Technology

The Rollup

Where digital assets and finance converge. Live from the financial capital of the world.

Website: https://therollup.co/

Latest Episodes:

Vladimir Novakovski: Lighter Bull Thesis For 2026 (What’s Changed) Jun 13, 2026

Show notes

Vladimir Novakovski sits down with Andy & Robbie to break down the Lighter bull thesis from The Tokenization Tower in NYC. We discuss Lighter's escape hatch design that lets every participant exit through Ethereum even if the protocol fails, why the RFQ model is the key to bootstrapping liquidity for pre-IPO and RWA perps, and why getting Citadel and US institutional capital on chain is the biggest unlock the perp market hasn't hit yet. He's working with the CFTC to make that happen.

Vladimir Novakovski is CEO of Lighter, a decentralized perp exchange built on top of Ethereum with an institutional-grade security-first architecture.

The Rollup is where the leaders of digital assets and finance converge. Live from the financial capital of the world.

Timestamps

00:00 Intro

01:37 Perp Market Awareness Today

03:26 Pitching Institutions On Lighter

05:28 Ethereum Security And Escape Hatch

07:54 How Market Makers Stay Comfortable

11:17 How Lighter Bootstraps Liquidity

12:35 Pre-IPO Perp Durability

15:37 Build In-House Or Composable

19:29 US Regulatory Path For Perps

23:29 CFTC Innovation Council Insights

26:39 Questions For Commissioner Hester Peirce

28:07 Team Culture And Miami Office

32:26 Founder Decision Making Framework

34:46 AI Agents And Lighter's Stack

37:30 Perps Market Structure Long View

41:21 Power Law Or Distributed Market?

Guest Socials:

Vladimir Novakovski X: https://x.com/vnovakovski

Lighter X: https://x.com/Lighter_xyz

Lighter Website: https://lighter.xyz/

Partners:

Better than Banks. Transparent capital efficiency earning the highest yields in DeFi. Learn more here: https://infinifi.xyz/

---

Dinari - Over 230 1:1 backed tokenized stocks, ETFs & more with dividends. US-based SEC transfer agent. Available on 5+ chains & via API. https://dinari.com/

---

Relay is the fastest and most reliable way to swap any token on any chain. Learn more here: https://relay.link/bridge

---

Zama is an open source cryptography company that builds state-of-the-art Fully Homomorphic Encryption (FHE) solutions for blockchain.

Learn more here: https://www.zama.org/

---

Trezor is the creator of the first-ever hardware wallet. Securing crypto for 2M+ users worldwide. 100% open source.

Learn more here: https://affil.trezor.io/aff_c?offer_id=133&aff_id=36664

---

𝗪𝗲 𝘁𝗿𝘆 𝗼𝘂𝗿 𝗯𝗲𝘀𝘁 𝘁𝗼 𝗽𝗿𝗼𝗱𝘂𝗰𝗲 𝗵𝗶𝗴𝗵-𝗾𝘂𝗮𝗹𝗶𝘁𝘆, 𝗻𝗼𝗻-𝗯𝗶𝗮𝘀𝗲𝗱, 𝗲𝗱𝘂𝗰𝗮𝘁𝗶𝗼𝗻𝗮𝗹 𝗰𝗼𝗻𝘁𝗲𝗻𝘁 𝗳𝗼𝗿 𝘁𝗵𝗲 𝗱𝗶𝗴𝗶𝘁𝗮𝗹 𝗮𝘀𝘀𝗲𝘁𝘀 𝗲𝗰𝗼𝘀𝘆𝘀𝘁𝗲𝗺. 𝗦𝘂𝗽𝗽𝗼𝗿𝘁 𝘂𝘀 𝗯𝘆 𝗰𝗹𝗶𝗰𝗸𝗶𝗻𝗴 𝗮𝗻𝘆 𝗼𝗳 𝘁𝗵𝗲 𝗹𝗶𝗻𝗸𝘀 𝗯𝗲𝗹𝗼𝘄 𝗳𝗼𝗿 𝗳𝗿𝗲𝗲 𝗿𝗲𝘀𝗼𝘂𝗿𝗰𝗲𝘀:

Website: https://therollup.co/

Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/1P6ZeYd...

