Brave & Big

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Latest Episodes:

From the NFL to Parenting in Crisis: NFL Vet Dustin Hopkins & Gabby Hopkins Sep 15, 2026

Dustin Hopkins kicked in the NFL for more than a decade, from Buffalo to Washington to the Chargers to Cleveland, after an All-American career at Florida State where he scored 466 points. His wife Gabby is a photographer and dancer who has moved 21 times in 14 years of marriage. And their oldest son, Wake, is nine years old, on the autism spectrum, and nonverbal. This is the most personal conversation Brave & Big has recorded, and we welcome Gabby as our first female guest!

It starts with football, and it's good football: playing for Bobby Bowden in his final season, what "the best hands come from the best eyes" taught Dustin about focus, and how he managed pressure with two things, an overarching trust that God works everything for good and a simple process in the moment. His job, he says, is simple enough to explain to a two-year-old. That doesn't mean it's easy. Then a ninth-grade hamstring tear that ended his running and started his kicking, because the devil always overplays his hand.

Then Gabby joins, and the conversation goes somewhere else. Losing her identity as "just Dustin's wife" and how she found her way back. Sensing something was off with Wake at a year old, getting brushed off by a pediatrician, and refusing to leave the office without a referral. The two-year waitlist, the one time they played the football card, and the realization that families without their connections face this alone, which is why the Well Foundation exists. And the insight Dustin shared with Joey and Chris on a pickleball court months ago: the same way he longs to hear Wake's voice, God longs to hear ours. It doesn't have to be dressed up. He just wants to hear you.

In this episode:

— Playing for Bobby Bowden in his last year: "get your juice," and why the best hands come from the best eyes
— Bowden vs. Jimbo Fisher, and the coach who took a family photo on an empty field after the Orange Bowl
— Managing pressure as a kicker: Romans 8:28 as the foundation, a prayer before every kick, and process cues in the moment
— Simple doesn't mean easy, and what a pre-kick routine teaches the rest of us about walking into a meeting
— The hamstring tear that turned a safety into a kicker, and why God uses the setback
— Sports-parent advice from an NFL dad: let your kids lead you in what they love, and care more about character than the scoreboard
— Gabby on identity: "I'm Gabrielle, daughter of a King," and the season she lost herself anyway
— The diagnosis: pink flags, mama bear, a two-year waitlist, and why the Well Foundation was born
— Loving Wake without words: reading his cues, the three-inch stare, and the day Wiley said "ketchup's my favorite"
— He just wants to hear your voice: the prayer insight that started this whole friendship
— Tears in a bottle: why God doesn't store things he doesn't plan to use
— Gabby's charge: put all your trust in Jesus. It's the boldest thing you can do.

This week's small step: Do what Dustin and Gabby asked. Give to the Well Foundation at thewellfdn.com, even ten dollars, so Wake's voice reaches families who are where the Hopkinses were. If you can't give, pray for them and for every family navigating special needs. And the next time you see a kid who's different at the coffee shop, don't tell your kids not to stare. Walk over and say hello.

Be Brave. Live Big.

—

SUBSCRIBE & REVIEW
If this episode hit, do us a favor: subscribe wherever you listen, and leave us a 5-star review. It's the single biggest thing you can do to help us reach more people with this show.

FOLLOW THE HOSTS
Joey Odom — @joeyodom.life; www.joeyodom.lifeChris Hart — @thechrishart · @thebravecoaches; www.bravecoaches.com

FOLLOW THE GUESTS
Dustin Hopkins: instagram.com/dustinhopkins3
Gabby Hopkins: instagram.com/gabriellehopkins
The Well Foundation: thewellfdn.com · instagram.com/thewellfdn

REFERENCED IN THIS EPISODE
Romans 8:28. Psalm 56:8 (you have kept count of my tossings, put my tears in your bottle). Psalm 139:4 (before a word is on my tongue). Coaches Bobby Bowden and Jimbo Fisher at Florida State. Kohl's Kicking camps. The Kennedy Krieger Institute at Johns Hopkins. Our Daily Rhythms episode, where Joey first shared Dustin's insight on prayer.

Produced by Sonus Podcasts · sonuspodcasts.com

Vocation: Give It Your All Without Giving It Everything Sep 08, 2026

You'll spend about ten full years of your life working. And the ache most of us feel about that isn't failure, it's futility: did anything I did today actually matter? Joey Odom and Chris Hart open with one of history's darkest illustrations of that feeling, prisoners forced to carry heavy stones across a camp and then carry them right back, and Solomon's blunt version of the same question: what's there to show for a lifetime of work?

The answer starts with a word swap. Not job. Vocation, a word whose root means a calling. Whether you're a stay-at-home parent, running a company, or making sandwiches, you are called to the work in front of you, and there's purpose in it, even when the purpose is just the weight itself, because you grow in proportion to the weight you take on. Chris tells the story of Michelangelo painting an angel's wing into a dark corner nobody would ever see, as the story goes, because he wasn't painting it for anybody's eyes but God's.

Then the framework, three principles that only work held in tension. Steward your assignment: it's temporary, so give it your all while it's in your hand. Manage your ambition: the ardent desire for rank, fame, and power will make you distracted by the future instead of propelled by it. And protect your identity: triumph and disaster are both impostors, and even your calling is not who you are.

In this episode:

— The golf update: what Joey actually meant, and using hobbies to connect with your family instead of escaping it
— The great job-list showdown: plasma donors, pizza delivery, Footaction salesman of the year, and the restaurant where they waited tables together
— Why futility, not failure, is the core tension of work
— From job to vocation: the word's root is a calling, and it covers every kind of work
— You grow in proportion to the weight you take on, so the weight might be the point
— Michelangelo's dark corner: working as unto the Lord when nobody's watching
— Principle 1, steward your assignment: temporary by definition, so be great while it's in your hand
— Principle 2, manage your ambition: propelled by the future, never distracted by it
— The paradox at the center: give it your all, but don't give it everything
— Principle 3, protect your identity: triumph and disaster are impostors, and even your calling isn't who you are

This week's small step: Write out your identity in Christ. Actually put it on paper this week. Then carry it into your work with all three principles in hand: steward your assignment, manage your ambition, protect your identity. The vocation will change someday. Who you are doesn't.

Be Brave. Live Big.

