New Churches Podcast

Latest Episodes:

Sabbaticals for Church Planting Pastors Apr 12, 2022

Show notes

Episode 657: As pastoral work has in recent years grown more difficult, sabbaticals seem to be a growing trend. Host Clint Clifton discusses the need for, value of and different approaches to sabbaticals with Jessica Thompson, director of operations for the New City church planting network, and Colby Garman, teaching pastor at Pillar Church in Dumfries, Virginia.

In This Episode, You’ll Discover:

Different reasons for needing to take a sabbatical
Various goals for and approaches to engaging in a sabbatical
How a sabbatical changes a pastor’s perspective upon returning to ministry
The role sabbatical plays in modeling healthy rest for a congregation
Ways taking a sabbatical can help other staff members

Helpful Resources:

Podcast: Symptoms of burnout
Interested in learning more? Check out our Church Planting Primer
Are you ready to enroll in our Church Planting Masterclass?

Please subscribe to the podcast and leave a rating and review on iTunes.

Sharable Quotes (#NewChurches):

It feels like sabbaticals are a growing trend. To me, it seems to correspond with the growing difficulty of pastoral work, the rate in which people are falling out of pastoral work. @ClintJClifton

For whatever reason, a lot of people are looking around at pastors, pastoral ministry, and going, “There’s a lot of wreckage, and are there any ways we can somehow stem the tide of that wreckage?” @Colby Garman

I think, society, as a whole, is placing more emphasis on mental health. How are you doing emotionally, mentally? And recognizing that is important. – Jessica Thompson

Maybe a generation or two before us, or maybe even me, earlier in my pastoral ministry career, viewed things pretty two-dimensionally. Now, I think I recognize there’s a lot more to people than meets the eye. @ClintJClifton

There’s been a lot of criticism for how millennials think about work. We grow up with a mindset that we’re laborers almost first and foremost. What can we accomplish, and what can we get out? Some people are looking around, going, “I don’t think that’s having great results.” @Colby Garman

Everybody does sabbaticals differently. A lot of times Sabbaticals result from signs of burnout. Some are policy driven. In our case, we thought, “This is a way to be a blessing, something proactive that we think might rejuvenate him and his family.” @ClintJClifton

I think there’s a reluctance on a pastor’s part to take sabbaticals. They think, “Well, I shouldn’t need it. Burning out for Jesus. Who’s got time for a sabbatical?” Then, if they took it, they didn’t feel like they were truly gone. – Jessica Thompson

One of the things I learned was that I was more tired than I thought I was. It took some time to recognize that. @Colby Garman

Some things can’t be renewed without taking time to think about them, to process them. The space and time for reflection helped me look at some things I wanted to strengthen that I didn’t even realize I needed to. @Colby Garman

Often, when I’m thinking about somebody going away on sabbatical, I’m thinking, “There’s a good chance they’re going to come back with a fresh perspective, or a fresh energy, for the work that’s going to be really beneficial to the organization long-term.” @ClintJClifton

I’ve seen people come back with a fresh perspective. It’s also a great time for a reset. It gave a chance to not fall back into the same patterns you had before. – Jessica Thompson

It’s a complicated thing, coming back, because that time, whatever shaping takes place, it’s going on outside the system. I’m thinking, “What should be different?” That means some shifting. @Colby Garman

We also see that some people just don’t come back. They might for a short amount of time, but they realize they don’t want to go back and do what they did before. It has a lot to do with where somebody’s at when they go on sabbatical. @Colby Garman

When a sabbatical is needed, one of the signs you will see is a general sense of apathy or irritability. Everything is frustrating. You’re not really a joy to be around. – Jessica Thompson

I’ve seen pastors who have a sense of guilt in leaving to take their Sabbatical. “I get this break, and the people doing ministry and church work around me don’t.” – Jessica Thompson

The burden of leadership and exercising your gifts and responsibilities wears you out. @Colby Garman

I heard Sean Sears say one time, “The best way to get refreshed is to get really tired doing something else.” @ClintJClifton

If you are weary before a sabbatical, there’s a thought that the sabbatical’s going to fix that. Some people don’t need a sabbatical. They need to learn how to have good rest rhythms in the flow of life and time. @Colby Garman

In saying, “I need it,” you are modeling, for your congregation and your leaders, how important rest is. – Jessica Thompson

It’s an act of rebellion for us to think things always depend on us and to work ourselves into the ground. That level of hard work doesn’t serve our congregations. @Colby Garman

If you’re considering asking for a sabbatical, you should commit to pray consistently for that before you ever broach the subject with a leader in your church. There’s a lot of landmines around that. @ClintJClifton

I would encourage you to be in close enough community with some other leaders in your church that they recognize those things about you early on. @ClintJClifton

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The Forgotten Office: Deacons Apr 07, 2022

Show notes

Episode 656: With most churches now starting with multiple-pastor, multiple-elders models, a de-emphasis on the role of deacons has occurred. Host Clint Clifton interviews Matt Smethurst, author of Deacons: How They Serve and Strengthen the Church, about the value of deacons and dangers to be considered when implementing the diaconate in a church plant.

In This Episode, You’ll Discover:

What church planters should know from church history about deacons
How churches often wrongly inflate or reduce the role of deacons
How a church planter should prioritize establishing a diaconate
What dangers a planter should consider when looking for qualified deacons
Matt’s advice for church planters on women serving as deacons
The most overlooked responsibility of a deacon

Helpful Resources:

Matt’s book: Deacons: How They Serve and Strengthen the Church
Mark Dever’s book: A Display of God’s Glory
Interested in learning more? Check out our Church Planting Primer
Are you ready to enroll in our Church Planting Masterclass?