Podcast: https://therollup.co/category/podcast

Follow Rob on X: https://x.com/robbieklages

Follow Andy on X: https://x.com/andyyy

Join our TG group: https://t.me/+TsM1CRpWFgk1NGZh

The Rollup Disclosures: https://goodidea.ventures

𝗗𝗜𝗦𝗖𝗟𝗔𝗜𝗠𝗘𝗥: 𝘐𝘯𝘷𝘦𝘴𝘵𝘪𝘯𝘨 𝘪𝘯 𝘤𝘳𝘺𝘱𝘵𝘰𝘤𝘶𝘳𝘳𝘦𝘯𝘤𝘺 𝘢𝘯𝘥 𝘋𝘦𝘍𝘪 𝘱𝘭𝘢𝘵𝘧𝘰𝘳𝘮𝘴 𝘤𝘰𝘮𝘦𝘴 𝘸𝘪𝘵𝘩 𝘪𝘯𝘩𝘦𝘳𝘦𝘯𝘵 𝘳𝘪𝘴𝘬𝘴 𝘪𝘯𝘤𝘭𝘶𝘥𝘪𝘯𝘨 𝘵𝘦𝘤𝘩𝘯𝘪𝘤𝘢𝘭 𝘳𝘪𝘴𝘬, 𝘩𝘶𝘮𝘢𝘯 𝘦𝘳𝘳𝘰𝘳, 𝘱𝘭𝘢𝘵𝘧𝘰𝘳𝘮 𝘧𝘢𝘪𝘭𝘶𝘳𝘦 𝘢𝘯𝘥 𝘮𝘰𝘳𝘦. 𝘈𝘵 𝘤𝘦𝘳𝘵𝘢𝘪𝘯 𝘱𝘰𝘪𝘯𝘵𝘴 𝘵𝘩𝘳𝘰𝘶𝘨𝘩𝘰𝘶𝘵 𝘵𝘩𝘪𝘴 𝘤𝘩𝘢𝘯𝘯𝘦𝘭, 𝘸𝘦 𝘮𝘢𝘺 𝘦𝘢𝘳𝘯 𝘢 𝘤𝘰𝘮𝘮𝘪𝘴𝘴𝘪𝘰𝘯 𝘰𝘳 𝘧𝘦𝘦 𝘢𝘴 𝘢 𝘴𝘱𝘰𝘯𝘴𝘰𝘳𝘴𝘩𝘪𝘱, 𝘪𝘧 𝘵𝘩𝘪𝘴 𝘪𝘴 𝘵𝘩𝘦 𝘤𝘢𝘴𝘦 𝘸𝘦 𝘸𝘪𝘭𝘭 𝘢𝘭𝘸𝘢𝘺𝘴 𝘮𝘢𝘬𝘦 𝘴𝘶𝘳𝘦 𝘪𝘵 𝘪𝘴 𝘤𝘭𝘦𝘢𝘳. 𝘞𝘦 𝘢𝘳𝘦 𝘴𝘵𝘳𝘪𝘤𝘵𝘭𝘺 𝘢𝘯 𝘦𝘥𝘶𝘤𝘢𝘵𝘪𝘰𝘯𝘢𝘭 𝘤𝘰𝘯𝘵𝘦𝘯𝘵 𝘱𝘭𝘢𝘵𝘧𝘰𝘳𝘮, 𝘯𝘰𝘵𝘩𝘪𝘯𝘨 𝘸𝘦 𝘰𝘧𝘧𝘦𝘳 𝘪𝘴 𝘧𝘪𝘯𝘢𝘯𝘤𝘪𝘢𝘭 𝘢𝘥𝘷𝘪𝘤𝘦. 𝘞𝘦 𝘢𝘳𝘦 𝘯𝘰𝘵 𝘱𝘳𝘰𝘧𝘦𝘴𝘴𝘪𝘰𝘯𝘢𝘭𝘴 𝘰𝘳 𝘭𝘪𝘤𝘦𝘯𝘴𝘦𝘥 𝘢𝘥𝘷𝘪𝘴𝘰𝘳𝘴.

