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    Christianity

    Where Do We Go From Here?

    A weekly podcast deconstructing purity culture, sex and other real life stuff for thoughtful Christians and exvangelicals alike.

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    Copyright: © All Rights Reserved by Authors

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    Latest Episodes:
    Gayer Than Originally Anticipated: Follow-up Interview with Jenna Dewitt - Sapphic, Aromantic, Asexual & Christian Aug 05, 2026
    Show notes

    EDJ and Jenna Dewitt sit down for a follow-up conversation about where Jenna has gone and grown since her interview with Jess and Devi in 2021. Jenna shares her journey as an aromantic, asexual, sapphic and celibate Christian, offering a fresh perspective on faith, identity, and belonging.

    Together, we unpack the often-misunderstood experiences of aromantic and asexual people, challenge assumptions shaped by purity culture, and explore what it means to build truly inclusive faith communities.

    Jenna explains the differences between aromantic and asexual identities, the meaning and history of the term sapphic, and why representation matters for people whose experiences are often overlooked—even within LGBTQIA+ spaces. She also reflects on her personal journey through evangelical Christianity, deconstruction, and discovering a more expansive, justice-centered faith.

    Whether you're navigating your own spiritual journey, queer identity, supporting LGBTQIA+ loved ones, or simply curious about the intersection of faith and sexual identity, this conversation offers wisdom, compassion, and hope for a more inclusive future.

    In This Episode

    • What aromantic and asexual identities really mean—and the myths that surround them
    • Why the term sapphic is broader than many people realize
    • Jenna's story of faith, deconstruction, and embracing her identity
    • Celibacy as a gift of freedom rather than a requirement
    • How purity culture shapes our understanding of love, relationships, and sexuality
    • Deconstruction can become a pathway to deeper, more authentic spirituality and self-acceptance
    • Why many churches struggle to include LGBTQIA+ people—and what can change
    • The importance of affirming community, belonging, and authentic faith
    • Collective liberation reminds us that justice and love are inseparable.
    • The future of progressive Christianity & practical ways churches and individuals can create more welcoming spaces

    Connect with Jenna:

    www.InvisibleCakeSociety.com

    https://substack.com/@jennadewitt

    https://www.instagram.com/jennadewitt/


    RomCom Recap: Down With Love Jul 29, 2026
    Show notes

    In this episode, EDJ, Amy and Thea recap the 2003 romantic comedy Down with Love, a colorful homage to the glamorous screwball comedies of the early 1960s. Beneath its playful style, witty dialogue, and impeccable costumes lies a fascinating conversation about gender, feminism, workplace dynamics, and the cultural expectations of its era.

    We explore whether the film succeeds as both a loving parody and a meaningful social critique, discussing where its satire lands—and where it falls short by today's standards.

    In This Episode

    • The performances, chemistry, costumes, and visual style that make the film memorable.
    • The film's take on feminism, gender expectations, and the battle of the sexes.
    • Romance, consent, and power dynamics in interpersonal relationships.
    • How misogyny, homophobia, and outdated stereotypes are presented—and whether the movie critiques or reinforces them.
    • Whether the movie's satire still resonates with fourth wave feminist audiences since this movie was made during the third wave of feminism
    • How we'd update Down with Love perhaps in a 1980s context with a #metoo feminist lens projection of fourth wave feminism

    Escaping Purity Culture with Mattie Jo Cowert Jul 20, 2026
    Show notes

    What happens when everything you've been taught about faith, sex, and identity no longer makes sense?

    In this episode, Mattie Jo Cowsert shares her powerful journey from growing up in conservative evangelical culture to questioning the beliefs that shaped her understanding of God, relationships, and herself. Raised in the heart of the Bible Belt, Mattie opens up about the lasting effects of purity culture, the emotional toll of shame-based theology, and what it looked like to rebuild her worldview after leaving fundamentalist Christianity.

    Together, we explore how religious messaging impacts self-worth, why deconstructing faith can feel both terrifying and liberating, and how curiosity, critical thinking, and healthy relationships helped Mattie reclaim her sexuality and personal agency.

    Rather than offering easy answers, this conversation invites listeners to think deeply about identity, spirituality, agency, and what it means to build a life rooted in authenticity instead of fear.

    Whether you're navigating your own faith deconstruction, recovering from purity culture, or simply interested in conversations about religion, sexuality, and personal growth, this episode offers honesty, compassion, and practical insight.

