CLAREMONT: The Trial

Latest Episodes:

S2E37: The Telephone Question Feb 03, 2020

Show notes

It was a seemingly out-of-the-blue, random question made by defence lawyer Paul Yovich on Day 37 of the trial, but as put by our criminal defence lawyer guest Shane Brennan, it’s a clever one.

That question: In 1996 and 1997, did the PathWest lab - which tested both the Karrakatta rape victim’s and Ciara Glennon’s fingernail samples - have a telephone?

With the follow-up question if the phone had ever been maintained during the late 1990s.

The accused Claremont Serial Killer Bradley Edwards worked for Telstra during that time, and as the podcast team explain, if the defence are trying to prove reasonable doubt through cross contamination, the question about the telephone is ‘clever’.

Our special guest, criminal defence lawyer Shane Brennan, who has more than 42 years’ experience with criminal trials, including murder and DNA, said the defence would try every avenue to prove reasonable doubt.

Hear the discussion with Natalie Bonjolo, Tim Clarke, Damien Cripps and special guest Shane Brennan about the day’s proceedings, plus on the special appearance by WA’s top cop in court on day 37 of WA’s trial of the century.

If you have any questions for the podcast team or any of their guests, send your questions in to claremontpodcast@wanews.com.au

See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

S2E36: Literally Hanging on by a Fingernail Jan 31, 2020

Show notes

It’s seen as probably the most crucial piece of evidence the prosecution have to try and prove Bradley Edwards as being the Claremont Serial Killer - Ciara Glennon’s fingernail clippings.

Anna-Marie Ashley, the forensic scientist who extracted the DNA from those fingernails spent her second day on the stand, detailing how the DNA was extracted, and whose DNA they found.

Just as crucially, she was also asked about how the evidence was stored, and as Tim Clarke and Alison Fan explain, these are the type of details the defence will try and draw out, to try and show if there was any moment during this mammoth investigation the samples from the Karrakatta rape victim and Ciara Glennon’s fingernails could have been cross contaminated.

When one of Ciara’s fingernail clippings taken from the middle finger on her left hand - which were labelled AJM42 - were tested, initially they only showed her DNA.

It wasn’t until the fingernail clippings, along with the Karrakatta rape victim’s samples were sent to the UK for further testing that a male DNA profile was found.

That was later found to be the DNA of Bradley Edwards, after police retested other exhibits from then-unrelated cases which brought up his fingerprints, then tailed him and tested a sprite bottle he left behind after a trip to the movies in 2016.

Join Tim Clarke, Alison Fan and Natalie Bonjolo as they discuss week eight of Western Australia’s trial of the century.

For more on the Claremont serial killings trial, head to thewest.com.au, and if you have any questions about the trial for the podcast team or any of their guests, send in your questions to claremontpodcast@wanew.com.au

See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

S2E35: A Lesson in DNA Jan 30, 2020

Show notes

The forensic scientist who tested the evidence which is crucial to the prosecution’s case today took the stand.

Anna-Marie Ashley from Path West, detailed in painfully intricate detail of how she extracted the DNA from the Karrakatta rape victim’s intimate swabs, which revealed DNA which we now know is Bradley Edwards’ - for the first time.

She also tested Ciara Glennon’s fingernail samples - the crucial piece of evidence which the prosecution say links the Karrakatta rape, which Bradley Edwards has pleaded guilty to, with the murder of Ciara Glennon.

It was an extremely scientific, and detail driven day in court, luckily, forensic DNA expert Brendan Chapman joined Natalie and Tim in the studio to help us try to understand the process of DNA extraction.

Brendan’s informative introduction into DNA is a must-listen for those of us following the trial, because we’ve been warned - it’s only going to get more complicated, especially when the defence take their turn cross examining the evidence.

The team also answer some of the questions you’ve sent into the claremontpodcast@wanews.com.au email.

For the full coverage of the Claremont Serial Killings trial, go to https://thewest.com.au/news/claremont-serial-killings

See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

S2E34: Injuries Too Similar to Ignore Jan 29, 2020

Show notes

Forensic pathologist Dr Clive Cooke told the court during his fourth day on the stand that Jane Rimmer and Ciara Glennon suffered similar injuries on their necks and hands, and that they both likely died as a result of having their necks cut with a knife.

That information isn’t new to the trial, but as Tim Clarke explains in this episode, it’s significant because it’s the first time an expert witness has been asked - and explained - injuries inflicted on both women as a collective.

Criminal defence lawyer Damien Cripps joins the Claremont in Conversation team to discuss why this is significant, as well as throw some questions about the other piece of evidence that Dr Cooke also provided today - that there’s no evidence to suggest that Ciara Glennon was sexually assaulted before her murder.