David Schamis: HYPE Is The Best Asset In The World (Bull Thesis) Jun 11, 2026

Show notes

David Schamis breaks down why PERE now holds over 10% of HYPE's circulating supply, why the Coinbase and Circle deal added $200M in annual buybacks that the market didn't price in for a full day, and why Hyperliquid's price discovery on Cerebus and SpaceX may make investment bankers irrelevant to the IPO process.

David Schamis is CEO of Hyperliquid Strategies, a publicly traded company and one of the largest corporate holders of HYPE.

The Rollup is where the leaders of digital assets and finance converge. Live from the financial capital of the world.

Timestamps

00:00 PERE Major Update Announced

01:03 Not Michael Saylor Mindset

05:38 ATM Equity Line Explained

08:00 Right Move Is Nothing

11:19 Coinbase Circle Deal Impact

14:16 $200M More Buybacks

16:02 He Checks HYPE Constantly

17:32 Cerebus IPO Predicted Perfectly

18:34 SpaceX Price Discovery

22:13 Anthropic OpenAI IPOs Coming

25:22 IPO Discount Is Toll

31:12 PERE Beat All ETFs

Guest Socials:

David Schamis X: https://x.com/dschamis

Hyperliquid Strategies X: https://x.com/HypeStrat

Hyperliquid Strategies Website: https://www.hypestrat.xyz/

Partners:

Better than Banks. Transparent capital efficiency earning the highest yields in DeFi. Learn more here: https://infinifi.xyz/

---

Dinari - Over 230 1:1 backed tokenized stocks, ETFs & more with dividends. US-based SEC transfer agent. Available on 5+ chains & via API. https://dinari.com/

---

Relay is the fastest and most reliable way to swap any token on any chain. Learn more here: https://relay.link/bridge

---

Zama is an open source cryptography company that builds state-of-the-art Fully Homomorphic Encryption (FHE) solutions for blockchain.

Learn more here: https://www.zama.org/

---

Trezor is the creator of the first-ever hardware wallet. Securing crypto for 2M+ users worldwide. 100% open source.

Learn more here: https://affil.trezor.io/aff_c?offer_id=133&aff_id=36664

---

Website: https://therollup.co/

Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/1P6ZeYd...

Podcast: https://therollup.co/category/podcast

Follow Rob on X: https://x.com/robbieklages

Follow Andy on X: https://x.com/andyyy

Join our TG group: https://t.me/+TsM1CRpWFgk1NGZh

The Rollup Disclosures: https://goodidea.ventures

Jake Brukhman: Why Decentralized AI Is Set To Explode (What's Changed) Jun 10, 2026

Show notes

Jake Brukman breaks down why a swarm of decentralized agents beat Google's quantum circuit research in a week, why decentralized training on consumer hardware is now provably cheaper than data centers, and why winning just 10% of AI training automatically locks in revenue from a $1 trillion inference market. He published this thesis in September 2022, before ChatGPT existed.

Jake Brukman is Founder and CEO of CoinFund, an 11-year digital assets and decentralized AI investment firm.

The Rollup is where the leaders of digital assets and finance converge. Live from the financial capital of the world.

