Positioning with April Dunford

Latest Episodes:

Mapping Positioning to a Story Using Insight Sep 21, 2023

Show notes

Today, I explore how to position your sales pitch storytelling arch. You’ll learn:

What people get wrong when starting their sales pitch
How not to start a sales pitch
Why you should start your sales pitch with an insight that is unique to your company
How to structure your sales pitch storytelling arch

Don’t forget you can now pre-order my next book, Sales Pitch, on Amazon! If you’ve enjoyed the content I’ve been sharing, this is the most wonderful way for you to show your support. I sincerely appreciate it!

Amazon Canada

Amazon USA

Amazon UK

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If you want to skip ahead:

(00:00) Today’s topic and book announcement

(01:52) The initial sales pitch

(04:30) Sales discovery

(07:38) Starting with the problem

(09:18) Change in the world

(12:00) How to start your sales pitch

(16:20) Leading with expertise

(18:35) The sales pitch storytelling arch

(22:20) Thanks for listening

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Where To Find April Dunford:

Podcast Website: ⁠⁠https://www.positioning.show/⁠⁠

Personal Website: ⁠⁠https://www.aprildunford.com/⁠⁠

LinkedIn: ⁠⁠https://www.linkedin.com/in/aprildunford/⁠⁠

Instagram: ⁠⁠https://www.instagram.com/aprildunford/⁠⁠

Twitter: ⁠⁠https://twitter.com/aprildunford⁠⁠

TikTok: ⁠https://www.tiktok.com/@positioningshow⁠

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Production and marketing by ⁠⁠https://penname.co/⁠

How to Use Positioning in Sales Qualification and Discovery Sep 14, 2023

Show notes

Today, I share everything you need to know about how to use positioning in your sales qualification and discovery. I discuss:

The different forms of qualification and BANT criteria
The difference between qualification and discovery
Why discovery is so important for your first sales call
How buyers and sellers find out more about each other during discovery
My unique sales pitch structure

Also, you can officially pre-order my next book, Sales Pitch, on Amazon! I’m incredibly proud of this book and can’t wait to share it with you.

Here are the links for pre-order:

Amazon Canada

Amazon USA

Amazon UK

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If you want to skip ahead:

(00:00) Intro and today’s topic

(01:40) Sales and qualifying leads

(06:07) The importance of quality

(07:10) What is qualification

(08:50) BANT criteria

(11:38) A breakdown of discovery

(13:20) My sales pitch structure

(16:52) LevelJump example

(21:18) Thanks for listening

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Where To Find April Dunford:

Podcast Website: ⁠https://www.positioning.show/⁠

Personal Website: ⁠https://www.aprildunford.com/⁠

LinkedIn: ⁠https://www.linkedin.com/in/aprildunford/⁠

Instagram: ⁠https://www.instagram.com/aprildunford/⁠

Twitter: ⁠https://twitter.com/aprildunford⁠

TikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@positioningshow

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Production and marketing by⁠ https://penname.co/⁠

Positioning at a Startup Vs. a Big Company Sep 07, 2023

Show notes

Today’s episode is all about how to position startups and big companies. While there is some overlap, the two can be very different. I cover a lot of ground, including:

The three things startups need to focus on for positioning
Why half of B2B purchase decisions end in no decision
How not to mistake marketing problems as positioning problems
Determining when a positioning shift is needed for a big company
Why the size of a company can complicate positioning
The difference between company, division, and product positioning
How to handle positioning when an acquisition occurs

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If you want to skip ahead:

(00:00) Welcome to today’s show!

(01:32) How to position for startups

(05:43) Startups must try this

(07:55) Investor pitch creep

(10:00) Marketing vs positioning problems

(13:25) Category creation for startups

(15:00) How to position for big companies

(19:20) Umbrella, division, and product positioning

(23:20) Positioning after an acquisition

(25:10) What isn’t different between the two

(26:50) A big announcement

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Where To Find April Dunford:

Podcast Website: https://www.positioning.show/

Personal Website: https://www.aprildunford.com/

LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/aprildunford/

Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/aprildunford/

Twitter: https://twitter.com/aprildunford

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Production and marketing by https://penname.co/

Mastering Jobs Theory With Bob Moesta Aug 31, 2023

Show notes

Today I’m joined by Bob Moesta, the co-creator of the Jobs To Be Done framework, a concept he developed alongside the late Clayton Christensen. Bob's expertise spans a wide range of accomplishments, including the successful launch of over 3,500 new products, services, and businesses. He's also the CEO and founder of the Re-Wired Group, as well as the brains behind several other startup ventures. We discuss:

Why context matters as much as the product
Why people don’t buy products, they hire them. And how you can then design better products once you understand this
The famous milkshake story and how it led to a whole new category of yogurt smoothies
The importance of looking for the causes someone buys something, rather than convincing them to buy something
Why you need to be problem-aware
The distinction that positioning should be about guiding and helping customers to buy, rather than selling

I’m beyond excited for you to listen to today’s episode.