—

FOLLOW THE HOSTS

Joey Odom — @joeyodom.life; www.joeyodom.life

Chris Hart — @thechrishart · @thebravecoaches; www.bravecoaches.com

REFERENCED IN THIS EPISODE
Ecclesiastes on the meaninglessness of toil. Colossians 3:23 (work at it with all your heart). Philippians 3:7-8 (the surpassing worth of knowing Christ). Psalm 37:4 (delight yourself in the Lord). Frederick Buechner on vocation as the place where your deep gladness and the world's deep hunger meet. Rudyard Kipling, "If." Jordan Peterson on voluntarily carried weight. The story of Michelangelo and the Sistine Chapel. Our What's In Your Hand episode on stewardship. And watch for our conversation with author Jordan Raynor, coming in October.

Produced by Sonus Podcasts · sonuspodcasts.com

Guardrails: How To Protect The Vision For Your Life Sep 01, 2026

Where there's no vision, people cast off restraint. Joey Odom and Chris Hart build this episode on the half of Proverbs 29:18 most of us skip: vision isn't only about where you're going. It also decides what you're willing to say no to along the way. The bigger the vision, the bigger the guardrails.

They lay the groundwork first. Without vision, life turns responsive instead of proactive, and comparison moves in. And guardrails aren't just for destructive things: some of your most needed boundaries go around good things that are misplaced or mistimed, like Ironman training in the middle of wartime, or a business call on the sideline of your kid's game. A guardrail scuffs your paint and keeps you in the lane. Without one, you're in the ditch.

Then it gets specific: four guardrails that cover most of us. The opposite sex, where you decide the boundary before temptation ever shows up. Devices, where Joey shares the passcode trick that erased most of his phone tension overnight. Substances, where Joey tells the story he's never loved telling, the night three years ago that led him to draw a hard line with alcohol. And money, with a framework simple enough to start this week. It all lands on the promise buried in the second half of that verse: the one who lives within the guardrails, happy are they.

In this episode:

— Proverbs 29:18 flipped: vision determines your no, not just your direction
— Why a lost vision leads to cast-off restraint, and the athlete's story that proves it
— Guardrails around good things: misplaced priorities, mistimed pursuits, and the restraint on the restraint
— Can the people closest to you articulate where you're going? Vision has to be visible
— A placeholder vision that actually works: love God, love people
— Guardrail 1, the opposite sex: decide before temptation shows up, and why this isn't about anyone but you
— Guardrail 2, devices: the downtime passcode only Joey's wife knows, and why environment beats willpower
— Guardrail 3, substances: Joey's hard line with alcohol, three years in, and the question that simplifies it all: does this help you be at your best?
— Guardrail 4, money: give, save, invest, spend, and the purchase threshold you align on with your spouse
— Two more worth building: a guardrail for your pride and a guardrail for your comfort

This week's small step: Take 10 minutes and write down the four categories: opposite sex, devices, substances, money. Under each one, write one to three guardrails you'll keep in place. Then run the list by your spouse, or a covenant friend if you're single, so you're in alignment. A guardrail you've written down and shared stops being negotiable.

Be Brave. Live Big.

—

FOLLOW THE HOSTS

Joey Odom — @joeyodom.life; www.joeyodom.life

Chris Hart — @thechrishart · @thebravecoaches; www.bravecoaches.com

REFERENCED IN THIS EPISODEProverbs 29:18. Our Vision episode, where these four guardrails first appeared. Clayton Christensen, How Will You Measure Your Life? (holding your principles 100 percent of the time is easier than 98). The Billy Graham rule. Andy Crouch on money as a spiritual stronghold.

Produced by Sonus Podcasts · sonuspodcasts.com

The Man in the Arena: Vanderbilt’s Blaze Berlowitz & Cole Adams Aug 25, 2026

Joey Odom wrote a card to Vanderbilt head coach Clark Lea after this one, because he'd never been more impressed with two young men. Quarterback Blaze Berlowitz and wide receiver Cole Adams sit down with Joey and Chris Hart, and what comes out is less a football interview than a masterclass in how young people become worth following.

Blaze came from Cushing, Oklahoma with one Division I offer and spent years waiting behind a Heisman runner-up, learning that belief is a practice and that obsession will override skill. Cole left Alabama after an injury that he says made him the man he is, and now starts every morning with a scripture text from his grandpa's pastor. Together they talk about detaching identity from performance ("football is what I do, not who I am"), staying present when an entire fan base ties its happiness to your Saturday, and what actually kills a locker room (jealousy, pride, and talking about money).

Then the conversation turns to the people who built them. Both credit parents who were supportive but never overbearing, who drove hours to every workout but never wanted it more than their kids did. Their closing advice to parents, from a couple of guys barely out of the house themselves, is worth the whole episode.

In this episode:

— "Be patient in the results, impatient in the process," and the other Coach Lea lines these players quote from memory
— Why repeated words become ingrained identity: "What's the mission? Winning."
— Obsession over skill: why reps aren't the point, pouring your soul into it is
— Iron sharpens iron: what a twin brother and a loud, competitive house build into you
— How an injury at Alabama became the making of Cole's faith
— Identity: football is what you do, not who you are, and how to actually hold that under SEC pressure
— The Man in the Arena, rabid fan bases, and refusing to let critics inside
— What makes a locker room great, what kills it, and why grown adults need locker rooms too
— Be available, not overbearing: the parenting these two say got it right
— Cole's dad's three rules: don't sag, don't litter, don't smoke, and why the broken record works

This week's small step: Pick one person you're pouring into, a kid, a player, a friend, and say the thing you've already said a hundred times, one more time. Repetition is how seeds take root. Then send this episode to a young athlete, a parent, or a coach who needs it.

Be Brave. Live Big.

—

FOLLOW THE HOSTS

Joey Odom — @joeyodom.life; www.joeyodom.life

Chris Hart — @thechrishart · @thebravecoaches; www.bravecoaches.com
FOLLOW THE GUESTS

Blaze Berlowitz: instagram.com/blaze_berlowitz

Cole Adams: instagram.com/cole.adams07

REFERENCED IN THIS EPISODE
Vanderbilt head coach Clark Lea. Theodore Roosevelt's "Man in the Arena." Proverbs 27:17 (iron sharpens iron). The saying "comparison is the thief of joy." Over the Top (1987).