    Discussion Points:

    • Mattie's evangelical upbringing in Missouri
    • Purity culture affects far more than sex and reaches beyond the church community
    • The hidden emotional cost of shame-based religious teaching
    • Leaving certainty behind
    • What faith deconstruction looked like for Mattie Jo
    • Dating during deconstruction
    • Rediscovering sexuality with intention and safety after evangelicalism
    • Separating fear from personal values
    • Building healthy relationships without religious expectations
    • Marriage, commitment, and modern relationships
    • Reinterpreting scripture

    About Mattie Jo Cowsert

    Mattie Jo Cowsert is a New York City–based actor, author, and storyteller whose work explores the intersection of evangelical culture, sexuality, identity, and personal freedom. Raised in a multigenerational evangelical family in Branson, Missouri, she began publicly documenting her journey out of Christian fundamentalism through her blog, God, Sex & Rich People. Her memoir, God, Sex, and Rich People: A Recovering Evangelical Testimony, expands on that story, examining purity culture, faith deconstruction, and the process of rebuilding a life rooted in authenticity. Mattie also develops film and television projects inspired by her work and advocates for thoughtful conversations around religion, sexuality, and healing.

    Resources & Links

    • God, Sex, and Rich People: A Recovering Evangelical Testimony by Mattie Jo Cowsert
    • Mattie Jo Cowsert's website: https://www.mattiejocowsert.com/
    • Mattie Jo Cowsert on Instagram @mattiejocowsert
    • Purity Culture Recovery Guide by Erica Smith

    No Hard Feelings: David, Bathsheba, and What We Do With Good Men Who Do Bad Things Jul 06, 2026
    Show notes

    A No Hard Feelings Chat with Jessica, Emily and Kristen

    Content note: This episode includes discussion of sexual assault, rape, coercion, abuse of power, trauma responses, victim-blaming, and spiritual harm.

    The story of David and Bathsheba is often taught as a cautionary tale about lust, adultery, and David's eventual repentance. But what changes when we read it through questions of consent, power, silence, and coercion?

    In this episode of No Hard Feelings, Jessica steps into the host seat with Emily and Kristen to explore the story of David and Bathsheba in 2 Samuel 11 and 12. Together, they wrestle with whether David's actions can rightly be understood as sexual assault, why Bathsheba has so often been cast as a seductress or co-conspirator, and what it means to revisit one of the Bible's most beloved heroes with clearer eyes.

    The conversation moves beyond the question of whether David committed adultery and asks harder questions about what consent could mean for a woman summoned by a king, in a patriarchal society where women had very little social, political, or bodily autonomy.

    They also compare Bathsheba's story with Tamar's in 2 Samuel 13, including the different language used in the two passages, the role of women's voices in the narrative, and why the absence of visible resistance does not establish consent.

    Finally, Jessica, Emily and Kristen sit with the difficult question: if David did sexually assault Bathsheba, what do we do with David now?

    Can we still read his psalms? Can we recognise repentance without minimising harm? Can someone be spiritually significant, write beautiful things, and still be unsafe or deeply destructive in the lives of others?

    In this episode, we discuss

    • The familiar "David and Bathsheba had an affair" version of the story
    • Bathsheba as a silent figure in a narrative centred on David
    • The cultural and artistic sexualisation of Bathsheba
    • Why the story has often been told through David's desire, guilt, repentance, and restoration
    • The difference between explicit physical force and coercion through overwhelming power
    • Why "she came to him" does not necessarily mean she freely consented
    • Trauma responses including fight, flight, freeze and fawn
    • The contrast between Bathsheba's silence and Tamar's voice in 2 Samuel 13
    • Whether the absence of a particular Hebrew word settles the question of sexual assault
    • Nathan's parable of the rich man and the ewe lamb
    • Psalm 51, repentance, and the limits of a repentance story centered on the perpetrator
    • Why David does not need to be either sanitized or cancelled
    • What accountability, consequences, and redemption might mean in the story of David

    A few questions to sit with

    • Why have so many of us been taught to focus on David's repentance rather than Bathsheba's experience?
    • What assumptions do we make when a woman does not visibly resist?
    • What does consent mean when one person holds enormous political, social, and personal power over another?
    • Can a person be gifted, spiritually significant, and still capable of serious harm?
    • What does it mean to read Psalm 51 after taking Bathsheba's experience seriously?
    • How might the church tell stories of repentance without making victims disappear?

