In Episode 70 of Legal Spirits, Center Director Mark Movsesian speaks with Dan Harre, Deputy Director of Save Armenia, about a significant—and controversial—draft agreement between Armenia and Azerbaijan. Brokered last month at the White House, the terms reflect a major realignment in the region: Armenia relinquishes any claim to Nagorno Karabakh, Azerbaijan backs off earlier demands for extraterritorial control, and the United States gains a 99-year lease on a key new transit route.
The episode explores how U.S. foreign policy, Christian advocacy, and strategic infrastructure intersect in the South Caucasus. Dan offers a perspective from within the U.S. advocacy world—one shaped by a broader movement to defend Christian communities in places like Iraq and Syria. The episode also considers how groups like Save Armenia navigate diplomatic tensions between Armenia and Israel, and how this moment relates to past decisions about American involvement in Armenian affairs, including the post-WWI mandate the U.S. ultimately declined.
What role did American Christian organizations play in this deal? What’s in it for the United States? And is this a turning point in Armenia’s future? Listen in!
In this episode of Legal Spirits, Center Director Mark Movsesian talks with legal scholar Steven D. Smith about a question that goes to the heart of American law and politics: What happens when people stop believing in “the consent of the governed”? Drawing on Smith’s new paper, The Collapse of Consent, they explore how this once-powerful idea has shifted over time—from a principle rooted in natural law and divine authority to a secular fiction that’s becoming harder to sustain. In an increasingly polarized society, can America’s founding narrative still hold us together? A deep and thought-provoking conversation about legitimacy, identity, and the future of our legal order.
Legal Spirits 068: Religion at the Court: October Term 2024 Recap
Jul 08, 2025
In this episode of Legal Spirits, we review the Supreme Court’s major religion cases from the October 2024 Term. From religious charter schools to religious exemptions to parental rights in public education, the Court addressed long-standing issues—and, in one case, made a dramatic move. Join Center Director Mark Movsesian and guest John McGinnis as they unpack the implications of Drummond, Catholic Charities Bureau, and Mahmoud v. Taylor.
In this episode of Legal Spirits, we examine a new Washington State law that eliminates the clergy-penitent privilege in child abuse reporting. The law requires clergy to report suspected abuse, even if they learn about it through Confession and other confidential spiritual communications—raising serious questions under the Free Exercise Clause. Host Mark Movsesian and guest Marc DeGirolami discuss the legal framework, historical background, and broader implications for religious liberty. Listen in!
Legal Spirits 066: The International Moot Court Competition in Law & Religion
Apr 23, 2025
We’re back after a bit of a hiatus with a new Legal Spirits episode. Center Director Mark Movsesian talks with Professors Andrea Pin and Luca Vanoni about the International Moot Court Competition in Law and Religion, an annual event that gathers law students from the US and Europe to argue a case before panels representing the European Court of Human Rights and the US Supreme Court. Andrea and Luca discuss how they came up with the idea for this unique competition, its pedagogical goals, and why it has succeeded for a decade and counting. Listen in!
In this episode, Fordham Law Professors Sean Griffith and Richard Squire join Mattone Center Director Mark Movsesian to talk about their experience leading a discussion of CS Lewis’s Mere Christianity in a student reading group this past semester. Sean and Richard discuss their goals in establishing the group, their students’ response to Lewis–in particular, his defense of natural law and Christian ethics–and the value of taking Christianity seriously as a matter of faith and intellect at a 21st-century American law school. A fascinating and wide-ranging discussion. Listen in!
Legal Spirits 064: A City Upon a Hill
Nov 19, 2024
Ever since President Ronald Reagan popularized the phrase in the 1980s, American leaders have referred to the United States as the “shining city on a hill.” Reagan adapted the phrase from John Winthrop, the 17th century governor of the Massachusetts Bay Colony, who himself took it from the Gospel of Matthew. But the message has changed down the centuries. What began as a warning to carry out faithfully a mission from God became a boast about the United States and the benefits of human freedom. In this episode, Notre Dame historian Don Drakeman explores the original meaning of Winthrop’s text (Don argues it was in part a sales pitch to Puritan investors!) and its meaning today. Both are part of the American tradition: which meaning is the “real” one? Listen in!
Legal Spirits 063: Ethnic Cleansing in Nagorno-Karabakh, One Year Later
Sep 18, 2024
Ganzdasar Monastery, a 13th Century Armenian Christian site in Nagorno-Karabakh (Wikipedia)
In September 2023, in violation of an order from the International Court of Justice, Azerbaijan ethnically cleansed the region of Nagorno-Karabakh of its 120,000 Christian Armenian inhabitants. In this episode, human-rights attorney Karnig Kerkonian describes the events of a year ago and efforts to hold Azerbaijan responsible in international forums. He also explains the role that religion, understood as a communal and cultural marker, has had in Azerbaijan’s campaign against Christian Armenians. Listen in.
Legal Spirits 062: Can a Public School Ask Kids to State Their Religion?
Aug 28, 2024
(Robert Sciarrino/The Star-Ledger)
When the Cedar Grove School District in New Jersey surveyed students about their religious identities and other sensitive matters, St. John’s Law Professor Patricia Montana went into action. She and other parents sued the district for violating student privacy laws, including the Protection of Pupil Rights Amendment, a federal statute. Last month, the US Department of Education ruled in the parents’ favor. In this episode, Montana talks about her successful legal challenge and explains why she and other parents fought the district’s policy. Listen in!
Last month, in a much-watched case, the Oklahoma Supreme Court ruled that a new Catholic charter school, St. Isidore of Seville Catholic Virtual School, violates the First Amendment’s Establishment Clause–and, alternatively, that denying St. Isidore a charter does not violate the school’s rights under the Free Exercise Clause. In this episode, Center Director Mark Movsesian and Notre Dame Law Professor Richard Garnett debate whether the Oklahoma court got the decision right. Is a Catholic charter school constitutional? And are religiously affiliated charter schools a good idea in the first place? Listen in!
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