Produced by Sonus Podcasts · sonuspodcasts.com

Wartime: How To Win The Hardest Season (Part 2) Aug 18, 2026

Part one named the season. Part two is the playbook. Joey Odom and Chris Hart pick up right where they left off with the first-ever Brave & Big two-parter, and this time it's all practice: what a wartime life actually looks like, day to day, for you, your spouse, your family, and the people around you.

The framework is five C's, each with the word "pursue" in front of it, because none of them happen by default. Consistency with yourself, because consistency is the foundation of trust, and the default setting of wartime is a drift toward comfort. Clarity with your spouse, because clarity is power and confusion is expensive. Connection with your family, in five-minute plans when five-year plans are impossible. Community with others, because isolation is the killer and it always disguises itself as productivity. And culling: taking an honest look at the things that don't belong in this season, even good things, from the golf habit to the scroll to the drink to the friendship that needs a boundary.

There's also a word for people outside the season: grandparents whose kids are quietly drowning, and the pre-wartime crowd who can build the rhythms now that they'll hold onto when the war starts. It ends where part one did, because it's the best news in the whole framework: this war will end, and how hard you fight today decides what tomorrow looks like.

In this episode:

— A word for grandparents: your kids are in wartime, and how to actually help (follow the instructions you're given)
— Pre-wartime prep: the habits you build now are the ones that hold later
— Consistency: as ambitious about the mundane as the exciting, and why it's the foundation of trust
— The one thing you shouldn't be consistent in: the pursuit of comfort
— Winning the driveway: saying yes to the trampoline, the practice drive, the princess dress
— Clarity with your spouse: fighting to see the world the way they see it first
— Clarity is power, confusion is expensive, and simple is hard
— Connection: weekly date nights (a candle and takeout counts), daily micro-moments, eyes on eyes
— Community: why the friendship that gets you in shape spiritually and physically is worth the sacrifice
— Culling: honest looks at golf, alcohol, scrolling, and opposite-gender friendships in this season

This week's small step: Two questions, written down. One: in what area of your life do you need to be more consistent right now? Name it simply. Two: where do you and your spouse both know you need clarity? Start there, and the rest of the five C's start to follow.

Be Brave. Live Big.

—

FOLLOW THE HOSTS

Joey Odom — @joeyodom.life; www.joeyodom.life

Chris Hart — @thechrishart · @thebravecoaches; www.bravecoaches.com

REFERENCED IN THIS EPISODE
Part one of this conversation (Wartime: Marriage & Parenting In The Hardest Season). David Brooks, How to Know a Person. Hebrews 12:1 (throwing off what entangles). Andy Stanley on planned generosity and the honest look at drinking. The Army Field Manual on shared understanding, from part one.

Produced by Sonus Podcasts · sonuspodcasts.com

Wartime: Marriage & Parenting In The Hardest Season (Part 1) Aug 11, 2026

Joey Odom was in a Las Vegas casino at 3 a.m. with a five-year-old and a three-year-old back home when the phone rang: his wife's parents were in crisis. Looking back, he can name exactly what was wrong with that picture. He was in wartime, living by peacetime rules.

That's the frame for this episode, part one of two. Wartime is the season when your kids are young and at home, you're building a career, your parents are aging, your marriage is squeezed, and everyone needs you at once. It's not a bad season. It's just a season, and the people who thrive in it are the ones who recognize it and change how they operate. The people who fail are the ones who keep applying peacetime principles to wartime moments.

Joey and Chris Hart build the case from 2 Samuel: in the spring, when kings go off to war, David stayed home, and one of the greatest men in Scripture made his most catastrophic mistake in the fog of comfort. From there they lay out six things to know, from fighting for rest (rest isn't recovery, it's readiness) to tightening your guardrails, treating flexibility as the plan itself, and turning communication into a combat multiplier. And they end with the truth that carries all of it: this war will end.

In this episode:

— The 3 a.m. casino phone call, and what "peacetime principles in wartime" costs
— What wartime is: the all-hands-on-deck years, named so you're not surprised by them
— David and Bathsheba: how comfort in wartime compounds into catastrophe
— Fatigue is a combat multiplier for the enemy, so fight for rest as readiness
— The fog of war: why you can't see the full picture right now, and why that means tightening your guardrails
— Deciding your standards before the situation shows up
— Flexibility is the plan, not the backup plan, and why that's grace rather than sloppiness
— Communication as a combat multiplier: the Sunday meeting, the shared calendar, and tailoring it to each kid
— Anxiety needs a plan: how preparation preempts the spiral
— The best news of all six: this war will end

This week's small step: Listen to this episode with your spouse. Reassure each other that it's supposed to feel like wartime, because it is. Then pick which of the six you'll apply first, whether that's a Sunday meeting, a shared calendar, or a guardrail you decide on ahead of time. And come back next week: part two picks up right here, with advice for people entering wartime, people coming out of it, and the action items to walk through it.

Be Brave. Live Big.

—

FOLLOW THE HOSTS

Joey Odom — @joeyodom.life; www.joeyodom.life

Chris Hart — @thechrishart · @thebravecoaches; www.bravecoaches.com

REFERENCED IN THIS EPISODE
2 Samuel 11 (in the spring when kings go off to war). Psalm 27:13 (the goodness of God in the land of the living). The Mike Tyson line about plans. The U.S. Army Field Manual on communication and shared understanding. Jonathan Haidt, The Anxious Generation. The podcast is also on YouTube at @BraveBigPod.

Produced by Sonus Podcasts · sonuspodcasts.com

Protecting Purpose: Overcoming Isolation, Insecurity, and Inconsistency Aug 04, 2026

Chris Hart kept noticing the same three problems in every pastor he met with. Then in every CEO. Then in everybody. Isolation, insecurity, and inconsistency: three attacks on your purpose that don't have to knock you out to win. They just have to slow you down.

Joey Odom and Chris spend this episode naming each one and handing you its antidote. Isolation gets solved by a team, and the test is simple: who notices when you're somewhere or when you're not? Insecurity is a symptom of misplaced identity, so the fix is anchoring who you are in something no scoreboard, title, or bad day can touch. Chris tells the story of his five-year-old son Brave stepping in front of his sisters, taking a punch in the nose, and explaining afterward, "Because I'm the one." He didn't have time to think. He acted out of who he already knew he was.