    References and further reading

    Biblical texts

    • 2 Samuel 11–12
    • 2 Samuel 13
    • Psalm 51
    • 1 Kings 1–2
    • Matthew 1:1–6

    Scholarship and theological commentary

    • Robert M. Davidson, "Did King David Rape Bathsheba? A Case Study in Narrative Theology."
    • J. L. Andruska, work on David, Bathsheba, Dinah, and the lexical and syntactical case for sexual violation.
    • Sara M. Koenig, "Bathsheba and Preaching in the #MeToo Era."
    • Carmen Joy Imes, writing on David, Bathsheba, power, and consent.
    • David E. Garland and Diana R. Garland, discussion of power, consent, and Bathsheba.
    • Suzanne Scholz, Sacred Witness: Rape in the Hebrew Bible.
    • Caryn Tamber-Rosenau, "Biblical Bathing Beauties and the Manipulation of the Male Gaze."
    • Anne Létourneau, "Bathing Beauty: Concealment of Bathsheba's Rape and Counter-Power in 2 Samuel 11:1–5."

    Articles and contemporary voices discussed

    • Bonnie Kristian, "The Old Testament Calls Out Cancel Culture," Christianity Today.
    • "Did David Rape Bathsheba?" GotQuestions.org.
    • Clay Jones and Jean E. Jones, "Did David Rape Bathsheba?" Christian Research Institute.
    • John Piper's comments on David and Bathsheba, as reported by Church Leaders.
    • Rachael Denhollander's public comments on David, Bathsheba, power, and sexual violence.

    Connect with us

    We would love to hear what this episode stirred up for you, what challenged you, and what questions you are still holding.

    Follow the podcast wherever you listen, and join the Patreon community for deeper conversations, bonus content, and space to explore the light and shade of deconstruction together.

    Together, let's keep asking: Where do we go from here?


    Conversion Therapy Dropout with Timothy Schraeder Rodriguez Jun 17, 2026
    Show notes

    What happens when the faith community that teaches you about love also teaches you to reject a core part of who you are?

    In this deeply personal and courageous conversation, Timothy Schraeder Rodriguez shares his journey through conversion therapy, evangelical church culture, and the long road toward self-acceptance. Drawing from his memoir, Conversion Therapy Dropout: A Queer Story of Faith & Belonging, Tim reflects on eight years spent trying to change his sexuality in pursuit of acceptance from God, the church, and the people he loved.

    Together, we explore the lasting effects of purity culture, shame-based theology, and exclusionary church teachings on LGBTQ+ individuals. Tim offers a candid look at his experiences within influential evangelical spaces and discusses the emotional, spiritual, and psychological costs of attempting to suppress one's identity in the name of faith.

    This conversation is ultimately one of resilience, healing, and hope. Tim shares how he rebuilt a sense of belonging, reimagined his relationship with spirituality, and discovered that authenticity—not conformity—is the path to wholeness.

    Whether you're navigating questions of faith, sexuality, identity, or healing from religious trauma, this episode offers a compassionate and honest exploration of what it means to belong.

    About Timothy Schraeder Rodriguez

    Timothy Schraeder Rodriguez is a writer, speaker, and digital strategist based in New York City. He is the author of Conversion Therapy Dropout: A Queer Story of Faith & Belonging, a memoir chronicling his experiences with conversion therapy, evangelical church culture, and his journey toward self-acceptance. Through his writing and advocacy, Tim helps foster conversations around LGBTQ+ inclusion, mental health, religious trauma, and belonging.


    Exploring Fertility Options with Dr. Jaime Knopman Jun 05, 2026
    Show notes

    Own Your Fertility

    In this episode EDJ sits down with fertility Doctor Jaime Knopman to discuss IVF, egg freezing, miscarriage, endometriosis, and the realities of trying to conceive later in life.

    Dr. Knopman shares why fertility conversations should begin much earlier than most people think, how egg freezing technology has evolved, and why infertility is not just a "women's issue." The conversation also explores IVF for same-sex couples, surrogacy, embryo freezing, and how fertility care changed during the pandemic.

    This episode is an informative and compassionate look at modern fertility options, reproductive health, and family-building in today's world.