You’ll also hear that my latest book is launching soon! If you want to find out more, you can sign up for email updates here https://www.aprildunford.com/books

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If you want to skip ahead:

(00:00) Our guest, Bob Moesta

(04:50) What is jobs theory

(08:49) The famous milkshake story

(12:38) Competitive alternatives and their importance

(15:36) Why the camera industry failed

(17:01) How Intercom scaled massively

(22:20) Always be problem aware first

(24:12) Why positioning is about buying, not selling

(29:20) Bob’s take on product market fit

(35:01) Thanks for listening

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Where To Find April Dunford:

Podcast Website: https://www.positioning.show/

Personal Website: https://www.aprildunford.com/

LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/aprildunford/

Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/aprildunford/

Twitter: https://twitter.com/aprildunford

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Referenced:

• Competing Against Luck: https://www.amazon.com/Competing-Against-Luck-Innovation-Customer/dp/0062435612

• Jobs To Be Done: https://hbr.org/2016/09/know-your-customers-jobs-to-be-done

• Intercom: https://www.intercom.com/

• Disruptive Theory: https://hbr.org/2015/12/what-is-disruptive-innovation

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Production and marketing by https://penname.co/

How To Avoid Bad Marketing and Sales Aug 24, 2023

Show notes

Today I dive deep into how to avoid bad marketing and sales and why sometimes this includes actively sharing who your product isn’t for. I go into greater detail about the following:

Understanding that your product is only a part of your business
How to craft great marketing and sales
Why a formal positioning process impacts your sales and marketing strategy
The core of sales and marketing is understanding your differentiated value
How to build the story for your positioning

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If you want to skip ahead:

(00:00) Today’s topic: how to avoid terrible marketing and sales

(01:55) Why thinking the product is the only thing is dangerous

(03:35) Ask yourself this question

(07:24) How to craft great marketing and sales

(10:37) Understand your differentiated value

(11:05) How to craft the story for your sales team

(17:05) Thanks for listening

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Where To Find April Dunford:

Podcast Website: https://www.positioning.show/

Personal Website: https://www.aprildunford.com/

LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/aprildunford/

Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/aprildunford/

Twitter: https://twitter.com/aprildunford

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Referenced:

Everybody Hates Marketers: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/everyone-hates-marketers/id1221256195

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Production and marketing by https://penname.co/

The Art of Discerning Sound Marketing and Sales Advice Aug 17, 2023

Show notes

Today I cover how to know if you're getting good marketing and sales advice, and why it’s so important to carve your own path. I discuss:

• What I learned from traditional marketing advice

• Why traditional marketing advice falls short

• The story of how a fax machine campaign became my best-performing initiative

• Why you should not blindly follow popular marketing trends

• The importance of figuring out what works for YOU

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If you want to skip ahead:

(00:00) Today’s topic: how to know if you’re getting good marketing and sales advice

(02:42) What I learned from traditional marketing education

(06:46) Specific examples of how traditional marketing education falls short

(13:52) Why you should be wary of blanket statements

(15:47) The story of how a fax machine campaign became our best-performing initiative

(26:14) How to decipher good vs bad marketing advice

(32:34) Why I’m always careful in the advice I give

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Where To Find April Dunford:

Podcast Website: https://www.positioning.show/

Personal Website: https://www.aprildunford.com/

LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/aprildunford/

Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/aprildunford/

Twitter: https://twitter.com/aprildunford

—

Referenced:

• Chrysler: https://www.chrysler.com/

• Volvo: https://www.volvocars.com/us

• Pepsi: https://www.pepsi.com/

• Liquid Death: https://liquiddeath.com/

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Production and marketing by https://penname.co/

How To Develop A Point of View For Your Company Aug 10, 2023

Show notes

Today I explore developing a point of view for your business. I cover:

How to build your company’s points of view
What to do if you don’t know your point of view
Two examples from IBM and Sampler
Why features don’t matter, value does
How to apply this to your sales and marketing

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If you want to skip ahead:

(00:00) How to develop a point of view for your business

(03:07) How Sampler built a point of view for their market

(06:20) What if you don’t know your point of view

(09:00) Why features don’t matter

(10:11) How IBM handled its own point of view

(15:15) How to apply point of view in sales and marketing

(17:38) Thanks for listening

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Where To Find April Dunford:

Podcast Website: https://www.positioning.show/

Personal Website: https://www.aprildunford.com/

LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/aprildunford/

Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/aprildunford/

Twitter: https://twitter.com/aprildunford

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Referenced:

Sampler https://www.sampler.io/

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Production and marketing by https://penname.co/

So you’ve nailed your product positioning. Now what? Aug 03, 2023

Show notes

Today I dive into what to do with your positioning once you’ve nailed it. I cover:

• How to capture positioning

• How positioning makes its way into messaging

• Why you should create a messaging document and what ends up happening if you don’t