Timestamps

00:00 AI Meets Decentralization Thesis

02:44 Thesis Before ChatGPT Existed

03:44 Consumer Devices Train Models

04:29 100B Parameters Consumer Hardware

06:45 Rise Of Authentic Swarms

09:15 Swarms Outpaced Google Fast

12:53 Inference Drives All Revenue

13:13 $1T Inference Market 2031

14:53 Crypto Subsidizes AI Inference

17:02 Win Training Win Inference

20:47 Decentralized Training Now Cheaper

22:49 Kirkland $500M Own Model

28:39 Harnesses Collect Trace Data

31:24 Co-Own Model Donate Traces

33:10 Different From Past Web3

40:11 2.4B Monthly AI Users

Guest Socials:

Jake Brukhman X: https://x.com/jbrukh

CoinFund X: https://x.com/coinfund

CoinFund Website: https://www.coinfund.io/

Partners:

Better than Banks. Transparent capital efficiency earning the highest yields in DeFi. Learn more here: https://infinifi.xyz/

---

Dinari - Over 230 1:1 backed tokenized stocks, ETFs & more with dividends. US-based SEC transfer agent. Available on 5+ chains & via API. https://dinari.com/

---

Relay is the fastest and most reliable way to swap any token on any chain. Learn more here: https://relay.link/bridge

---

Zama is an open source cryptography company that builds state-of-the-art Fully Homomorphic Encryption (FHE) solutions for blockchain.

Learn more here: https://www.zama.org/

---

Trezor is the creator of the first-ever hardware wallet. Securing crypto for 2M+ users worldwide. 100% open source.

Learn more here: https://affil.trezor.io/aff_c?offer_id=133&aff_id=36664

---

Website: https://therollup.co/

Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/1P6ZeYd...

Podcast: https://therollup.co/category/podcast

Follow Rob on X: https://x.com/robbieklages

Follow Andy on X: https://x.com/andyyy

Join our TG group: https://t.me/+TsM1CRpWFgk1NGZh

The Rollup Disclosures: https://goodidea.ventures

Frax Founder: The Future Of Stablecoins & Onchain Businesses (Why Now) Jun 09, 2026

Show notes

Sam Kazemian breaks down why the Genius Act's 120-day default acceptance is the most bullish structural change for compliant stablecoins, why you can't vibe code liquidity or DeFi integrations regardless of AI, and why the stablecoin supply step function could arrive in 6 to 8 months.

Sam Kazemian is Founder of Frax Finance, the protocol behind FRAX USD, a Genius-compliant decentralized stablecoin operating system.

The Rollup is where the leaders of digital assets and finance converge. Live from the financial capital of the world.

Timestamps

00:00 Genius Act Q1 2027

01:28 120-Day Default Acceptance

03:40 FRAX USD Genius Compliant

04:07 Biggest Stablecoin On Aave

08:05 Can't Vibe Code Liquidity

09:06 Investable DeFi Tokens Breakdown

12:42 Two Types Of Stablecoins

15:20 New On-Chain Assets Coming

19:15 Supply Growth Drives Buybacks

23:18 Reinvest Now Burn Later

27:33 Institutional Players Move Slower

28:41 Stablecoin Step Function

Guest Socials:

Sam Kazemian X: https://x.com/samkazemian

Frax Finance X: https://x.com/FraxFinance

Frax Finance Website: https://frax.com/

Partners:

Better than Banks. Transparent capital efficiency earning the highest yields in DeFi. Learn more here: https://infinifi.xyz/

---

Dinari - Over 230 1:1 backed tokenized stocks, ETFs & more with dividends. US-based SEC transfer agent. Available on 5+ chains & via API. https://dinari.com/

---

Relay is the fastest and most reliable way to swap any token on any chain. Learn more here: https://relay.link/bridge

---

Zama is an open source cryptography company that builds state-of-the-art Fully Homomorphic Encryption (FHE) solutions for blockchain.

Learn more here: https://www.zama.org/

---

Trezor is the creator of the first-ever hardware wallet. Securing crypto for 2M+ users worldwide. 100% open source.

Learn more here: https://affil.trezor.io/aff_c?offer_id=133&aff_id=36664

---

Website: https://therollup.co/

Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/1P6ZeYd...