Please subscribe to the podcast and leave a rating and review on iTunes.

Sharable Quotes (#NewChurches):

Most churches now are starting with multiple pastors, multiple elders, and in all of that ecclesiological shifting, as good as it is, there has been this de-emphasis on deaconing and on the role of deacons in church plants. @ClintJClifton

Deacons were a bold and bright witness to the gospel among the earliest Christians. That’s been detailed by secular historians and it’s really stirring to read some of those stories. @MattSmethurst

As the church began to become more hierarchical, the role of deacon shifted from being practical carers for the poor to being almost secretaries to the bishop. It was in the Reformation that the diaconate was restored to more of its biblical office. @MattSmethurst

The main thing I’d want a church planter to understand just from the history of deacons is that they’re very easy to get wrong. @MattSmethurst

There are a lot of ways to get deacons wrong, but they can be summarized in two ditches. One is to wrongly elevate the role of deacon to that of a de facto elder. On the other hand, sometimes the role of deacon is wrongly reduced to that of a glorified janitor. @MattSmethurst

I always thought it’s fascinating that the role that’s designated for service in the Bible has so many spiritual qualifications associated with it. The world says that kind of job is reserved for the person who doesn’t necessarily possess any qualities like that. @ClintJClifton

The reason, church planter, you should consider implementing deacons in your church is not just because it has some practical use. It’s because God is wiser than we are. @MattSmethurst

It’s one of those things that, once you see it, it’s hard to unsee. @MattSmethurst

The reason you should care about deacons is because the Bible does. Yes, it’s it’s useful, but it’s not true because it’s useful. It’s useful because it’s true. @MattSmethurst

I don’t think there’s a hard and fast timeline a planter has to operate according to when it comes to when he implements deacons. @MattSmethurst

You can have a church without elders but you can’t biblically have a church without members. We wanted to get elders in place and then, as needs arise, create diaconal positions that would help facilitate and accelerate the ministry of the Word. @MattSmethurst

There’s so much confusion for church planters around “When’s the right time to bring this in?” I try to lay out a suggested path: It starts with settling the doctrine, the church covenant, membership, eldership, diaconate. @ClintJClifton

As a complementarian, if you are in a church where deacons are functioning like elders, then you shouldn’t install women into the office. You first need to figure out what it means to be a deacon and what it means to be an elder. @MattSmethurst

A church impoverishes itself if it forbids what the Bible allows. @MattSmethurst

If you ever have someone say, “Well, women deacons, that’s a liberal move.” Well, say that to Charles Spurgeon and John Calvin and Tertullian. It’s not a product of our modern American gender debates. @MattSmethurst

In the Bible, we have a 1 Timothy 2:12, which forbids the office of elder to women, but we don’t have a 1 Timothy equivalent for the office of deacon. @MattSmethurst

When it The hardest situations with deacons are not in a church planting context. It’s in a more revitalization context, where a guy is inheriting a situation where deacons run the place and they’ve been misunderstood and misdeployed for years. @MattSmethurst

Deacons have in our lifetimes never been as needed or as useful, because pastors are beleaguered. This is why the diaconate exists: to make your life easier, not harder. @MattSmethurst

A Mark Dever book called “A Display of God’s Glory” describes deacons as mufflers and shock absorbers. They’re given to the church to be a balm, to bring about peace and and to smooth the way so the ministry of the Word in prayer can prevail. @ClintJClifton

If you have someone in your church who loves to push the drama button, that person is not yet ready to be a deacon. A deacon should be the person where conflict and gossip go to die. @MattSmethurst

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The ‘Zero Year’ Apr 05, 2022

Show notes

Episode 655: The “Zero Year” is the time of preparation that leads up to the church plant. Host Clint Clifton interviews Matt Smethurst, planter of a brand-new church in Richmond, Virginia, about the various “Zero Year” factors that moved him into position to start his plant.

In This Episode, You’ll Discover:

How God first started to “mess with” Matt about planting a church in RIchmond
The way intentionally planting during the pandemic affected Matt’s decision-making process and the timing of the plant
What training, materials and resources he found helpful
Two things that most prepared Matt to be a church planter

Helpful Resources:

Tim Keller essay: Why Plant Churches?
Keller book: Center Church
9 Marks church planting resources
Ed Stetzer book: Planting Missional Churches
Tom Bernardo book: The Honest Guide to Church Planting
Free ebook: Church Planting Thresholds
Free course: Developing a Core Team
Interested in learning more? Check out our Church Planting Primer
Are you ready to enroll in our Church Planting Masterclass?

Please subscribe to the podcast and leave a rating and review on iTunes.

Sharable Quotes (#NewChurches):

The “Zero Year” is a time of preparation that leads up to the church plant. Sometimes this is spent in a church planting residency. Sometimes it’s focused on fundraising. And sometimes it’s just it’s all the logistical stuff. It’s just simply moving to the place that you’re going to plant a church. @ClintJClifton

When I started looking at some of the demographic trends, it became clear that Richmond is growing at twice the rate of both the state of Virginia and the nation as a whole. Just that population growth and the gospel need gave us just a real heart for the place. @MattSmethurst

One mistake church planters sometimes make is to use data alone to make the decision about where they will go. But I think there is a part of church planting that, especially because you’re going to settle into a place for a really long time, it’s got to be a place you really want to be. @ClintJClifton

Two-thirds of our people are not coming from other Richmond churches. They have moved to Richmond within the past two years, and that means they haven’t really been able to put down deep roots in a community, in a church. In that regard, the timing of this church plant is is really ideal. @MattSmethurst