Then the third eye, the one underneath the other two: inconsistency. If you're isolated, you've been inconsistent in your pursuit of friendship. If you're insecure, you've been inconsistent in your pursuit of God. Success doesn't come from what you do occasionally. It comes from what you do consistently.

In this episode:

— One question that opens doors everywhere: "Is there anything I can pray for you about?"
— The three I's: isolation, insecurity, inconsistency, and why they aim at your purpose
— The team test: who notices when you're there and when you're not?
— How to be a multiplier: notice what people are good at and tell them
— A self-diagnosis for isolation: do you see or talk to three of the same friends weekly?
— Why a close friend you see weekly is worth the happiness of a $150,000 raise
— Insecurity as misplaced identity, and why it can look like the most confident person in the room
— "Because I'm the one": how repeated identity becomes instinct under pressure
— Winners win: what the phrase means when the scoreboard doesn't go your way
— Why consistency is the cornerstone, and how non-negotiables stop being negotiable

This week's small step: Write three sentences. One action this week to build your team (start by noticing and naming what someone's good at). One statement of your identity in Christ. And your three non-negotiables, the things you will do consistently, no negotiation. Then hand that list to someone on your team and invite them to ask you about it.

Be Brave. Live Big.

—

FOLLOW THE HOSTS

Joey Odom — @joeyodom.life; www.joeyodom.life

Chris Hart — @thechrishart · @thebravecoaches; www.bravecoaches.com

REFERENCED IN THIS EPISODE
Ecclesiastes 4:9-10 (two are better than one). 2 Corinthians 5:17 (a new creation). Jeremiah 17:7-8 (a tree planted by the water). 1 Corinthians 15:58 (be steadfast, immovable). Research on friendship and happiness. The PRAY acronym (praise, repent, ask, yield).

Produced by Sonus Podcasts · sonuspodcasts.com

Leadership: How to Be a Leader Worth Following Jul 28, 2026

Pastor Bill Scheer looked at a twenty-year-old Chris Hart and said something that changed the trajectory of his life: you can't make a mess I can't clean up. That's what a leader does. They take someone somewhere they couldn't get on their own.

Joey Odom and Chris open this episode with a simple reframe: start looking at every facet of your life through the lens of leadership. Not just the boardroom, but the grocery store, the sideline at your kid's game, the dinner table tonight. Because the world is looking for someone to follow, and the question isn't whether you have a title. It's whether you're worth following.

From there they get practical. Chris walks through the questions that reveal how you actually lead: what naturally flows out of you, what energizes you, what drains you, and then the two big ones, what's your uniqueness and what's your eliteness. Most people can't name theirs because it's so innate they assume everyone has it. He tells the story of a five-foot-three boat captain in Cabo who, after four hours of catching nothing, refused to go chase small fish. Then they close on the three things every leader owes the people following them: support, confidence, and hope.

In this episode:

— Leadership as influence: taking people where they couldn't go alone
— Why the evidence of real leadership is trust and confidence in the people following you
— Three questions to find your lane: what flows, what energizes, what drains
— Uniqueness and eliteness, and why your superpower is the thing you assume everyone has
— On this boat, we catch Marlin: the case for refusing to chase small fish
— Position vs. posture, and why leaders out front are the ones who take the hit
— If you're not in your lane yet, be great where you are and watch where it leads
— Support, confidence, hope: how to infuse courage, because good leaders build leaders
— Why presence becomes a leader's superpower in the age of AI
— The elevation shift: driveway, rooftop, helicopter, 30,000 feet

This week's small step: Answer two questions for yourself. What's your uniqueness, the thing you do that most people don't? And what's your eliteness, the thing others do that you simply do better? Then take your answers to someone you trust and ask whether they agree, or what they'd add. It's a few minutes of reflection that can change how you show up in every room.

Be Brave. Live Big.

—

FOLLOW THE HOSTS

Joey Odom — @joeyodom.life; www.joeyodom.life

Chris Hart — @thechrishart · @thebravecoaches; www.bravecoaches.com

REFERENCED IN THIS EPISODE

Pastor Bill Scheer. Andy Stanley on wisdom as the recognition that everything in life is connected. Victor Wembanyama's confidence with the Spurs down 3-1 in the 2026 NBA Finals. The idea that we suffer more in imagination than in reality (commonly attributed to Seneca).

Produced by Sonus Podcasts · sonuspodcasts.com

Technology and Relationships: How to Become a 1% Family Jul 21, 2026

Joey Odom looked down at his phone and missed his five-year-old's first soccer goal, and the moment his son turned to the sideline to find his face. That miss reframed everything, and it opens this conversation about technology, attention, and the relationships that actually matter.

Joey, who co-founded a company built entirely around changing our relationship with technology, makes a case that's more hopeful than the usual doom: our least valuable relationship, the one with our phones, has the greatest impact on our most valuable relationships. And that relationship is something you can edit. He and Chris Hart get honest about their own convictions (the "daddy, watch me" moments, reading a bedtime story with one eye on a screen) and name what's actually at stake, from loneliness and isolation to phones dulling our ability to feel and AI dulling our ability to think.

Then it gets practical and doable. Start with the mirror, not your kids. Watch the 3M parent trap (you model a bad relationship, your kids mimic it, then you get mad at them for it). Get aligned with your spouse. Set one sacred time and one sacred place that stay phone-free. And when someone you love says "watch this," put the phone down and mean it.

In this episode:

— Why your least valuable relationship has the greatest impact on your most valuable ones
— The good news hidden inside "Dad, you're on your phone too much"
— Why proximity is the whole ballgame (91% of us keep our phones on us around the clock)
— How phones dull our ability to feel deeply and AI dulls our ability to think deeply
— The isolation trap, and why the promise of connection so often leaves us lonelier
— The 3M parent trap: model, mimic, mad, and how to break it
— Sacred times and sacred places: one of each, phone-free, to change the culture of your home
— The date-night phone swap, and the six words that tell someone they matter more than your screen

This week's small step: For the next seven days, spend 20 minutes a day physically distant from your phone. Not in sight, not on your body. Anchor it to something better: quiet time, a family show, a walk around the block. Treat it like a muscle and build from there. (For scale: two hours a day of distance would hand you back a full month of your year.)