Podcast: https://therollup.co/category/podcast

Follow Rob on X: https://x.com/robbieklages

Follow Andy on X: https://x.com/andyyy

Join our TG group: https://t.me/+TsM1CRpWFgk1NGZh

The Rollup Disclosures: https://goodidea.ventures

DeFi Dad: The Ethereum Bull Thesis In 2026 (What's New) Jun 08, 2026

Show notes

DeFi Dad breaks down why lighter's ETH escape hatch makes it the most underrated security feature versus HyperLiquid, why RWA tokenization will eventually eclipse all native crypto tokens by market cap, and why ETH staking yield is effectively the native T-bills rate of the entire DeFi economy. The most convicted ETH bull case you'll hear right now.

DeFi Dad is one of the most prominent long-term ETH advocates and DeFi content creators in the space.

The Rollup is where the leaders of digital assets and finance converge. Live from the financial capital of the world.

Timestamps:

01:15 Lighter Vs Hyperliquid

04:22 DeFi Exploit Risk Reality

05:58 DeFi Dad's Portfolio

07:32 Ethereum's DeFi Dominance

11:09 Exploits And AI Vulnerabilities

14:55 Stani New Protocol Rumors

17:38 Tom Lee BitMine Preferred Shares

19:46 STRK Vs BitMine Compared

23:19 ETH Burn And Issuance Debate

25:10 Staking Yield As Native Rate

29:23 DeFi Dad's ETH Stack Story

31:54 ETH Bull Price Targets

35:00 Return To Quality Assets

Guest Socials:

DeFi Dad X: https://x.com/DeFi_Dad

The Edge Podcast X: https://x.com/Edge_Pod

The Edge Podcast Website: https://www.the-edge.xyz/

Partners:

Better than Banks. Transparent capital efficiency earning the highest yields in DeFi. Learn more here: https://infinifi.xyz/

---

Dinari - Over 230 1:1 backed tokenized stocks, ETFs & more with dividends. US-based SEC transfer agent. Available on 5+ chains & via API. https://dinari.com/

---

Relay is the fastest and most reliable way to swap any token on any chain. Learn more here: https://relay.link/bridge

---

Zama is an open source cryptography company that builds state-of-the-art Fully Homomorphic Encryption (FHE) solutions for blockchain.

Learn more here: https://www.zama.org/

---

Trezor is the creator of the first-ever hardware wallet. Securing crypto for 2M+ users worldwide. 100% open source.

Learn more here: https://affil.trezor.io/aff_c?offer_id=133&aff_id=36664

---

Website: https://therollup.co/

Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/1P6ZeYd...

Podcast: https://therollup.co/category/podcast

Follow Rob on X: https://x.com/robbieklages

Follow Andy on X: https://x.com/andyyy

Join our TG group: https://t.me/+TsM1CRpWFgk1NGZh

The Rollup Disclosures: https://goodidea.ventures

Haseeb Qureshi: The Meteoric Rise of Perps (And The Next Massive Move) Jun 07, 2026

Show notes

Dragonfly's Haseeb Qureshi breaks down why Bitcoin is not an honest macro asset, why domestic perps will disappoint compared to offshore, and why BNB has been outearning Hyperliquid for years yet nobody wants to talk about it. The most contrarian read on digital assets you'll hear this week.

Haseeb Qureshi is Managing Partner at Dragonfly, a leading digital assets venture capital firm.

The Rollup is where the leaders of digital assets and finance converge. Live from the financial capital of the world.

Timestamps

00:00 Bloody Day Market Recap

02:21 Bitcoin Not Honest Macro

03:39 Retail Left The Market

04:56 Revenue Beats Crypto Beta

07:00 HL Regulatory Risk Explained

09:34 Domestic Perps Different Product

12:07 Why Perps Were Invented

15:42 HL Lighter Most Investable?