    Key Points

    • Women are born with all the eggs they will ever have.
    • Fertility begins declining more significantly after age 32, with steeper declines after 35 and 40.
    • Male infertility contributes to roughly one-third of infertility cases.
    • Biochemical miscarriage and the commonality of miscarriage.
    • Endometriosis can affect fertility through inflammation, reduced egg quantity, and physical obstruction.
    • Egg freezing technology has dramatically improved through vitrification (rapid freezing).
    • IVF success rates and misconceptions.
    • IVF today often includes genetic testing of embryos to improve pregnancy outcomes.
    • Surrogacy and reciprocal IVF.
    • Fertility treatment and definitions of infertility are becoming more inclusive for same-sex couples and single parents by choice.
    • Fertility insurance coverage changes.
    • The emotional realities of fertility treatment.
    • How the pandemic changed fertility care.

    About the Guest

    Dr. Jaime Knopman is a fertility specialist and co-author of Own Your Fertility. She works with individuals and couples navigating egg freezing, embryo freezing, IVF, surrogacy, and fertility preservation.

    Podcast Update from EDJ:

    The host shares a summer podcast schedule update, explaining that with children home during school holidays, episodes will continue on a lighter schedule through the summer months. Planned content includes:

    • One episode of No Hard Feelings
    • One episode of News and Views
    • One RomCom Recap
    • At least one interview episode each month

    The host also mentions ongoing community conversations in "The Big Debrief" and invites listeners to connect there.


    No Hard Feelings Chat: Debunking Myths about Soul Ties and Soulmates Jun 01, 2026
    Show notes

    In this month's No Hard Feelings Chat, we unpack the popular concepts of soul ties and soulmates, exploring where these ideas come from, how they've been shaped by culture and faith, and whether they hold up under theological, psychological, and scientific scrutiny.

    Together, we challenge fear-based narratives that emerged from purity culture, examine the difference between healthy attachment and unhealthy enmeshment, and discuss why healing from past relationships is possible. We also explore the myths surrounding "the one," love at first sight, and the belief that a person's worth is tied to their relationship status.

    Drawing from psychology, neuroscience, and personal experience, this episode offers a compassionate and nuanced perspective on love, connection, sexuality, and human flourishing.

    Whether you're single, dating, healing from heartbreak, married, remarried, or simply rethinking what you've been taught about relationships, this conversation invites you to approach love with greater freedom, authenticity, and self-awareness.

    Key points:

    • What "soul ties" are and where the concept originated
    • The phrase "soul tie" does not appear in the Bible but does appear in purity culture narratives!
    • Biblical passages commonly used to support the idea of soul ties
    • What neuroscience reveals about intimacy, bonding, and brain chemistry
    • Intimacy can create powerful emotional bonds without permanently binding people together
    • Healthy attachment versus enmeshment in relationships
    • A debate around whether sex creates permanent emotional or spiritual bonds
    • The theological idea that God is "all in all" and this bonds human beings "in Christ"
    • The origins and appeal of the soulmate narrative
    • The myth of finding "the one"
    • Love develops over time through trust, commitment, and shared experience—not instant chemistry alone.
    • The sacred value of singleness and personal wholeness
    • How culture, religion, and media shape our expectations of romance
    • Healing from toxic relationships, shame, and harmful beliefs
    • Building relationships rooted in authenticity, boundaries, and mutual growth

    Continue the conversation on Patreon:

    www.patreon.com/wheredowegopod


    Bonus Episode: Is the Fire of Hell the Fire of God's Love May 15, 2026
    Show notes

    What if hell has been misunderstood?

    In this thought-provoking episode, we unpack one of Christianity's most debated doctrines and explore a radically different perspective on judgment, punishment, and the nature of God. Through personal stories of faith deconstruction, biblical exegesis, and theological reflection, EDJ challenges the traditional ideas of eternal conscious torment and eternal separation from God, examining whether the language of "fire" in scripture points more toward refinement and restoration than endless punishment.

    The discourse dives into the tension between fear-based theology and unconditional love, asking whether reconciliation—not separation—is ultimately at the heart of the gospel. Along the way, we explore how concepts like discipline, correction, and salvation have been interpreted throughout church history, and what it means to read difficult biblical passages through the lens of love.

    Whether you're questioning long-held beliefs, reconstructing your faith, or simply curious about alternative theological perspectives, this episode invites you into a deeper and more nuanced conversation about hell, justice, and the character of God.