Be Brave. Live Big.

—

FOLLOW THE HOSTS

Joey Odom — @joeyodom.life; www.joeyodom.life

Chris Hart — @thechrishart · @thebravecoaches; www.bravecoaches.com

REFERENCED IN THIS EPISODE

Jonathan Haidt, The Anxious Generation, and his 2026 TED talk on AI. The idea of cognitive offloading. Blaise Pascal on our inability to sit quietly in a room alone. Stranger Things (the Vecna and "Mr. Sandman" illustration).

Produced by Sonus Podcasts · sonuspodcasts.com

Vision: You Can’t Build a Life You Can’t See Jul 14, 2026

Plenty of people have sight and no vision. Joey Odom and Chris Hart spend this episode on the difference, and on the fact that vision isn't reserved for the naturally visionary. It's something you can go get.
They start with blind Bartimaeus on the roadside in Mark 10. When he starts calling out for Jesus, the crowd tells him to be quiet, and he gets louder. Chris makes the case that this is where vision actually begins: refusing to let other people's voices (or your own pride, or your fear of looking foolish) talk you out of asking for something big. Bartimaeus threw off the beggar's garment before he was healed, because he knew he wasn't going back.
Then it turns practical. David didn't see himself as a shepherd boy with a slingshot, he saw himself as someone who had already killed a lion and a bear, and Goliath was simply the next thing standing between him and the vision. So you take inventory of what you've already overcome. And once vision shows up, you protect it, because where there's no vision, people cast off restraint. Chris lays out four guardrails every person needs, and the guys close on writing the vision down so plainly that other people can read it and run.
In this episode:
— Vision as imagination plus wisdom, and why both halves matter
— Bartimaeus and the courage to get louder when people tell you to be quiet
— Why pride and the fear of embarrassment quietly kill vision, especially once you've had some success
— How Chris got a chunk of his own vision on day four of a fast, and what happened two weeks later
— Why vision turns opposition into opportunity
— The lions and the bears: taking inventory of what God has already brought you through
— You're a giant killer, and the giants worth naming (generational patterns, addiction, a lid at work, a lie your kid believes)
— Four guardrails to protect the vision: the opposite sex, what you consume, your devices, and money
— Vision, strategy, tactics: where you're going, how you'll get there, and what you do today
This week's small step: For the next seven days, take 30 minutes each morning with the distractions killed. Ask God for vision, personally and professionally, and write down what comes. It may not be the full picture yet, but write down what you get and let it start pulling you.
Be Brave. Live Big.
—
SUBSCRIBE & REVIEW
If this episode hit, do us a favor: subscribe wherever you listen, and leave us a 5-star review. It's the single biggest thing you can do to help us reach more people with this show.
FOLLOW THE HOSTS
Joey Odom — @joeyodom.life; www.joeyodom.life
Chris Hart — @thechrishart · @thebravecoaches; www.bravecoaches.com
REFERENCED IN THIS EPISODE
Blind Bartimaeus (Mark 10). David and Goliath (1 Samuel 17). Habakkuk 2:2 (write the vision and make it plain). Proverbs 29:18 (where there is no vision, the people cast off restraint). Helen Keller on sight without vision.
Produced by Sonus Podcasts · sonuspodcasts.com

Effort Is a Talent: David Pollack on Making Every Day Count Jul 07, 2026

When David Pollack broke his neck on an NFL field, the career he'd chased since he was four years old ended in a single moment. What he found in the stillness became the message he carries now: every day counts, and how you respond is the only part you actually control.
Joey Odom and Chris Hart sit down with David, a College Football Hall of Famer, longtime ESPN College GameDay analyst, and author of Every Day Counts, for a conversation about effort, faith, and family. He breaks down his 50/40/10 idea (you can outwork half the field and out-detail most of the rest, so heart becomes the separator), makes the case that effort itself is a talent you can develop, and gets honest about how chasing football as his god set him up to rebuild his life on something sturdier.
Then it turns practical and personal: leading at home by serving instead of being served, the one question that beats "how are you?", and why he refuses to let sports become the thing his whole family revolves around.
In this episode:
— What David found in the stillness after a career-ending neck injury: sport makes a poor god
— Why he refuses to be a "why me" person, and how focusing on your response changes everything
— The 50/40/10 idea: outwork half, out-detail most, and let heart separate the rest
— "Effort is a talent," and how removing the fear of failure unlocks it
— Starting where your feet are: the unglamorous grind behind the GameDay chair
— Leading at home by serving, and the question that beats "how are you?" (try "what are you out of 10?")
— "Decisions over choices": settle who you are in advance so the daily calls get easy
— Why sports shouldn't become the family's god, and keeping time together and church non-negotiable
This week's small step: Before bed, text yourself or a friend three non-negotiables for tomorrow. Not things you hope to do, things you will do. Knock them out early before the day gets loud, and make at least one of them count for someone you love.
Be Brave. Live Big.
—
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FOLLOW THE HOSTS
Joey Odom — @joeyodom.life; www.joeyodom.life
Chris Hart — @thechrishart · @thebravecoaches; www.bravecoaches.com
MORE FROM DAVID POLLACK
Book: Every Day Counts
Podcast: See Ball Get Ball with David Pollack
https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLTTr9cTfU2qhiIOiWVYQCSoEwIRdmm44z
Speaking and more: davidpollack.com
Instagram: @davidpollack47
X: @davidpollack47
Produced by Sonus Podcasts · sonuspodcasts.com

Stewardship: The Four Word Question That Changes Everything Jun 30, 2026

Years ago Chris Hart asked Joey Odom a four-word question that Joey has asked himself hundreds of times since: what's in your hand? This episode is built around it, and around the principle that quietly changes everything once it lands. Increase always follows stewardship.

The word goes back to the steward of a medieval estate, someone trusted with everything and owner of nothing, measured by a single question: did you advance the interests of the one you serve? Joey and Chris make the case that stewardship is actually a higher calling than ownership, because an owner answers to no one while a steward answers for all of it.

Then the turn. The thing in your hand right now probably looks ordinary. Moses had a staff he'd carried for 40 years tending someone else's sheep, and God used it to set a nation free. The job you don't love, the body you've got, the marriage in a hard season, the 30 minutes before your kid goes to bed. Steward the small, unglamorous thing well, and the increase follows.