As Damien and Tim explain, if the prosecution are going to present the similarities in the two murder cases, the defence would likely highlight the differences in the murders with the other cases the accused Claremont Serial Killer Bradley Edwards has admitted to.

Namely, that Bradley Edwards has admitted to two sexual attacks - the Huntingdale attack and the Karrakatta rape - and witnesses over the last two days have told the court there’s no evidence to suggest Jane or Ciara were sexually assaulted before their murders.

Join Natalie Bonjolo, Damien Cripps and Tim Clarke as they take you through day 34 of the Claremont Serial Killings trial.

They’ll also answer some of your questions you’ve sent in to the claremontpodcast@wanews.com.au email.

For more on the Claremont Serial Killings trial, head to https://thewest.com.au/news/claremont-serial-killings

See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

S2E33: Brutal Injuries Jan 28, 2020

Show notes

We’ve already been told Jane Rimmer and Ciara Glennon fought for their lives.

But what they went through in the moments before their deaths hasn't been spoken about in great detail, until today.

On day 33, that was made a little clearer by the testimony of pathologist Dr Clive Cooke.

He revealed there was no evidence to suggest she was raped before she was murdered.

During his third day on the stand, Dr Cooke said while there was no evidence of sexual assault, Jane’s body was so badly decomposed that it couldn’t be completely ruled out.

He also couldn’t categorically point to a cause of death for Jane, but suffocation and a cut to the throat also can’t be ‘ruled out’.

Dr Cooke was present both Jane and Ciara’s post-mortems. He detailed the large defensive wounds both women had on their bodies in detail, explaining that a sharp object would have inflicted them.

He’s also appearing on the stand as an expert witness to analyse pathologist Dr Karin Margolius’ notes - she carried out the autopsies on both women.

As Alison Fan explains in this podcast, with the hindsight and technology of 23 years, Dr Cooke was able to find what he said was a flaw in Dr Margolius’ notes.

He said a note about Ciara Glennon receiving a blow to the head shortly before her death was wrong. The ‘fracture’ Dr Margolius spoke about was - what he said - a pre-existing, natural condition. That was found after Ciara’s skull was re-examined in 2013, three years after Dr Margolius’ death.

Tim Clarke, Alison Fan and Natalie Bonjolo discuss the revelations made on Day 33 of WA’s trial of the century.

For more on the trial, head to https://thewest.com.au/news/claremont-serial-killings

And don’t forget to send in your questions for the team and their guests to claremontpodcast@wanews.com.au

See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

S2Bonus Episode: Remembering Sarah Jan 26, 2020

Show notes

It was the Australia Day weekend 1996.

Perth woke to the shocking news that an 18-year-old had been reported missing after not returning home from a night out in Claremont with friends.

Little did we know that her disappearance would be just the beginning of Australia's most expensive and longest running investigation.

She was the first victim of the Claremont Serial Killer, but her body has never been found.

In this bonus episode, we're joined by veteran journalist Alison Fan, who became close to the Spiers family since their daughter and sister was reported missing. Alison recounts the desperation felt by Sarah's heartbroken family to find the loving and happy young woman.

We take you through the person Sarah was, the search for the 18-year-old and the torment her family has gone through in the 24 years she's been missing, including false hopes and clairvoyants giving them leads that went nowhere.

As WA's trial of the century continues, the Spiers family say they've never given up hope of finding Sarah.

Join Natalie Bonjolo, Alison Fan and Tim Clarke as they remember Sarah.

See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

S2E32: Cause of Death Jan 24, 2020

Show notes

It has been revealed for the first time that Ciara Glennon may have been struck on the back of her head in the moments before her death.

The blow may have stunned, or rendered her semi-conscious.

This information we can bring to you now, because late on day 32 of the Claremont Serial Killings trial, Justice Stephen Hall lifted the suppression order put in place the day before, which had banned all details about Jane Rimmer and Ciara Glennon’s autopsies being broadcast to the public.

After an application by Seven West Media, and negotiations with the prosecution, an order was made to be able to publish limited details from the two murdered womens’ post-mortems.

In this information, was the revelation that Ciara had a small fracture to her skull, which pathologist Dr Karin Margolius said was likely to have been inflicted by a sharp object shortly before her death.

As Tim Clarke and Alison Fan explain, the injuries suffered to both Jane and Ciara extend further than the ‘neck defects’. They had injuries consistent with ‘a boxer’s stance’, which pathologist Clive Cooke called ‘classic self-defence wounds.’

As for their cause of death, It’s likely Ciara Glennon died from the large neck injuries she suffered. These were at the back and sides of her neck.

In this podcast, Tim Clarke explains why Jane Rimmer’s was inconclusive.