17:56 BNB Beats Hyperliquid Revenue

19:36 Markets Are Forward Looking

23:03 L1 Fee Paradox Explained

27:34 OpenAI Enterprise Fee Model

29:14 Fundamentals Great Prices Lagging

Guest Socials:

Haseeb X: https://x.com/hosseeb

Dragonfly X: https://x.com/dragonfly_xyz

Dragonfly Website: https://www.dragonfly.xyz/

Partners:

Better than Banks. Transparent capital efficiency earning the highest yields in DeFi. Learn more here: https://infinifi.xyz/

---

APYX - Enhanced Digital Credit Yield, Onchain | On Track to Become the Largest Holder of STRC. https://apyx.fi/

---

Dinari - Over 230 1:1 backed tokenized stocks, ETFs & more with dividends. US-based SEC transfer agent. Available on 5+ chains & via API. https://dinari.com/

---

Relay is the fastest and most reliable way to swap any token on any chain. Learn more here: https://relay.link/bridge

---

Zama is an open source cryptography company that builds state-of-the-art Fully Homomorphic Encryption (FHE) solutions for blockchain.

Learn more here: https://www.zama.org/

---

Trezor is the creator of the first-ever hardware wallet. Securing crypto for 2M+ users worldwide. 100% open source.

Learn more here: https://affil.trezor.io/aff_c?offer_id=133&aff_id=36664

---

Website: https://therollup.co/

Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/1P6ZeYd...

Podcast: https://therollup.co/category/podcast

Follow Rob on X: https://x.com/robbieklages

Follow Andy on X: https://x.com/andyyy

Join our TG group: https://t.me/+TsM1CRpWFgk1NGZh

The Rollup Disclosures: https://goodidea.ventures

Mert Mumtaz & Illia Polosukhin: What Happened to Zcash (Full Explanation) Jun 06, 2026

Show notes

Illia and Mert break down why the Zcash situation is a known ZK circuit trade-off and not the infinite mint catastrophe the market priced in, why Project Tachyon's formal verification is the most bullish upgrade in Zcash history, and why NEAR Intents generated $150K in a single volatile day, buying back NEAR while everyone else was selling.

Illia Polosukhin is Co-Founder of NEAR Protocol, and Mert is Co-Founder of Helius, a leading Solana infrastructure platform.

The Rollup is where the leaders of digital assets and finance converge. Live from the financial capital of the world.

Timestamps

00:00 Zcash Exploit Or Not?

00:41 ZK Circuit Risk Explained

02:32 Why ZEC Price Dropped

03:48 Zcash Sapling Pool 2019

05:22 No Infinite Mint Evidence

06:31 Formal Verification Is Solution

08:05 Project Tachyon Quantum Proof

11:18 AI Vulnerability Armageddon Coming

17:02 Zcash Optional Transparency Explained

21:08 NEAR Intents ZEC Inflow

24:35 Bear Case Worst Scenario

30:01 NEAR Profits On Volatility

33:43 Arthur Dumped NEAR Reaction

Guest Socials:

Mert Mumtaz X: https://x.com/mert

Helius X: https://x.com/helius

Helius Website: https://www.helius.dev/

Illia Polosukhin X: https://x.com/ilblackdragon

NEAR Protocol X: https://x.com/NEARProtocol

NEAR Protocol Website: https://www.near.org/

Partners:

Better than Banks. Transparent capital efficiency earning the highest yields in DeFi. Learn more here: https://infinifi.xyz/

---

APYX - Enhanced Digital Credit Yield, Onchain | On Track to Become the Largest Holder of STRC. https://apyx.fi/

---

Dinari - Over 230 1:1 backed tokenized stocks, ETFs & more with dividends. US-based SEC transfer agent. Available on 5+ chains & via API. https://dinari.com/

---

Relay is the fastest and most reliable way to swap any token on any chain. Learn more here: https://relay.link/bridge

---

Zama is an open source cryptography company that builds state-of-the-art Fully Homomorphic Encryption (FHE) solutions for blockchain.

Learn more here: https://www.zama.org/

---

Trezor is the creator of the first-ever hardware wallet. Securing crypto for 2M+ users worldwide. 100% open source.

Learn more here: https://affil.trezor.io/aff_c?offer_id=133&aff_id=36664

---

Website: https://therollup.co/

Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/1P6ZeYd...