In this episode:

— The four-word question that reframes everything: what's in your hand?
— Why stewardship is a higher calling than ownership: trusted with it all, owner of none
— Moses' ordinary staff, and why your avenue is usually the thing already in your hand
— The parable of the talents, and why increase always follows stewardship
— "You're not stuck, you're stewarding": a reframe for the job or season you resent
— Why comparison disqualifies you, like leaving your race to go chase someone else's
— The healthy tension between ambition and stewardship, and how either one alone leads to stagnation
— Stewarding your time, your body, the hard things, and the moments with your kids that don't come back

This week's small step: Pick one personal thing and one professional thing you know you could steward better. Commit to stewarding each one well for the next seven days, and watch for the increase on the other side.

Be Brave. Live Big.

—

FOLLOW THE HOSTS

Joey Odom — @joeyodom.life; www.joeyodom.life

Chris Hart — @thechrishart · @thebravecoaches; www.bravecoaches.com

REFERENCED IN THIS EPISODE
Moses and the burning bush (Exodus 3-4). The parable of the talents (Matthew 25). David's path to kingship and Nehemiah rebuilding the wall. The saying "comparison is the thief of joy."

Produced by Sonus Podcasts · sonuspodcasts.com

Alignment: Find the Wedge That's Keeping You Grounded Jun 23, 2026

A plane built to fly 600 miles an hour gets stopped cold by one small chock behind the tire. Chris Hart watched it happen on a runway and couldn't shake the question: what's the wedge in my own life? Joey Odom and Chris spend this episode on alignment, and why it's almost always the thing already inside us, not the circumstance around us, that keeps us grounded.

They walk through a simple chain: thoughts lead to words, words to actions, actions to habits, and habits to results. So if you don't like the result you're getting, you don't start with the result. You go back and check the alignment of your thoughts. Joey talks about treating your mind like an algorithm that feeds you more of whatever you pause on, and how choosing gratitude actually retrains it.

From there they get practical about the teams in your life: friends, family, and work. Are you operating in your strength? Are you clear on your lane? Are you taking ownership of what you've been handed? They close on aligning your faith, naming the one thing that pulls you out of it (fear), and the quiet enemy that takes down teams, marriages, and companies (pride).

In this episode:

— The wedge: how one small thing grounds a life built to take off
— Why the obstacle is rarely the circumstance and usually yourself
— The chain that runs your life: thoughts, words, actions, habits, results
— Your mind as an algorithm, and how to retrain what it feeds you
— Why alignment makes the assignment possible (1 percent vision, 99 percent alignment)
— Three questions for your work: your strength, your lane, your ownership
— How taking ownership of the small things funnels you into your strengths
— Two questions to align your faith, plus the fear and pride that break alignment

This week's small step: Name your wedge, or a result you're getting that you wish were different. They're usually the same thing. Then take it to one person, say it out loud, and decide together how you'll fight to remove it. Sit with it this week before you act.

Be Brave. Live Big.

—

FOLLOW THE HOSTS

Joey Odom — @joeyodom.life; www.joeyodom.life

Chris Hart — @thechrishart · @thebravecoaches; www.bravecoaches.com

REFERENCED IN THIS EPISODE
Jim Collins on vision and alignment in visionary companies. James Clear on identity-based habits. Craig Groeschel on going the direction of your most powerful thoughts. The accounts of the Tower of Babel (Genesis 11) and Gideon (Judges 6-7).

Produced by Sonus Podcasts · sonuspodcasts.com

Grit and Grace: Your Best Effort + Supernatural Power Jun 16, 2026

You don't have grit or lack it. You do grit. Joey Odom and Chris Hart open this episode by flipping the whole question: grit isn't a trait you're born with, it's a muscle you choose to use, and it's available to every single one of us.

They start with the unsexy truth. We romanticize grit as the moment you win a fight, but it actually shows up in the boring, tedious, non-romantic places: the apology you owe, the lawn you mow when you'd rather watch the game, the marriage you stay in when you can't yet see the full picture. Joey reads a 800-page Hamilton biography he hated and walks away with a new picture of his own marriage. Chris gets choked out by a UFC fighter and learns what it means to get comfortable being uncomfortable.

Then the turn that makes the episode. Grit on its own becomes all about self. So they land on grit and grace: give it your absolute best, then admit where your best runs out and let God's power fill the gap. Most of us camp on one side or the other. The breakthrough is the rhythm between them.

In this episode:

— Why "grit is as grit does" reframes the entire question of whether you have it
— Angela Duckworth's formula, and why effort counts twice
— The humility of grit: why starting at the bottom takes more toughness than winning
— What a UFC fighter's "just enough air" teaches about not quitting at 60 percent
— How Joey's dad modeled the humility of grit for his family
— Why your motivation will fade, so you have to keep your "why" close
— Fresh grace every morning: how rest and mercy reset your capacity
— Weakness as a portal to God's power, not a thing to hide

This week's small step: Identify one area where you're giving your best and it still doesn't feel like enough. Your kids, your job, a personal discipline. Name it honestly as a weakness, then ask God for grace on it. You're activating grace in addition to your grit, not instead of it.

Be Brave. Live Big.

—

FOLLOW THE HOSTS

Joey Odom — @joeyodom.life; www.joeyodom.life

Chris Hart — @thechrishart · @thebravecoaches; www.bravecoaches.com

REFERENCED IN THIS EPISODE
Angela Duckworth, Grit. Carol Dweck's work on fixed vs. growth mindset. Ron Chernow, Alexander Hamilton. 2 Corinthians 12:9 (The Passion Translation).