In my mind – and I think this is true theologically and biblically – I feel like I’m going from the supply line to the frontline in the kingdom of God. Organizations like TGC are at their best when they don’t understand themselves to be the tip of the spear in terms of kingdom advance, but understand themselves to be equipping and resourcing those who are at you know on the front lines. @MattSmethurst

I’m 38 and not 28, and I think it has helped me come into this knowing who I am and also who I’m not, and therefore what my church is going to be like and what it’s not. I’m I’m not under the impression that I or River City Baptist Church can be all things to all people. @MattSmethurst

At the end of the day, ministry is about shepherding. @MattSmethurst

It’s actually arrogant to assume you don’t need training. Anointing yourself to just go plant a church in a vacuum is a little bit like baptizing yourself. @MattSmethurst

If you’re a Type A, Alpha Male entrepreneur with an idea a minute and you can carry a crowd, that does not qualify you to plant a church. Do you love God’s people? Are you a shepherd? Do you want to feed them with the word of God and not just the ideas of man? @MattSmethurst

I’m a perfectionist, an optimizer. I’m always wanting to tinker and tweak and improve. But one of my fellow elders keeps reminding me that we need to play the 30-year game. We don’t have to have this well-oiled machine hitting on all cylinders from the very first week. Apple didn’t start by releasing the iPhone 6, right? In other words, start basic and, as God provides, you can add other things. @MattSmethurst

I always tell church planters, “Act your age.” Because they come out of the gate wanting to have everything. One of the byproducts of acting your age, though, is to focus on the main thing, and the most obvious main thing, the biggest feature of this new church, is going to be your Sunday morning gathering. @ClintJClifton

Now there will be repercussions. People will say, “Oh, you don’t have a youth group.” You’re going to have to let people come and leave because you don’t have all the services they think are necessary, but that is better than trying to provide all those things when you’re not equipped. @ClintJClifton

The post The ‘Zero Year’ appeared first on New Churches.

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The 'Zero Year' Apr 05, 2022

Show notes

In This Episode, You’ll Discover:

How God first started to “mess with” Matt about planting a church in RIchmond
The way intentionally planting during the pandemic affected Matt’s decision-making process and the timing of the plant
What training, materials and resources he found helpful
Two things that most prepared Matt to be a church planter

Helpful Resources:

Tim Keller essay: Why Plant Churches?
Keller book: Center Church
9 Marks church planting resources
Ed Stetzer book: Planting Missional Churches
Tom Bernardo book: The Honest Guide to Church Planting
Free ebook: Church Planting Thresholds
Free course: Developing a Core Team
Interested in learning more? Check out our Church Planting Primer
Are you ready to enroll in our Church Planting Masterclass?

Please subscribe to the podcast and leave a rating and review on iTunes.

Sharable Quotes (#NewChurches):

At the end of the day, ministry is about shepherding. @MattSmethurst

It’s actually arrogant to assume you don’t need training. Anointing yourself to just go plant a church in a vacuum is a little bit like baptizing yourself. @MattSmethurst

Reaching People Far from God Mar 31, 2022

Show notes

Episode 654: Many church planters set out to reach people with the gospel but often find their new churches full of folks from other churches. Host Ed Stetzer discusses the challenge of staying outwardly focused to reach people far from God with Heiden Ratner, senior pastor of Walk Church, and Vance Pitman, founding pastor of Hope Church, both in Las Vegas.

In This Episode, You’ll Discover:

How to get a core team outwardly focused on reaching people who are not churched or not believers
How God used Heiden’s “idolatry problem with basketball” to draw him to faith in Christ
How a “divine appointment” gave Heiden an opportunity to meet a well-known UFC fighter and how they are trading text messages about faith
What personal practices can help planters be more evangelistic and engaging people who don’t know Christ
The best ways to help new believers grow in their faith and become fully devoted followers of Christ

Helpful Free Resources:

Please subscribe to the podcast and leave a rating and review on iTunes.

Sharable Quotes (#NewChurches):

One of the things you can do is plant a church where there aren’t that many church people. If you come to a place like Vegas, Seattle, Portland, Denver, at least 90% of the population doesn’t go to church anywhere. It’s a target-rich environment for church planting, because there’s so many unchurched people. @VancePitman

It starts with a city perspective. Too many church planters have their heart wrapped around a church, but there’s nowhere in the Bible that Jesus said, “Go plant a church.” He said to go into cities and nations and make disciples. When we do that, churches are born as a byproduct. @VancePitman

If our goal is not to grow a church but to penetrate the lostness of the city, as we teach and preach and disciple, we’ll keep that in front of our people. @VancePitman

Here’s a very practical tip for this idea of building bridges into the city: Every city has a city manager and every city manager has a list of problems on their desk that’s their responsibility to solve. Go meet your city manager, build a relationship, find out what of those items on that list you can take off the list. @VancePitman

Those relational bridges introduce you to lost people in the community, who begin to see Christ in a different way because of your compassion, your service and your love. And they’re attracted to the gospel you’re presenting. @VancePitman

Planters also need to develop personal relationships. They have to think of themselves not as pastors of churches but as missionaries in cities and look for ways to build relationships and engage people with gospel conversations. @VancePitman

Our team didn’t do “together stuff” early on. I told them, “Your job when you get here is to get in a neighborhood and start building relationships. Look for places to connect your kids and build relationships. I challenged them to build their relationships outside of our group so their focus wasn’t our group. @VancePitman

It’s about building the relational equity that allows you to have conversations. If you’ll build a little bit of relational equity, everybody’s dying to get to know people and hear their story. That would immediately allow me to tell my story of Jesus and my life. @VancePitman

The other practical thing I’ve done is to leverage my hobbies. When I was a dad of young kids, coaching was a part of my hobbies and and I leveraged that. Now I’m a foodie and so I have a restaurant ministry. I go back to the same restaurants in Las Vegas and I’ve got several people that I’ve led to Christ who were either servers or managers. @VancePitman