    Full episode on Patreon.com/wheredowegopod


    Shame-Free Sex Education May 12, 2026
    Show notes

    The Truth About Sexual Health and Purity Culture with Erica Smith

    In this deeply insightful conversation, Erica Smith unpacks the lasting impact of purity culture and explores what it means to pursue truly holistic sexual health. From anatomy education and puberty, to consent, contraception, desire, libido and fantasy, Erica offers a compassionate, shame-free framework for understanding sexuality.

    This episode challenges harmful narratives around sex while providing practical, evidence-based education for people of all genders and backgrounds. Whether you're healing from purity culture, raising children, navigating relationships, or simply wanting a healthier understanding of sexuality, this conversation delivers clarity, empathy, and actionable insight.

    Erica Smith is an award-winning, internationally recognized sexuality educator specializing in sex education for people recovering from purity culture and high-control religious environments. She is the creator of the Purity Culture Dropout™ Program, which provides comprehensive, medically accurate, LGBTQ+ inclusive, and trauma-informed sexuality education through coaching, support groups, workshops, and online community programs. Erica has more than 25 years of experience helping people heal sexual shame, build confidence, and develop healthier relationships with their bodies and sexuality.Top of FormBottom of Form

    In This Episode

    • Defining purity culture and sexual health and how the two are incompatible
    • A look at anatomy and how female genitalia is homologous with male genitalia
    • Understanding puberty, menstruation, and body literacy
    • Contraception options and STI prevention strategies
    • Why consent and communication are foundational to healthy relationships
    • The difference between spontaneous and responsive desire
    • Healthy conversations around masturbation and libido
    • The complexities of pornography and fantasy
    • Debunking myths like "soul ties"
    • Creating shame-free, LGBTQ+ inclusive sex education

    Resources & Mentions

    • Come As You Are by Emily Nagoski
    • Desire: A Guide to Managing Libido Differences by Dr. Lauren Fogel Mersy and Dr. Jennifer A. Vencill
    • World Health Organization definition of sexual health
    • Purity Culture Recovery Guide by Erica Smith

    A Sexual Ethic of Orgasmic Failure May 01, 2026
    Show notes

    In this expansive and thought-provoking conversation, Dr. Lauren D. Sawyer unpacks the complex legacy of purity culture—tracing its historical roots, cultural entanglements, and deeply personal impact. Drawing from her academic research and lived experience, Lauren explores how purity culture is not just a theological framework, but a social system shaped by race, power, and control.

    Together, we examine how purity culture has been influenced by historical moral panics like the "white slavery" scare, and how its ideals have been disproportionately constructed around white femininity. Lauren offers a critical lens on how these narratives intersect with white supremacy, while also highlighting the varied ways purity culture is experienced across different identities.

    The conversation moves into the role of queer theory in reimagining sexuality, particularly as it relates to children and adolescents. Lauren challenges dominant assumptions about childhood innocence, emphasizing the importance of recognizing children as moral agents with the capacity for curiosity, embodiment, and choice. We also explore the concept of childism and why it's essential to creating more ethical, inclusive frameworks for discussing sexuality.

    We also expound on the idea of "orgasmic failure" and how redefining sexual success can open up more compassionate, realistic understandings of intimacy and connection. Throughout the episode, Lauren emphasizes the importance of storytelling and narrative in reshaping how we understand sexuality, identity, and belonging.

    With insight and care, Lauren discusses how therapy and education can support healing from purity culture, while also creating space for more honest, age-appropriate conversations about bodies, consent, and power. She introduces a more human-centered sexual ethic—one that prioritizes agency, relational awareness, and embodied knowledge over rigid rules and shame-based narratives.

    This episode invites listeners to question inherited beliefs, listen more deeply to young people, and imagine a more inclusive, liberating approach to sexual ethics.

    Guest Dr. Lauren D. Sawyer is a scholar, educator, and researcher specializing in Christian social ethics, gender studies, and purity culture. She serves as Affiliate Faculty at The Seattle School and Manager of Curriculum and Instruction at The Allender Center. Her forthcoming book, Growing Up Pure: White Girls, Queer Teens, and the Racial Foundations of Purity Culture (NYU Press, 2025), explores the intersections of race, gender, and evangelical sexual ethics.


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