Produced by Sonus Podcasts · sonuspodcasts.com

Balance Is a myth: Building Your Daily Spiritual Rhythms Jun 09, 2026

Most of us admire other people's discipline and never build our own. Joey Odom and Chris Hart spend this episode on the fix: a daily spiritual rhythm simple enough that you'll actually keep it.
Joey grew up in church and somehow never read the Bible all the way through until he was about 40, when a friend's offhand comment finally gave him permission to start. Chris built a 5 a.m. rhythm six years ago and learned the hard way that discipline begets discipline. Between them they walk through what a real daily practice looks like, how it has shifted across seasons of life, and why the goal is not a perfect routine but a sustainable one.
Then the heart of it: prayer is not a performance. It is a kid talking to a father who just wants to hear their voice. They get honest about the years they struggled to pray, the simple models that finally unlocked it, and why getting filled up in the morning is the only way you'll have anything to pour out the rest of the day.
In this episode:
— Why you keep admiring discipline instead of building it, and the one thing that changes that — Chris's five-five-five starting point: read for five, write for five, pray for five — How "discipline begets discipline" lets you stack a spiritual rhythm onto a habit you already have — Why Joey reads a paper Bible in big chunks instead of grabbing the catchy verse — A simple way to pray when you don't know how, built around a father who wants to hear your voice — Be selfish in the morning so you can be selfless all day — Why a local church is part of the rhythm, not an optional add-on — The five-year journal that turns ordinary days into a record of what God did
This week's small step: Pick your wake-up time and protect 20 minutes. Run the five-five-five: read for five, write for five, pray for five. Do it for one week. Then find one person to do it with and text each other a check mark when you finish, so you're building it together instead of alone.
Be Brave. Live Big.
REFERENCED IN THIS EPISODE The Bible Project. The Bible Recap by Tara-Leigh Cobble. Brother Lawrence, The Practice of the Presence of God. James Clear, Atomic Habits.
—
SUBSCRIBE & REVIEW If this episode hit, do us a favor: subscribe wherever you listen, and leave us a 5-star review. It's the single biggest thing you can do to help us reach more people with this show.
FOLLOW THE HOSTS
Joey Odom — @joeyodom.life; www.joeyodom.life
Chris Hart — @thechrishart · @thebravecoaches; www.bravecoaches.com
Subscribe, share, and leave us five stars wherever you listen.
Produced by Sonus Podcasts · sonuspodcasts.com

Authority: What You Carry Into Every Room Jun 02, 2026

Most of us are chasing leadership when the thing we're actually missing is authority. Joey Odom and Chris Hart spend this episode on the difference, and why it changes how you walk into every room.

Chris starts simple. Authority is not a title, a volume level, or being the loudest person in the building. It is something you carry, and it traces all the way back to Genesis, where the first assignment God ever handed us was to take ground.

Then the mechanic that holds the whole thing together: the level of your submission determines the level of your authority. The Roman centurion understood it. A person under authority is a person with authority. Submit to God first and it flows into your marriage, your kids, your work, and the stranger you meet who needs someone to speak faith over their life.

In this episode:

— Why leadership and authority are not the same thing, and which one you're actually missing — The line that sets the ceiling: your submission determines your authority — What "subjugate" in Genesis 1:27 has to do with how you walk into a Tuesday — Why speaking faith over someone is authority in action, and what happened to two strangers Joey did it for — How Molly took command of an emergency while a room full of people froze — What authority looks like in a marriage where both people are strong — How to walk in authority when you don't have the title or the corner office — The closing charge: the devil has none, and you've been handed all of it

This week's small step:
Add 20 minutes to your morning. Spend it in the word, then talk to God and ask for chances to walk in authority that day. Write down what you're grateful for and the doors you're believing for. Then get comfortable being uncomfortable, and speak a word of faith over someone who needs it.

Be Brave. Live Big.

—

SUBSCRIBE & REVIEW If this episode hit, do us a favor: subscribe wherever you listen, and leave us a 5-star review. It's the single biggest thing you can do to help us reach more people with this show.

FOLLOW THE HOSTS

Joey Odom — @joeyodom.life; www.joeyodom.life

Chris Hart — @thechrishart · @thebravecoaches; www.bravecoaches.com

Subscribe, share, and leave us five stars wherever you listen.

REFERENCED IN THIS EPISODE
Genesis 1:27 (made in God's image, the call to take dominion). The account of the Roman centurion and his "under authority" line (Matthew 8 / Luke 7). Jordan Peterson's framing of meekness as a sword kept in its sheath.

Produced by Sonus Podcasts · sonuspodcasts.com

Harder to Kill: Fitness, Food, and Staying Ready May 26, 2026

In college, Joey and Chris made a bet about who'd be the fattest at 40. They both showed up to that birthday in better shape than they started. This week, two average athletes (not trainers, not experts, just two guys who've stayed in it) talk about what's actually worked for them across two very different body types — and what hasn't.
This is the fitness conversation most men need but rarely get. Not a program. Not a protocol. Just an honest look at why so many guys quietly resign to being out of shape in their 30s and 40s, and what it takes to break that pattern without becoming a person you don't recognize.
Joey and Chris get into why environment beats willpower every time, why 90% of men over 30 will never sprint again, and the moment a car flipped on the highway and Chris had to pull a door off its frame. They talk about counting calories without shame, the trap of being proud of how much you can eat, and why the goal isn't six-pack abs — it's being the kind of man who's ready when his daughter asks him to train with her.
In this episode:

The college bet that started a 25-year fitness conversation
Why "I'm not that disciplined" is the right starting point
The 5 a.m. rule and how community kills the snooze button
What changed at 40 (and what didn't)
The pull-up story: capacity vs. conditioning
Calories are real, even when you wish they weren't
Protein as a budget, not a goal
Why strong people are harder to kill (and harder to hurt the people they love)
Modeling fitness for your kids without passing down food shame
The small step: pick your frequency, pick what's in and what's out

Mentioned in this episode:

Paul Horn, Radically Simple Strength
Peter Attia, Outlive
The Art of Manliness podcast
Brett Venables and the "hard to kill" philosophy

Be Brave. Live Big.
FOLLOW THE HOSTS
Joey Odom — @joeyodom.life; www.joeyodom.life
Chris Hart — @thechrishart · @thebravecoaches; www.bravecoaches.com
Subscribe, share, and leave us five stars wherever you listen.
Produced by Sonus Podcasts · sonuspodcasts.com

Progress or Excuses: You Can't Do Both May 19, 2026

The first sin in human history was followed immediately by an excuse. Adam pointed at Eve. Eve pointed at the serpent. Nobody pointed at themselves. Joey Odom and Chris Hart open episode three with that observation and spend the next forty minutes unpacking why excuses are the lid on almost every life, and what it actually takes to kill them.