Somebody recently asked me who I wanted to reach with our church. I just said I want to reach me as a high school young adult that was just totally unengaged, on my way to hell without knowing it. @HeidenRatner

I love the Major Ian Thomas quote: “The same life Jesus lived, he lives now through us.” If we’re allowing Christ to live in and through us, he’s focused on lost people. He’s seeking. He’s saving. @HeidenRatner

We need new eyes as planters. We get so focused on the work and we miss the people in the process. There’s people everywhere, people all around our city. And so I pray, “Lord, help me see who you want me to see.” @HeidenRatner

We encourage people to not be home alone. Don’t be Kevin McCallister. We believe that the best way for you to grow is in the context of community. And so we love small groups at our church. It’s part of our culture where people are coming to know Christ and it feels weird if they’re not in a group. @HeidenRatner

That’s been huge for new believers in our church to be a part of a group, a part of a family. Discipleship has to happen in community. @HeidenRatner

Engaging adults who don’t know Christ leads to some messy challenges, but we must encourage people to still value that. @EdStetzer

In churches, we wind up, if we’re not careful, with these people that come to Christ and then all of a sudden we’ve created this subculture of Christianity within our culture and we live in our own bubble. Yes, it’s messy when you when you reach people in a place like Vegas. But it’s also pure. There is a purity about the gospel from these new believers that is contagious. @VancePitman

What are the most important factors in spiritual maturity for those who are new to the faith? @EdStetzer

D.L. Moody once said that weekly church attendance is like blood to the person who is sick. It’s fresh. It’s moving. I just want to encourage that. @HeidenRatner

For the new believer, getting in the Word until the Word gets in you. @HeidenRatner

Just an authenticity to be yourself, not feeling like you have to be somebody else in their walk with Christ. Be you. Everybody’s got a unique leaning, unique wiring, and so we’re trying to help people champion the things that make you be authentically you in the body of Christ, and you’ll find your fit. @HeidenRatner

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Church Multiplication in ‘Sin City’ Mar 29, 2022

Show notes

Episode 653: Planting a church is challenging enough, but when your city is almost-completely unchurched, the task is truly daunting. Vance Pitman, founding pastor of Hope Church in Las Vegas, and Heiden Ratner, senior pastor of Walk Church in the same city, share their church-planting experiences with host Ed Stetzer.

In This Episode, You’ll Discover:

How Vance Pitman and his wife wound up planting a church in Las Vegas
Why the Pitmans were able to bring a team of 13 families with them to launch the church
The importance of helping a relocating team to think like missionaries, not like church members
How Henry Blackaby’s Experiencing God tool helped launch Hope Church
What’s going on missiologically in Las Vegas
Why many church planters abandon their plans for multiplication
Some initial steps to start building a culture of multiplication in your church

Helpful Resources:

Article: 10 Signs a Church Leader Will Multiply
Article: Why Your Ministry Needs to Multiply
Interested in learning more? Check out our Church Planting Primer
Are you ready to enroll in our Church Planting Masterclass?

Please subscribe to the podcast and leave a rating and review on iTunes.

Sharable Quotes (#NewChurches):

You shouldn’t be out there planting without the support of a network. Let me encourage you to visit sendnetwork.com to learn about the benefits of cooperating along with a family of multiplying leaders all over North America. @EdStetzer

Where I’m from, people didn’t go to Las Vegas and, if they did, they didn’t tell anybody. People didn’t think Las Vegas is hell, but they think you can smell it from there. @VancePitman

We believe, convictionally, that churches plant churches; individuals don’t, networks don’t, denominations don’t. @VancePitman

I was convinced that the best way to plant a church was in teams. Paul is the greatest missionary church planner in the New Testament, and every time you read Paul’s name in the Bible, it’s followed by another word, “and.” Paul never went anywhere by himself. @VancePitman

People heard the activity of God in our story and what attracted them was the opportunity to leverage their life to join in the activity of God in a place where they could use their job skill and passion where they live work and play to live on mission. @VancePitman

I wish I’d known what I know now about “detoxing” our team before getting to our city, to think not like church members but like missionaries. @VancePitman

People often don’t realize that when you bring a group of people who have a common church experience into a culture that doesn’t have that, this is going to be cross-cultural in many ways for the people. @EdStetzer

I knew how to pastor a church but when I got to Las Vegas, I didn’t have one and so it was purely desperation. We had basic training. It was one day of training, and assessment was where they checked my pulse to see if I was alive. @VancePitman

When I got to Las Vegas, there was no Hope Church there planting churches I could partner with. We were starting literally with nothing, but the beauty of that is it produced a desperation. @VancePitman

We spent the first five months simply prayer-walking 50,000 households. We had three different churches pray over every name in the Las Vegas phone book. We started going back into those communities where we prayed and doing acts of service. @VancePitman

We began to make disciples. I think one huge mistake many church planters make is they launch too early, thinking the service is going to draw the disciples, when you need to make disciples and churches are born as a byproduct. @VancePitman

I challenge pastors all the time that if your church doesn’t look like your community, there’s a missiological issue with how you’re taking the gospel to the city. @VancePitman

When you get into a context that is multi-ethnic, you’re just part of the diversity. I just finished an interim in New York City. Nobody there is a local; everyone’s from somewhere else. It’s a wonderful opportunity. @EdStetzer

A lot of times we hear Las Vegas is “the city of sin,” but we like to say it’s “the city of Him.” God is at work in Las Vegas in some very real, tangible, fresh ways. @HeidenRatner

