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In the first of a new series where we ask guests, What Movie Made You Queer? Today Rowan is joined by creative producer, storyteller extraordinaire and all round deity, Gabe Hicks, AKA, @GabeJamesGames on Twitter. Find Us Online - Twitter: https://twitter.com/QueerMoviePod - Patreon: https://www.patreon.com/thequeermoviepodcast - Website: http://www.queermoviepodcast.co.uk/ - Multitude: @MultitudeShows Production - Hosts: Rowan Ellis and Jazza John - Editor: Julia Schifini - Executive Producer: Multitude - Artwork: Jessica E. Boyd About The Show Queer Movie Podcast is a queer movie watch party hosted by Rowan Ellis and Jazza John. Join us as we research and rate our way through the queer film canon, one genre at a time. From rom-coms to slashers, contemporary arthouse cinema to black & white classics, Queer Movie Podcast is a celebration of all things gaaaaay on the silver screen. New episodes every other Thursday. Transcript ROWAN: Welcome to the Queer Movie Podcast, celebrating the best and worst of LGBTQ+ cinema, one glorious genre at a time. I'm Rowan Ellis, and welcome to one of our guest specials that we'll be releasing between our usual Queer Movie Club episodes. Today, we're joined by Gabe, who will be answering the question, "What movies made you queer?" I'm very excited to welcome creative producer and storyteller extraordinaire, Gabe Hicks, aka Gabe James Games. GABE: Hello! I'm happy to be here! I was talking to Rowan, I was like, "Yes, let me just talk about these things!" It's-- it's actually something that I have never really talked about, especially since more of my expression has been, like, more publicly recent, like this last year is when I really started openly sharing my identity and stuff. ROWAN: Amazing. I like that we're giving you the opportunity to do what I think a lot of people like to do, which is just talk excitedly about movies. I feel like it's a universal language. GABE: Absolutely. ROWAN: And I'm very glad to be part of it. So, this is going to be the first episode of this type of format that we're trying. GABE: Oh, my god. ROWAN: I know, very exciting. You are the debut. So, I would love to hear how many movies/sort of pieces of media/TV shows did you bring today for us? GABE: So, I brought four movies and then one piece of media. ROWAN: Amazing. GABE: Yeah. ROWAN: Do you have an order? Do you-- Have you already planned out your ideal order for this or are you just gonna pick them out of a hat at random? GABE: I actually did plan in order. ROWAN: In which case, far from it. That sentence didn't make any sense. I was like... I was about to say -- GABE: Far be from it. ROWAN: -- far from it to be to me, to Gabe. GABE: Yup. ROWAN: AKA, what is your first choice, Gabe? GABE: Pirates of the Caribbean. ROWAN: Oh, okay. Well, if anyone has ever spoken to me in my entire life, they will know that I am a massive Elizabeth Swann apologist and also love to talk about -- GABE: Really? ROWAN: -- Pirates of the Caribbean. GABE: All right, that's fair. ROWAN: And I would love to hear your thoughts about it. And then obviously, cancel this podcast episode if we disagree on this very first movie so... GABE: Cool, cool. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. That's fine. ROWAN: You know, the friendship is hanging on this, Gabe. GABE: Good. Good. ROWAN: Please be-- be aware. GABE: The-- the appearance of Jack Sparrow to me was-- that was the moment when I was like, I don't know if I want to be with him or be him. Kind of column A, column B, like, why not both? Weird, bold, beautiful, strange, unapologetic, charming in the way that he was just weird, and just did it. And was surrounded by such a wild assortment of people. And then Calypso is one of the most, be like the actress who plays Calypso as well as the character. Some of the most beautiful people that I've really seen. So, the more characters they introduced–. And then-- then the later ones when spoiler alerts, you got, like, Barbosa's daughter. And just-- I was like, "Why is everyone so attractive?" I will say Orlando Bloom, like, I enjoyed him, but I can't separate him from Legolas. And Legolas was too much of a pretty boy for my taste, because it was-- it was, like, long flowing pity boy, I wanted like, weird, gritty, strange boy, which is why Jack Sparrow pretty much checked all the boxes. ROWAN: Yeah, well, in turn it wasn't really giving that. He was very sweet in his own way. It was really funny because I remember Pirates of the Caribbean was out at exactly the same time as Lord of the Rings. How do I know that? Because I -- GABE: Yup. ROWAN: -- fully remember having posters of both on my wall. And I did have posters of Orlando Bloom as both roles, which was really I think, just the last vestiges of my, like, supposed heterosexuality clinging to the walls of my bedroom. GABE: Yup, yup. ROWAN: I think that what you just said about I didn't know if I wanted to be– be them or, like, be with them? GABE: Yeah. ROWAN: What a mood. What a queer mood. I feel like that is something that most