• What the market needs in order to understand our differentiated value

• How to go from positioning to branding

• How to take boilerplate messaging and apply it globally

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If you want to skip ahead:

(00:00) How to put your new positioning to use

(01:00) A quick recap of building and testing your positioning

(02:48) The messaging document

(05:00) Messaging drift

(06:13) The contents of the messaging document

(07:24) Who should own the messaging document

(08:03) How changes should be approached

(12:38) Helping customers understand your POV

(15:08) LevelJump’s calculator example

(17:27) Postman example

(19:50) How to go from positioning to branding

(24:10) How to take boilerplate messaging and apply it globally

(27:34) Proof of value and the importance of local proof

(28:46) An example where core positioning varied regionally

(30:11) Thanks for listening

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Where To Find April Dunford:

Podcast Website: https://www.positioning.show/

Personal Website: https://www.aprildunford.com/

LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/aprildunford/

Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/aprildunford/

Twitter: https://twitter.com/aprildunford

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Referenced:

• LevelJump: https://www.crunchbase.com/organization/leveljump

• Postman: https://www.postman.com/

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Production and marketing by https://penname.co/

Help Scout's CEO Nick Francis Shares the Evolution of Their Positioning Jul 27, 2023

Show notes

I sat down with Nick Francis, the Co-Founder and CEO of Help Scout. A few years ago I worked directly with Nick and his team to tighten up their positioning and brought him on to share their story. Together we discuss:

• What the positioning of Help Scout looked like during the early days

• How their positioning evolved over time

• Why they utilized outside help

• How he took the sales narrative he worked on with me and turned it into a pitch

• How their strategy has changed as they’ve moved upmarket

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In This Episode, I Cover:

(00:00) About my guest, Nick Francis

(02:05) The origin story of Help Scout

(04:50) How Techstars informed their messaging early on

(06:00) How they differentiated themselves from other help desk companies

(08:28) Where early inbound customers came from

(09:58) Copycat competitors, and how Help Scout thinks about competition

(11:57) Identifying key differentiators

(13:20) Why they decided to bring in outside help (me) and what they learned

(15:29) The evolution of their sales pitch

(18:42) Why you should always test your sales pitch first

(20:27) Who was responsible for building the sales pitch

(21:24) Signals it was time to revisit the pitch

(24:58) The future of Help Scout

(26:27) How the product itself reinforces their positioning

(28:42) How their strategy has changed as they’ve moved upmarket

(30:17) Why positioning is so important

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Where To Find April Dunford:

Podcast Website: https://www.positioning.show/

Personal Website: https://www.aprildunford.com/

LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/aprildunford/

Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/aprildunford/

Twitter: https://twitter.com/aprildunford

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Where To Find Nick Francis:

Website: http://nickfranc.is/

LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/nickfrancis1/

Twitter: https://twitter.com/nickfrancis?lang=en

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Referenced:

• Help Scout: https://www.helpscout.com/

• Techstars: https://www.techstars.com/

• David Cohen: https://www.linkedin.com/in/davidgcohen/

• Zendesk: https://www.zendesk.com/

• Intercom: https://www.intercom.com/

• Front: https://front.com/

Production and marketing by https://penname.co/

Crafting a Persuasive Sales Pitch (Part 2) Jul 20, 2023

Show notes

Today we continue our conversation on translating your positioning into a sales pitch. You’ll learn:

• Popular pitch structures (discovery-led, problem-solution, venture-informed) and where they fall short

• Common problems to avoid when crafting your sales pitch

• Why the “new way” doesn’t necessarily beat the “old way”

• How focusing on the future of your product can backfire

• What conventional storytelling techniques can teach you about pitching

• A tried and true storytelling structure that works for sales pitches

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In This Episode, I Cover:

(00:00) Sales pitches and product walkthroughs

(05:35) The discovery-led sales pitch

(08:35) The problem-solution sales pitch

(10:26) The venture-informed sales pitch

(13:22) Old way vs new way

(16:33) No decision losses

(17:43) Takeaways from the standard pitch structures we’ve covered

(18:29) Conventional storytelling: where it does and does not work

(22:23) The IBM sales pitch structure (the challenger sales methodology)

(25:23) How to start your pitch and the vital components to include

(28:50) My upcoming book

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Where To Find April Dunford:

Podcast Website: https://www.positioning.show/

Personal Website: https://www.aprildunford.com/

LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/aprildunford/

Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/aprildunford/

Twitter: https://twitter.com/aprildunford

—

Referenced:

• Building a StoryBrand: Clarify Your Message So Customers Will Listen: https://www.amazon.com/Building-StoryBrand-Clarify-Message-Customers/dp/0718033329/

• Star Wars: https://www.starwars.com/

• Matt Dixon on The Positioning Show: https://www.positioning.show/overcoming-customer-indecision-and-challenging-conventional-sales-wisdom-with-matt-dixon/

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Production and marketing by https://penname.co/

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