I think a lot of people are deterred by one street – Las Vegas Boulevard, and sin is definitely most glorified on this one street. But outside of Las Vegas Boulevard, this is a really big city: 2.6 million people, and 92% are unchurched. @HeidenRatner

I find a lot of people are waiting for an invite, waiting for somebody to have something compelling. Invite me to something. Give me an opportunity to know this Jesus. @HeidenRatner

Evangelism is key. I’ve sensed there’s really a hunger for something more. A lot of people are settling. Just give me something better. That’s one of the reasons why church planting in our city should be high on our priority list. @HeidenRatner

It does seem that, as the modern experiment is failing, people around the world are realizing that we’re not on a sustainable path. There’s just a brokenness all around and it’s a wonderful opportunity for us to point people to Jesus. @EdStetzer

Hope Church is the first church I was able to see multiplication modeled. As for Walk Church, it’s in our DNA. We are a church that was sent out by a sending church, hearing multiplication not just preached but lived out. @HeidenRatner

What we knew was if we’re going to plant a church, we’ve got to plan another church. We started by saying OK in our budget. We started putting prayer toward it from the very beginning. @HeidenRatner

There’s a kingdom collaboration emphasis in our city. If 92% are not going to church, there’s a whole lot of people to reach. So we’re championing each other, even across denominational lines. @HeidenRatner

We’re trying to say, “Hey, let’s win the city and the way we’re going to do that is through planting new, vibrant, evangelistic churches.” @HeidenRatner

I think many planters substitute the tool for the goal. The goal is not churches being planted; the goal is the kingdom of God being expanded in cities and nations all over the earth. @VancePitman

The local church is a temporary tool established by Jesus for the expansion of His kingdom. Every church Paul planted is dead and gone, but the kingdom is alive and well. @VancePitman

If we’re really going to penetrate lostness in the city, one church cannot do that by itself. But as we multiply the church, we can genuinely see the kingdom. @VancePitman

Call out the called. Somebody may not know they could do this and a word of affirmation from a key leader could spur them to think about planting. Not enough people are thinking about it. @HeidenRatner

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Symptoms of Burnout Mar 24, 2022

Show notes

Episode 652: What should a church planter do who’s at the soul level of tired? Host Ed Stetzer discusses the symptoms of ministry burnout with Jessica Thompson, director of operations for the New City church planting network, and James Hobson, lead pastor of Hill City Community Church in Lynchburg, Virginia.

In This Episode, You’ll Discover:

Five symptoms of burnout and how they manifest themselves in ministry settings
Two kinds of exhaustion
Three different types of friends needed for healthy ministry
How burnout manifests itself in a planter or his team’s life
Why pastors need to be in tune the connection between spiritual and physical health

Helpful Resources:

Chris Ash’s book, Zeal without Burnout
Ed Stetzer and Warren Bird’s book, Viral Churches
Book: The Body Keeps the Score
Interested in learning more? Check out our Church Planting Primer
Are you ready to enroll in our Church Planting Masterclass?

Please subscribe to the podcast and leave a rating and review on iTunes.

Sharable Quotes (#NewChurches):

I’ve walked through seasons of burnout. Actually, at one point during Covid, I had to step away for a couple of days and regroup. @EdStetzer

Warren Bird says, “We must not allow ourselves to slip into a false spirituality that treats our bodily existence as if it can be separated from our so-called spiritual life, as if our spiritual life carries on independently from what’s happening in our bodies.” @EdStetzer

There’s a lot of bodies on the side of the road to church planting that burned out and didn’t recover, didn’t make it through the long haul. @EdStetzer

The reality is it’s challenging as a church planter. You need to be able to notice when you’re feeling burned out and have nowhere to go for encouragement or fulfillment or sustainability. @EdStetzer

When my friend Darren Patrick died, that was just too much for me. I wept for a day and into a second day. I realized I had pushed too far for too long and went to my doctor. We made some lifestyle changes. @EdStetzer

There’s the kind of tired that sleep can’t fix, and that’s where I was – a tiredness of the soul. @EdStetzer

Ideally, the best thing to do is to set up some strategies to maybe not quite get to burnout. Prevention would be great, but we’re all going to go through seasons of ministry that are just all-encompassing. – Jessica Thompson

It’s going to take a reset if you’re to that point where you’re just exhausted. It’s going to take sleep – actual sleep – and rest. – Jessica Thompson

Only you can know what revives you, those things your spirit feels revived in. It’s going to be intentionally resetting your life and adjusting the parameters that got you to that spot. – Jessica Thompson

We had no choice over Covid; it just smacked all of us. But what got to me more was the murder of George Floyd. There were moments I would weep uncontrollably. I’m so tired I can’t even go to sleep. It was the good news of the gospel of Jesus that kept my sanity in that moment. – James Hobson

Let’s do some preventive things, but sometimes burnout just slaps us in the face. If it wasn’t for my faith – a deep-rooted sense that it’s not my works for Jesus but Jesus works for me – I don’t know if I would have been kept. It was hard to stay together in that time. – James Hobson

Ultimately, it’s key for all of us to find out what self-awareness looks like. @EdStetzer

Church planting has always been a very social role. It’s always required a lot of us externally. Often the first symptom of ministry burnout is a loss of desire to be with people. – Jessica Thompson

If someone on the church planting team is rushing to his or her car to get away, that desire to be isolated is part of just being tired of people. When that becomes a reality, when there’s a growing resentment toward other people and desire to get away from them, that’s a cause for for concern. @EdStetzer

My 9-to-5 job is me being an extrovert, and I became an introvert but didn’t realize it. So, for me, all my relational energy is done so I’m going home. However, my wife who stays at home – we just had a baby – is like, “Hey, I’m I’m ready for us to go out.” And now I’m in the doghouse! – James Hobson