Podcast: https://therollup.co/category/podcast

Follow Rob on X: https://x.com/robbieklages

Follow Andy on X: https://x.com/andyyy

Join our TG group: https://t.me/+TsM1CRpWFgk1NGZh

The Rollup Disclosures: https://goodidea.ventures

SVRN CEO: NEAR is Hitting On Revenue, Privacy, And AI At Once Jun 05, 2026

Show notes

Sal Ternullo joins this episode of AI Supercycle and breaks down why NEAR is a very unique asset in digital assets right now, how intents are building toward a real-economy TAM that dwarfs crypto-to-crypto swaps, and why the path to NEAR going deflationary is closer than the market thinks. The institutional inbound is at record levels, and the market is finally catching up, or so he says.

Sal Ternullo is CEO of SVRN, a development company dedicated to growing the NEAR Protocol ecosystem.

The Rollup is where the leaders of digital assets and finance converge. Live from the financial capital of the world.

Timestamps

00:49 Institutional Inbound Explained

02:28 Bitcoin Negative Correlation

04:35 NEAR Investment Thesis Evolution

06:16 NEAR AI Stack

08:29 Bear Case And Risks

09:56 Venice Integration Breakdown

11:27 Path To Deflation

14:18 Intents Fee Model Analysis

15:51 Fee Structure Vs Volume

17:46 Confidential Intents Premium

19:42 Token Buyback Pre-Commitment

Guest Socials:

Sal Ternullo X: https://x.com/sal_ternullo

SVRN X: https://x.com/svrn_ai

SVRN Website: https://svrn.net/

Partners:

Better than Banks. Transparent capital efficiency earning the highest yields in DeFi. Learn more here: https://infinifi.xyz/

---

APYX - Enhanced Digital Credit Yield, Onchain | On Track to Become the Largest Holder of STRC. https://apyx.fi/

---

Dinari - Over 230 1:1 backed tokenized stocks, ETFs & more with dividends. US-based SEC transfer agent. Available on 5+ chains & via API. https://dinari.com/

---

Relay is the fastest and most reliable way to swap any token on any chain. Learn more here: https://relay.link/bridge

---

Zama is an open source cryptography company that builds state-of-the-art Fully Homomorphic Encryption (FHE) solutions for blockchain.

Learn more here: https://www.zama.org/

---

Trezor is the creator of the first-ever hardware wallet. Securing crypto for 2M+ users worldwide. 100% open source.

Learn more here: https://affil.trezor.io/aff_c?offer_id=133&aff_id=36664

---

Website: https://therollup.co/

Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/1P6ZeYd...

Podcast: https://therollup.co/category/podcast

Follow Rob on X: https://x.com/robbieklages

Follow Andy on X: https://x.com/andyyy

Join our TG group: https://t.me/+TsM1CRpWFgk1NGZh

The Rollup Disclosures: https://goodidea.ventures

Why PURR The Most Asymmetric Bet In The World (Entire Thesis) - Capital Flows & Jaymes Rosenthal Jun 02, 2026

Show notes

Capital Flows and Jaymes Rosenthal join The Rollup to discuss how the PUR gamma squeeze is already happening.

Capital Flows and Jaymes Rosenthal are macro traders and HyperLiquid analysts.

The Rollup is where the leaders of digital assets and finance converge. Live from the financial capital of the world.

Timestamps

00:00 Intro And Disclosures

01:04 Capital Flows Macro Background

04:37 Jaymes Poker To Trading

06:09 GameStop Style Squeeze Thesis

07:23 Credit Cycle Context Explained

09:01 HYPE Up Bitcoin Down

10:39 PUR Best HL Expression

11:53 Goldman Skipped The ETF

12:09 Gamma Squeeze Mechanics Explained

15:07 PUR Meme Potential Explained

17:53 Gamma Squeeze 101

22:14 ETFs Dilute PUR Options?