This one gets personal fast. Chris lays out the case that an excuse always starts as a lie, and if you let it linger long enough, it becomes your truth. The "I'm just not good at making money." The "I could never get in that kind of shape." The stories we tell ourselves so often we stop noticing we're telling them. Joey pushes back on the easy version of this conversation, draws the line between commitments you actually made and ones you never made in the first place, and gives a tactical reframe that changes everything: stop tying excuses to outcomes. Instead, tie them to activities.

By the end, they land on a line that's going to follow this show around for a while: you can either make progress or make excuses. You cannot do both.

In this episode:

- Why the first response to the first sin was an excuse, and what that tells you about human nature

- The difference between a real excuse and something you were never committed to in the first place

- How an excuse starts as a lie and slowly becomes your truth

- Why tying your commitments to activities (not outcomes) is the unlock

- The event plus response equals outcome formula, and where most people get it wrong

- The 100 percent rule: why all-in is actually easier than 98 percent

- How defensiveness is a tell that there's truth in what you're hearing

- The six F's gut-check: where are you making excuses in faith, family, fun, fitness, finances, friends

This week's small step: Identify one excuse you're making personally and one you're making professionally. Just one of each. Kill them both for the next seven days. That's it. Make progress or make excuses. You cannot do both.

Be Brave. Live Big.

—

SUBSCRIBE & REVIEW

If this episode hit, do us a favor: subscribe wherever you listen, and leave us a 5-star review. It's the single biggest thing you can do to help us reach more listeners with this show.

FOLLOW THE HOSTS

Joey Odom — @joeyodom.life; www.joeyodom.life

Chris Hart — @thechrishart · @thebravecoaches; www.bravecoaches.com

—

Produced by Sonus Podcasts · sonuspodcasts.com

Covenant Friendship: The Friends Who Make You Invincible May 12, 2026

Most people have friends but not true covenant relationship. Joey Odom and Chris Hart spend this week unpacking the difference — and why it matters more than almost anything else in your life.
It starts with two stories. A five-hour drive to a men's conference where one guy looked around the truck and said, "I've never felt invincible until this car ride." And a phone call from a friend's wife — the one she'd been carrying alone for a year and a half because her husband wasn't right and she didn't know who to call.

Joey and Chris use those two moments as bookends for what real friendship actually looks like. Not the surface-level version. The kind where your wife knows exactly which three men to call if you're not your best self. The kind where, when life caves in, somebody's already in the truck.
In this episode:
— The two questions that reveal whether your friendships are real — Why your wife should know exactly who to call when you're not right — The Up, Out, Down framework for the friendships every man needs — The One, Three, Twelve model (and why naming it changes everything) — The PID Loop: how proximity becomes interaction becomes dependence — Story, Silly, Secret: the ten-minute weekly call that built this show — Why a brother is born for adversity — and why asking for help isn't a burden — How to give and receive rebuke without being a baby about it
This week's small step:
Take fifteen minutes. Write down your Up, your Out, and your Down. If a name's missing in any category, that's your assignment for the week. Pursue an up. Initiate with an out. Pour into a down.
Be Brave. Live Big.
—
SUBSCRIBE & REVIEW If this episode hit, do us a favor: subscribe wherever you listen, and leave us a 5-star review. It's the single biggest thing you can do to help us reach more men with this show.
FOLLOW THE HOSTS Joey Odom — @joeyodom.life Chris Hart — @thechrishart · @thebravecoaches
—
Produced by Sonus Podcasts · sonuspodcasts.com

The 20 Mile March: A Life Worth Following May 05, 2026

After 27 years of friendship, Joey Odom and Chris Hart are finally doing the thing they've been talking about since college. Every week, they're sitting down to have the kind of conversations that make both of them better men.

Episode one starts where the show starts: with the friendship itself. Then Chris walks Joey (and you) through the framework that anchors how he coaches some of the most successful leaders in the country. It's called the 20 Mile March.

In the early 1900s, two expedition teams raced to be the first to reach the South Pole. One pushed hard on good weather days and hunkered down on bad ones. The other committed to 20 miles a day, every day, no matter the conditions. Only one team made it home.

The same principle that decided who lived and who died on that ice is the principle that decides whether you'll actually become the husband, father, leader, and man you say you want to be.

In this episode:
— Why you become better around the right people (and how to find them)
— The Roald Amundsen expedition that changed how Chris coaches every client
— Why the "lone wolf" is a myth that gets you killed
— The unsexy truth about everyday courage (hint: it looks like not hitting snooze)
— How to stop being a bystander to your own life
— The one question that turns ordinary days into intentional ones
This week's small step: Pick one category. Faith, family, fitness, finances, friends. Decide what your 20 Mile March looks like in it. Make it small. Make it sustainable. Then wake up tomorrow and execute.
Be Brave. Live Big.
SUBSCRIBE & REVIEW If this episode hit, do us a favor. Subscribe wherever you listen, and leave us a 5-star review. It's the single biggest thing you can do to help us reach more men with this show.

FOLLOW THE HOSTS
Chris Hart: @thechrishart, @thebravecoaches
Joey Odom: instagram.com/joeyodom.life
https://www.joeyodom.life/

REFERENCED IN THIS EPISODE The 20 Mile March concept comes from Jim Collins' book Great by Choice (2011), based on his research into what set Roald Amundsen's South Pole expedition apart from Robert Scott's.
Produced by Sonus Podcasts · sonuspodcasts.com

Brave & Big - Trailer Apr 29, 2026

Welcome to Brave & Big — a weekly conversation for anyone ready to stop coasting and start taking ground.

Chris Hart, founder and CEO of Brave Coaches, and Joey Odom, public speaker, author, and former tech co-founder, have been best friends for over 25 years. In that friendship, they've had thousands of conversations — and walked away from every one of them better, sharper, and more fired up to live a life worth following.

This trailer is their invitation to pull up a chair.

Each week, Chris and Joey will dig into what it actually looks like to be Brave and live Big: killing excuses, taking ground in your marriage, following Jesus, raising kids who matter, getting fit, building friendships that sharpen you, and chasing the things you were made for. Some episodes will be just the two of them. Others will feature high-performing athletes, business leaders, and performers who've learned how to show up.

And every single episode will close the same way — with one small, practical step you can take immediately.

Because a Brave and Big life isn't built in a leap. It's built in a step.

🎧 Subscribe now. New episodes weekly. Be Brave. Live Big.

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