The only thing that sustains you in ministry is sustainable sacrifice. Burnout isn’t always all bad, but it needs to be the difference between a godly sacrifice that requires burnout and sacrifice that’s sustainable over time. – Jessica Thompson

One of my elders at a church plant said, “You know, it seems you’re on edge a lot.” He could speak into my life. So irritability can be a sign of burnout and, in general, that can hinder your spiritual growth. @EdStetzer

Out of these five symptoms, irritability is the one that almost causes the most external damage. A lot of these other symptoms are happening internally, but irritability is one that real quickly manifests itself in the life of the people around you. – Jessica Thompson

Irritability can taint your ministry really quickly. – Jessica Thompson

Growing up, I never heard the term “burnout.” I didn’t know what it was until I am lying in bed and just can’t move, and we’ve got service tonight and I’m really stressing out because I’m not there. – James Hobson

When I look back at that earlier church plant, I wish my lead planter or supervisor would have seen irritability in me and said, “Hey, James, why don’t you take the night off? Why don’t you you take the week off?” – James Hobson

When you’re on the edge of burnout, small things become big things. – James Hobson

The final symptom of burnout is sickness. Do you think most pastors are in tune with the connection between their spiritual and physical health? – Jessica Thompson

Send this episode to somebody and give them a hint, because this is a very real issue. @EdStetzer

We know and science shows us that stress, anxiety, all these things have a physical manifestation. The body keeps count. @EdStetzer

Realize your limitations and that those are God-given limitations. @EdStetzer

Psalm 29:11 says “The Lord gives strength to his people. The Lord blesses his people with peace.” Many times we can easily forget that God is our strength. – James Hobson

Only God can fill us. If you ever just need a reminder of why you’re doing what you’re doing for the Lord, maybe the season is difficult and you’re exhausted, I would encourage you to just read the end of Job and remember how much God can do with the little you are capable of. – Jessica Thompson

It’s being reminded of your salvation and the greatness of the God who loves you. Filling yourself up with truth because the Holy Spirit can fill you right back up. – Jessica Thompson

Church planning is not a “me.” It’s a “we.” @EdStetzer

Sometimes it feels like it’s all dependent upon you; it’s not all dependent upon you. The Lord builds the house and they labor in vain who think otherwise. So my exhortation to you is to recognize the symptoms of burnout. @EdStetzer

Burnout sounds like “It’s done. It’s out burn and out.” I would say that ultimately you can create a pace and a path forward, if you will be aware of your physical limitations, your spiritual need, your relational connectedness. @EdStetzer

Take time to connect with a mentor. If you don’t have one, connect with your denominational leader or church partner. Know that our newchurches.com resources are here to help you finish the long journey. We need you for the long haul. @EdStetzer

The post Symptoms of Burnout appeared first on New Churches.

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Loving Your Family While Planting a Church Mar 22, 2022

Show notes

Episode 651: Planting a church inevitably creates enormous pressures on the planter’s family. Host Ed Stetzer discusses guardrails against those stresses with Jessica Thompson, director of operations for the New City church planting network, and James Hobson, lead pastor of Hill City Community Church in Lynchburg, Virginia.

In This Episode, You’ll Discover:

Guardrails that can make church planting a thriving time for planter families
Four major considerations for a family when planting a church
How a planter can find a healthier relationship with his wife
Warning signs of problems that might be brewing

Helpful Resources:

Interested in learning more? Check out our Church Planting Primer
Are you ready to enroll in our Church Planting Masterclass?

Please subscribe to the podcast and leave a rating and review on iTunes.

Sharable Quotes (#NewChurches):

A lot of time and effort is devoted to getting a church plant up off the ground. It requires a lot of the planter, as well as their family. Sometimes they lean too heavily on the family to fill in gaps where there aren’t staff and volunteers and leaders to help. – Jessica Thompson

Any prospective planter out there. You’re in a church right now. You’re about to finish seminary. I mean this with great seriousness: Don’t plant. Do something else. You want to be a teaching pastor? Just be a teaching pastor. – James Hobson

You want to test your marriage? Plant a church. – James Hobson

When people are coming to your church plant, they’re wanting to see an established church. If you want to plant a church, I pray you and your wife have counted the cost. – James Hobson

I don’t want to raise up or send out any church planters who haven’t fully counted the cost of what it’s gonna take. – James Hobson

When we go through assessments of church planters, not only are we evaluating the planter, but is the wife ready? Is the family engaged and knows what it’s going to take? Because it’s going to be a sacrifice for everybody. – Jessica Thompson

The spouse has to be on board. That is a key reality, because there is a price to be paid. @EdStetzer

One of the things Clint Clifton says all of the time to our planters is, “Stop trying to balance family and ministry. There’s always one that’s out of balance.” Instead of balance, try to blend. How can we find ways to normalize doing ministry with family? – Jessica Thompson

Two things: The planter’s wife doesn’t have to be friends with everybody in the church. And she is not the co-pastor of the church. @EdStetzer

I love when I see a husband and wife functioning and both equally engaged, but don’t impose upon your spouse the expectation you saw someone else’s spouse at some other church plant do. @EdStetzer

I wasn’t emotionally healthy enough to really be honest with my wife about what I did expect of her. I see a great vision statement for your church. What’s the vision statement for your family? I see the next 10 years for our church. What’s the next 10 years for our kids? – James Hobson

Set aside time. Carve out times where you’re focused on family. Be intentional about not letting them get deleted from your calendar. – Jessica Thompson

All of us thrive better under structure, so it might mean making some dinner reservations a couple of weeks out. It may mean signing up to be your kid’s Little League coach so you have to leave work at 5 and go hang out with him. – Jessica Thompson