of us can relate to. This strange kind of like, there is something alluring about this and I'm not entirely sure. GABE: Yes. ROWAN: What? What element of this is working for me? GABE: Yeah. ROWAN: Were you like a pirate kid? Was that-- was that a thing that you're already obsessed with? Or was this kind of like a new-- new thing for you in those years? GABE: It was a new thing for me. And it became, like, a fixation. I was like, I want all of this. I wasn't a pirate kid until those movies came out. And then, I was wholeheartedly a pirate kid. I was like, sea shanties, sea monsters, and, like, the thing is, I couldn't swim. So, like, it was very interesting -- ROWAN: Amazing. GABE: -- that I was like all about, I think, but you know what, like, if I can't swim, maybe Jack would save me and if he didn't, maybe I deserved it. I don't know. But like, I would-- I would risk it. I would risk it for the biscuit. ROWAN: I just love-- Yeah, I was gonna ask, did you live near the sea? I was just imagining you on your own little boat and you're like, "Nope." GABE: Not at all. I lived in the woods, in the forest. And maybe that was part of why I loved it. I was terrified of boats. But like, I would, you know, if Jack Sparrow was like, "All right, Gabe. We're getting on a ship and we're sailing the sea." I'm like, "Say less. I-- wherever you need me. I will -- ROWAN: I am there. GABE: -- scrub the deck. I will fire the gun off swinging on a rope above the sea. And I might die but I'm gonna die happy. ROWAN: That's hilarious to me because obviously, I mean, I feel like it's not really a spoiler to say Jack Sparrow in those movies is not the most moral of peoples. GABE: No! ROWAN: So, I just love the idea that you're just like, "Whatever you say, Jack, I'm there." GABE: Yup. ROWAN: Like, it doesn't even. And he's like, "Oh, I don't have to convince?" You're like, "Jack, listen, I'm already on the boat. Like, it's fine." GABE: Yeah. You didn't, Jack-- you. I'm here. I get-- I'm basically committed to whatever happens next. ROWAN: Have you been to the new revamped Pirates of the Caribbean ride? GABE: Yes, I have. ROWAN: Have Jack in it. GABE: I was at Disney World in October, and, like, Pirates of the Caribbean was one of the things I explicitly wanted to do, and the animatronics are so good. It's actually very startling. ROWAN: It's-- it's really funny because obviously, you've got all of the old animatronics, which are, let's just say not as good. GABE: Yup. ROWAN: And it's-- and then just as one weirdly human, like, figure in them. GABE: Yup. ROWAN: Which I greatly enjoyed. So I, as I mentioned, Elizabeth Swann, I'm an Elizabeth Swann apologist. I basically just think that those movies, everyone I understand the allure of Jack Sparrow, and maybe it is the lesbian in me, Gabe. I'm not-- I-- I'm not lying, I might be biased, but I feel like, there's obviously he's such a memorable character. GABE: You're not biased, you're lesbiased. ROWAN: Yeah, lesbiased, that oh, you know what, I'm using that now. Never-- never will the word bias cross my lips anymore. I will be writing it in emails. I will explain nothing. GABE: Lesbias. Oh shit, that's funny. Damn. ROWAN: But they-- they you-- honestly, add comedian to the list of stuff you do, Gabe. GABE: Thank you. ROWAN: Because you honestly do everything and it was about time that you added another string to the– to the bow. GABE: That's true. ROWAN: Which I assume you can also shoot? You seem like the kind of person who would know how to shoot arrows. GABE: I have two bows and three crossbows. ROWAN: Of course you do. Of course you do. Yeah, that was not even a question. But yeah, Elizabeth Swann. The movies are just about her. The whole, like, Will especially. I love Will Turner. Like, he's a lovely character and everything, but all he does is get rescued by Jack or Elizabeth. GABE: Yeah. ROWAN: And then just go around going, "Elizabeth. Elizabeth." GABE: That's true. ROWAN: Like, the entire time. That's his entire role. And like, I love that for him. GABE: Okay, so I'm-- I'm gonna say, I feel like the reason that I don't like Elizabeth, is because they intentionally made her an ass, and they didn't have to. They could have made her way more of an endearing figure that was just a powerful woman. And they instead tried to-- it's like, they were, like, trying to pretend that they were committing to a damsel in distress. But then, it's like, but no, she's like, powerful, but I'm like, why did you make her powerful, and then, like, snarky. ROWAN: Okay, but here's the thing, Gabe. GABE: Yes. ROWAN: Have you? Have you heard of the concept of a mean lesbian? GABE: No, because lesbians aren't usually mean to me. ROWAN: I mean, to your face, Gabe, but no, the-- yeah, there's a sort of mean lesbian vibe meme kind of-- kind of thing going around. And maybe in my head, I'm like, "Maybe she just fits into that." I just think she's-- My-- my full, like, biggest complaint with that series is that it ended with Elizabeth just being like, "I guess I'll never go on the sea again. See you-- see you seven years, Will." GABE: God! ROWAN: Like, what? GABE: The thing is-- the thing that bothered me was I really wanted to like her character. I really want and I liked the concept of her character. I liked the actress. I felt like they copped out when they were writing her-- writing her story. It's like, we're going to make her a side character. And then we're going to make her a main character, and then they basically sidelined her again, and I'm like, "Pick one. Pick one and then make her, like, give her the story that she deserves. Instead of, like, pretending that she's-- They acted like she was a half-replacement for Jack when she's her own powerful individual character." ROWAN: Again, I must say to you, Gabe, have you considered the outfit she wears in the Singapore sequence? GABE: I didn't say she wasn't hot. She-- she can-- Look, if Will is on the sea, I will happily be her, like, land man. I don't-- Look, anything that she wants. I look like Davy Jones, Jack Sparrow, and Calypso had a triangle baby. Like, I'll hook her up. That's fine, but I'm just --. ROWAN: She'd be into that. GABE: Probably. I'm just-- I'm just mad they didn't give me the Elizabeth Swann that should have gotten the attention she deserved. It's like they wanted to give us a powerful femme character and they're like, "But... No, nevermind. Everybody, nevermind." ROWAN: Listen, when I finally make my video essay about how underappreciated Elizabeth Swann is, truly the mark of success will be moving the dial on your dislike of this character even slightly, that's going to be my aim for it. But I really enjoy the fact that both of us have parts the Caribbean as one of our queer awakening sort of movies. I love that that was the one that you started with. Not even planned, listeners at home, that was just the power of-- the power -- GABE: Friendship. ROWAN: -- of Disney, I guess. The power of Disney's IP. They knew what they were doing. I just at any time, assume that they're making another part of the Caribbean movie. I feel like the world is always in a state of having had one announced. GABE: Yeah. ROWAN: The watching one, or, like, waiting for the next one to be announced. I feel like it's never gonna go. I thought that, like, Jungle Cruise was them trying to be like, I remember that. Remember that franchise we did about a ride? And I don't-- I don't quite know if it's got the-- got the chops. GABE: Yeah. You're probably right. ROWAN: Sweet, shall we, in that case, move from the high seas, I assume. GABE: Yes. ROWAN: Although I don't know, maybe every single movie that you're about to mention is pirate related. GABE: No, no, but that's fair. ROWAN: To your second choice. GABE: We're going to move from the sea of water to the sea of sand. ROWAN: Ooh. GABE: We're gonna talk a little bit about Aladdin. ROWAN: I already as soon as you said sand, I was like, "Well, there could only be one option here." GABE: Picking Aladdin or Jasmine is impossible. They are. Don't-- Don't at me. I don't care. Be- So, okay, they were both beautiful people. ROWAN: Inside and out. GABE: Yeah, like, oh, but they were both incredibly charming, and it was nice seeing a relationship that they had close relationships with so many different types of people. And the way that they expressed it or the way that they enjoyed it, it wasn't, like, tainted unless the people were distinctly evil and bad. Like, Jasmine's relationship with her dad was genuinely, like, for the-- for the most part healthy, until we look at, like, the weird underlying tones. But like, at face value, it was good. Seeing Aladdin, this man, get into a situation, come out with a whole bunch of possibility for wealth, glory, and all of that. And then, just take a route of, like, personal happiness. That actually is what, like, enticed me so much because, like, that portrayal of a man is not something that I felt, like, I got a lot of younger, and it made me admire his character so much more like, "Yes. Like, that's-- that's the kind of person that I want to see and I would want to be with." ROWAN: Amazing. I-- yeah, fully agree on that. I feel like I need to rewatch Aladdin. I think I don't know what shit since I was a lot younger, but I found the entire thing entirely charming as a child. GABE: Yeah. ROWAN: Also, absolutely banging soundtrack obviously. GABE: Yes. ROWAN: Cannot be ignored. GABE: [12:16] scoundrel. ROWAN: How do you feel about the live action remake? Is that something you've dipped your toes into? GABE: I actually haven't seen it. I'm not sure if it'll give me the same, the same levels of excitement. Have you seen it? ROWAN: I have. It was very forgettable. I have a very good friend who would probably, like, lock me in the darkest deepest dungeon for saying this because she was very into the-- to Aladdin in every single way, shape, or form. But I was, like, very forgettable. Prince Ali the sequence that was that song was an absolute bop. GABE: Ooh yeah. ROWAN: But it wasn't necessary. They tried to add a little bit of, like, Jasmine as a feminist. And I was like,…
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