single. And that turned into a romance, and we got married in the fall of 201…
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