Institute some things in your life that are going to draw you away from work toward your family. That is just as important as the vision casting and the leadership you’re implementing in your church. – Jessica Thompson

Counseling is not a bad word. I feel like the world is better at this than us. – James Hobson

Counseling is essentially somebody who has a doctorate in everything you’re going through, and they’re gonna give you solid gold – and we’re like, “Nah, I’ll pray about it.” – James Hobson

If you haven’t made any deposits in your marriage, when you go to withdraw and you’ve got nothing in the account, you’re gonna crumble. – James Hobson

We had what we called a Pastoral Apprentice Team. We required them to go through counseling during that time – and we paid for it – before they went out to plant churches. @EdStetzer

Added stress may reveal existing problems and could also bring new problems. We’ve got to normalize counseling. I probably sacrificed some of our relationship on the altar of ministry. @EdStetzer

Create some healthy boundaries and paths. Prioritize your family as you do this church planting journey. @EdStetzer

The post Loving Your Family While Planting a Church appeared first on New Churches.

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Leading and Loving Difficult Team Members Mar 17, 2022

Show notes

Episode 650: Church leaders, at some point, will have a difficult time with a team member, which can lead to frustration, stress, anxiety or worry. Host Ed Stetzer discusses the challenges of leading difficult team members with Adam Muhtaseb of Redemption City Church in Baltimore and Kathy Litton, who leads NAMB’s planter spouse development team.

In This Episode, You’ll Discover:

What church planters need to remember as they approach conversations with difficult teammates
The value of taking time to identify the strengths and weaknesses of difficult team members
The role different temperaments play in understanding the challenge
What to do when you put someone in a leadership position and things aren’t working well

Sharable Quotes (#NewChurches):

Church planters are not always the easiest folks to work with. By nature, we can be visionary, passionate and determined, which can create a relational strain on the core team. @EdStetzer

The good news is we see this happen in Scripture – planting teams not coming together perfectly. That helps us remember we’re just a bunch of sinners working things out together. – Kathy Litton

Before Jesus sent out the Twelve, he told them to be “wise as serpents and harmless as doves.” Juxtaposing those two concepts strikes us as leaders that we need to walk in grace and truth when we’re leading difficult people. – Kathy Litton

We are the Church of the Living God, and we want a team to be doing the right things. They don’t need all grace and no truth. A leader who’s giving more grace than truth doesn’t deal with issues along the way. – Kathy Litton

We all come at it from a different personality type. We must make sure we’re leading well, in ways that people can receive it. @EdStetzer

We have to consistently be consistent in speaking the truth in love. We also should always be looking for a redemptive outcome. – Kathy Litton

I tend to have bold faith that’s like “Let’s let’s tackle this issue on our team right away.” But I’ve found that’s not always the best approach and sometimes you need to give people time. @Adam_Muhtaseb

Planters overestimate what they can accomplish in two years and underestimate what can be accomplished in 10. @Adam_Muhtaseb

If you will walk alongside people, invest in people, even when you know they have downsides, just like you have downsides, the end result is that they see you vested in them. @EdStetzer

It’s a good thing people don’t all think like me, don’t act like me. And we can actually accept one another. @EdStetzer

It’s not a three-month conversation to help a leader who’s got some rough edges. It takes time, which is both a gift and a necessity in church planting. @EdStetzer

We don’t need clones of ourselves on on our teams. It takes some time to make those not-natural pieces fit together in a puzzle – but it’s worth it. – Kathy Litton

A younger person can reverse-mentor an older person. We just need to be willing to work through and not be thin-skinned about things. – Kathy Litton

I’m a challenge to lead. Like the gospel says, I’m such a challenge that the perfect Son of God had to live a perfect life and die a torturous death in my place to make me unchallenging. So I need to approach this with humility. @Adam_Muhtaseb

The thing I found most challenging, especially the first four years of church planning, was uncommunicated expectations from members on my team. @Adam_Muhtaseb

It can be such a challenge to lead folks who you sense are disappointed with you because you’re not able to be everything they want you to be. @Adam_Muhtaseb

Part of the progression of a church plant is that people – maybe new believers – start taking on some leadership roles and you’re kind of testing them in this place and space. If it grows, great. It connects them to the church so beautifully when they grow they grow into the role. @EdStetzer

Some difficult conversations don’t work and it is not uncommon that person might end up in a different church. That’s not the end of the world, but but you want to help them make that transition. @EdStetzer

Usually people get that It’s not working, and I’ll phrase it as a positive: “What’s next?” rather than “The last thing didn’t work.” I say, “Listen, is there something you think might better align with your gifts or you might have interest in?” @EdStetzer

The hardest part is when they think it’s going great – and it’s not. @EdStetzer

There’s a movie called “We Bought a Zoo.” There’s a line in there about having 20 seconds of insane courage. If you can just muster up 20 seconds of insane courage to say, “You know, it’s just not working,” then the conversation becomes much less awkward. @EdStetzer

I need to give people space. I can draw quick conclusions that aren’t always accurate, and I need to refrain from doing that. I can look back on a couple of people who turned out to be wonderful additions to a team and I had just gotten off on the wrong foot. – Kathy Litton

This is a very tumultuous time relationally for people, and everyone’s on edge, unsure, maybe struggling. Take the time to acknowledge that people are in a relationally more difficult space than they were just two or three years ago. We might need a little more grace than truth. @EdStetzer

Helpful Resources:

Free course: Developing a Core Team
Interested in learning more? Check out our Church Planting Primer
Are you ready to enroll in our Church Planting Masterclass?

Please subscribe to the podcast and leave a rating and review on iTunes.