24:14 PUR vs ETF Active Management

28:55 Bitcoin Not Cooperating Question

32:07 Bitcoin's Burden Of Proof

37:11 HL vs CME ICE Cboe

41:17 WSJ Calls HL Convenience Store

44:39 Wall Of Capital Coming

Guest Socials:

Capital Flows X: https://x.com/Globalflows

Jaymes Rosenthal X: https://x.com/jaymesrosenthal

Partners:

Better than Banks. Transparent capital efficiency earning the highest yields in DeFi. Learn more here: https://infinifi.xyz/

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APYX - Enhanced Digital Credit Yield, Onchain | On Track to Become the Largest Holder of STRC. https://apyx.fi/

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Dinari - Over 230 1:1 backed tokenized stocks, ETFs & more with dividends. US-based SEC transfer agent. Available on 5+ chains & via API. https://dinari.com/

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Relay is the fastest and most reliable way to swap any token on any chain. Learn more here: https://relay.link/bridge

---

Zama is an open source cryptography company that builds state-of-the-art Fully Homomorphic Encryption (FHE) solutions for blockchain.

Learn more here: https://www.zama.org/

---

Trezor is the creator of the first-ever hardware wallet. Securing crypto for 2M+ users worldwide. 100% open source.

Learn more here: https://affil.trezor.io/aff_c?offer_id=133&aff_id=36664

---

Website: https://therollup.co/

Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/1P6ZeYd...

Podcast: https://therollup.co/category/podcast

Follow Rob on X: https://x.com/robbieklages

Follow Andy on X: https://x.com/andyyy

Join our TG group: https://t.me/+TsM1CRpWFgk1NGZh

The Rollup Disclosures: https://goodidea.ventures

Joseph Chalom: The Ethereum Bull Thesis in 2026 (Why Now) May 30, 2026

Show notes

Joseph Chalom explains why ETH is not dead.

Joseph Chalom is CEO of SharpLink, the second largest corporate ETH holder.

The Rollup is where the leaders of digital assets and finance converge. Live from the financial capital of the world.

Timestamps

00:00 ETH Is Not Dead

01:16 Second Largest ETH Holder

02:33 Ethereum Wins The Scoreboard

04:20 Step Function Moment Coming

04:45 The Jeff Bezos Analogy

06:42 EFF Not The Marketing Arm

10:04 Private Sector Must Step Up

12:39 Warren Buffett Capitulation Thesis

13:22 BlackRock Doubled Down At FTX

15:44 WTI Crude Predicts Bitcoin

16:49 Best Entry Point Right Now

22:01 160M Agent Payments Q1

24:50 Institutions Need Finality Not Speed

25:02 BlackRock Tokenizing $8B Fund

30:32 Fidelity Now Largest Investor

33:19 First DeFi In Public Company

35:41 Retail Capitulation Best Entry

Guest Socials:

Joseph Chalom X: https://x.com/joechalom

Sharplink X: https://x.com/Sharplink

Sharplink Website: https://www.sharplink.com/

Partners:

Better than Banks. Transparent capital efficiency earning the highest yields in DeFi. Learn more here: https://infinifi.xyz/

---

APYX - Enhanced Digital Credit Yield, Onchain | On Track to Become the Largest Holder of STRC. https://apyx.fi/

---

Dinari - Over 230 1:1 backed tokenized stocks, ETFs & more with dividends. US-based SEC transfer agent. Available on 5+ chains & via API. https://dinari.com/

---

Relay is the fastest and most reliable way to swap any token on any chain. Learn more here: https://relay.link/bridge

---

Zama is an open source cryptography company that builds state-of-the-art Fully Homomorphic Encryption (FHE) solutions for blockchain.

Learn more here: https://www.zama.org/

---

Trezor is the creator of the first-ever hardware wallet. Securing crypto for 2M+ users worldwide. 100% open source.

Learn more here: https://affil.trezor.io/aff_c?offer_id=133&aff_id=36664

---

Website: https://therollup.co/

Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/1P6ZeYd...

Podcast: https://therollup.co/category/podcast