Join Natalie Bonjolo, Tim Clarke and Alison Fan as they wrap up week seven of WA’s trial of the century, discussing the information that’s been allowed to be broadcast, as well as explaining why we can hear it now.

For more on the Claremont Serial Killings trial, head to https://thewest.com.au/news/claremont-serial-killings

See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

S2E31: The Evidence Ban Jan 23, 2020

Show notes

Before Day 31’s evidence in the Claremont Serial Killings trial could be heard, Justice Stephen Hall issues a temporary suppression order on all details regarding the post mortems of Jane Rimmer and Ciara Glennon, including any injuries and the causes of death.

Justice Hall said the suppression was made at the request of the victim’s families.

The suppression order was put in place just before evidence from the pathologist who carried out the post mortems of Jane Rimmer and Ciara Glennon was read out to the court.

Dr Karin Margolius died from cancer in 2010, so her evidence is restricted to the reports she made during the two women's autopsies.

It leaves us with the question. Will we find out the caue of death of Jane and Ciara?

This left court reporters from every media outlet with not a lot to write about, except that a ban had been put in place.

As Tim Clarke explains, media outlets and their lawyers have put in a submission to the court to have access to these details eventually. Just how much detail Justice Hall allows to be broadcast is to be determined.

One important note, which Justice Hall stressed, is that the details discussed in court today didn’t stop at just the media. Anyone from the public who was present in the packed court room was also banned from broadcasting on social media, even talking about the details discussed in court.

Tim Clarke explains the penalties which could arise from a breach of this order.

Joined by forensic scientist Brendan Chapman, we take you through the inner workings of a forensic lab, why dental records are so important and answer some of your questions.

If you have a question for the podcast, email us at claremontpodcast@wanews.com.au

To hear what goes into making the Claremont in Conversation podcast, your behind the scenes look can be found at https://omny.fm/shows/true-crime-conversations/claremont-serial-killer/embed

See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

S2E30: The Missing Exhibit Jan 22, 2020

Show notes

The forensic officer who was involved with the collection of what is now seen as key pieces of evidence for the prosecution has revealed one of those pieces of evidence mysteriously disappeared after it was stored for the weekend at police HQ after Ciara Glennon’s autopsy.

Sgt Adam McCulloch, who was in his second day of evidence, told the court a white fibre labelled AJM23 - which was collected during a Polilight exam on Ciara's body - was missing.

It’s unknown, and will probably never be known the importance, if any, this fibre would have played in the trial.

This evidence, and more on questions surrounding Sgt McCulloch’s exhibit labelling and the sealing of samples using proper procedure on Day 30 of the Claremont Serial Killings Trial. Join Natalie Bonjolo, Tim Clarke and Emily Moulton as they discuss the day’s evidence, and answer some of your questions you’ve sent in.

If you have a question for the podcast team, send it to claremontpodcast@wanews.com.au

See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

S2E29: A Spelling Test and a Skirt, or are they Shorts? Jan 21, 2020

Show notes

Day 29 started out unusually in court, with an officer asked to spell the words ‘maggot’ and ‘entomology’ for the court as his cross examination started.

The spelling test however, wasn’t just for fun, the court was told during evidence collection, several copies of exhibit lists were made, and one officer simply couldn’t spell those two words, and could identify his writing through his spelling of ‘magat’ and ‘antomology’.

Also to take the stand, the forensic officer who collected exhibits from the 1995 Karrakatta rape. He told the court it was him who incorrectly labelled one of the items as a skirt, when they were in fact shorts. After weeks of questioning other witnesses, scrutiny of the labelling of evidence, Sergeant Adam McCulloch told the court he simply made a mistake, which was rectified.

Some of the questions sent in by podcast listeners have queried whether the item was a ‘skort’, a mix between the two. However, Sgt McCulloch didn’t have an answer to that.

Another witness, a mortuary technician who helped with Ciara Glennon’s autopsy told the court in 1997, while they had some idea of hair and fibre transfer when touching a body, they didn’t have an understanding that the same could happen with DNA.

Brian Mouchmore told the court he was aware that a skin flake or hair could get onto a body without touching it, but admitted he didn’t really know mortuary instruments could transfer DNA from one part of the body to another.

As Tim Clarke explains, Mr Mouchemore was also quizzed on the length of his beard.

Join him, Natalie Bonjolo and Alison Fan as they take you through the events of day 29.

If you have any questions for the team, or any of the Claremont in Conversation guests, send them in to claremontpodcast@wanews.com.au

And for more on the Claremont Serial Killings trial, including Tim Clarke’s stories and the West’s live blog, head to https://thewest.com.au/news/claremont-serial-killings

See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

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