The post Leading and Loving Difficult Team Members appeared first on New Churches.

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Friendship With Team Members Mar 15, 2022

Show notes

Episode 649: Some people think pastors shouldn’t be friends with members of the congregation. Others think that’s a horrendous statement. Host Ed Stetzer discusses the challenges of having close friendships in church with Adam Muhtaseb of Redemption City Church in Baltimore and Kathy Litton, who leads NAMB’s planter spouse development team.

In This Episode, You’ll Discover:

Why it’s important for church planters to have life-giving friendships with their planting team
Advice about forging friendships with teammates without the perception of favoritism
Cautions about forming deep friendships with those serving on your team
How to “guard your heart” but not close it when friends leave your church
Whether to maintain a relationship when somebody leaves the church

Sharable Quotes (#NewChurches):

When people leave who planted the church with you – and inevitably people leave – you’ve done life together and that is hard. Friendships with team and staff members is even more complex. @EdStetzer

It’s imperative that leaders have friends on our team, but some of the things I’ve learned the hard way have made me more wise, more cautious, more understanding. Spiritual maturity and wisdom have a lot to do with how those friendships turn out in the end. – Kathy Litton

There’s biblical precedent that the people you work with in church planting are not just your friends but your family. In John 15 Jesus says, “You’re not my servants anymore. You’re my friends.” If Jesus says that about some messed-up disciples, I probably can say that about the people I work with. @Adam_Muhtaseb

The end of Romans 16 is an acknowledgement from Paul to his friends, his “beloved,” like “Greet Priscilla and Aquila, my fellow workers in Christ Jesus.” All these people are his friends. @Adam_Muhtaseb

I don’t know how we plant churches biblically without treating the people on our team like family. That being said, however, it’s really hard. @Adam_Muhtaseb

The reality is how much do you reveal? How do you kind of walk through this authenticity, which is necessary for friendship and community, when at the same time your your role is to lead? @EdStetzer

We need to be vulnerable. One of my favorite definitions of vulnerability comes from Paula Reinhardt, where she says vulnerability is a risk we take for a greater good. The greater good is transparency, opening our hearts and building a closer team – just being human as a leader and opening up your heart. – Kathy Litton

Some risk is inherent, because either their poor character or my poor character can at some point mess that up. As my own spiritual maturity has grown over the years, I’ve been able to have more healthy consistent friendships because I wasn’t messing them up with poor character or expecting too much from them. – Kathy Litton

I need their prayers. I need their support. I don’t need them to know all the details of any issue. – Kathy Litton

Having friends in the church really matters, particularly the elders and leaders. We have a deep community, but having friends in the church doesn’t mean I share the business of the church in that particular friendship. @EdStetzer

It takes maturity to not share everything with everybody, but there’s also wisdom in being in community with people as well. @EdStetzer

I don’t think you can make that problem completely go away. You have to have a lot of intentionality to step into their lives and keep the shared DNA of life together. – Kathy Litton

As leaders we need to be very well aware of showing partiality, but we can’t make stuff come out equal all the time. – Kathy Litton

We set an example of what it means to live in community, even in friendships outside the church. If we don’t have the capacity to build relationships outside our congregation, we’re probably not reaching our community very well. – Kathy Litton

If our church members see us at dinner someplace with someone who owns a local business and doesn’t go to our church, that’s a good example of us working hard to to not just swim in the pool of the church family all the time. – Kathy Litton

It starts with the realization that the team members aren’t my employees to build my platform. These are my families. So when I would have coaching meetings, I always start with, “How are you doing? How’s your walk with Jesus?” Just spending time with them has fostered trust and created relational capital. @Adam_Muhtaseb

We also have a phrase at our church: “No one drowns at RCC.” So if anyone feels like they’re drowning, you automatically get a break. I think those types of culture things have created an environment of safety and friendship in the office. @Adam_Muhtaseb

We care about each other and are for each other. I think the challenge comes, though, if you’re an effective church planter, you’re constantly pushing. It’s part of the job. So I’m not just trying to accomplish the goal, I’m also trying to love these people. @Adam_Muhtaseb

Rick Warren told me once that you have to think of pastoring as pastoring a parade. People come into the parade, are there for a while, then they leave the parade. But whenever somebody left the parade that we were super close to, that was hard. @EdStetzer

I can look back at and see how faithful God was to give us relationships with people who came into our lives. The ones who left didn’t diminish the value they gave us while they were there, and they helped shape us in in that time and in that season. – Kathy Litton

We have a set of friends that I call our playfriends. They come over. We don’t talk about anything serious. We play cards. We watch sports. We eat great food. Friends who help you get a break can end up being just as important as the ones that pray for us. – Kathy Litton

Sometimes pastors don’t play very well, but I think the long game is how we need to see those relationships. I can’t protect every friendship and make it last forever. – Kathy Litton

I know there’s going to be some wounds. We don’t have to deny that but but just have confidence that God’s got somebody else or that that relationship could be repaired in the future. – Kathy Litton

People come into our life and come out as leaders. That’s the sovereign hand of God and we have to rest in that. – Kathy Litton

We have to find a way for those goodbyes to be gospel goodbyes. Sometimes they’re hard conversations, but vulnerability and transparency really does matter. It’s going to be a balance that’s different for everybody. @EdStetzer

Helpful Resources:

“Naked Preachers are Distracting” article by William H. Willimon
Free Send Network ebook: Five Markers of Healthy Planting Wives
Interested in learning more? Check out our Church Planting Primer
Are you ready to enroll in our Church Planting Masterclass?

Please subscribe to the podcast and leave a rating and review on iTunes.

The post Friendship With Team Members appeared first on New Churches.

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