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Interchange Recharged

Clean tech, green finance and energy innovation are the three lanes on the road to a successful global energy transition. At the intersection of these lanes is a place where ideas on finance, technology and policy are shared and debated. That intersection is Interchange Recharged.

Your host is Sylvia Leyva Martinez, principal analyst and research director at Wood Mackenzie. When Sylvia isn’t tracking the technologies and markets driving the build-out of renewable power, she’s speaking with visionaries, entrepreneurs, policy-makers and energy analysts to explore the newest developments in renewable technology, explain the ideas on global energy policy that could accelerate the energy transition, and identify new funding and financial models that could solve the biggest challenges we face on the way to net zero.

Sylvia and her guests bring you data and forecasts on clean technology, climate science, and offer predictions on the build out of utility-scale projects and the future of green finance.

What does the surge in data-centre demand mean for the grid, and who pays for it? What’s happening in global EV adoption and development? What’s the forecast for solar, one of the major success stories of renewable energy in the last ten years? What does the data tell us about the future of hydrogen, of nuclear, or of low-carbon power? These are examples of the insights and detailed analyses you can expect bi-weekly on Tuesdays at 7am ET.

If you like The Energy Transition Show, Catalyst with Shayle Kann, The Big Switch from Columbia University, Open Circuit with Jigar Shah or The Green Blueprint, you’ll enjoy Interchange Recharged.

Want to get involved with the show? Reach out to podcasts@woodmac.com to:

Bring Bridget and Interchange Recharged to your event

Be a guest on the show

Sponsor an episode

Ask a question to Bridget or one of our guests

Check out another leading clean tech global podcast by Wood Mackenzie, Energy Gang, at woodmac.com/podcasts/the-energy-gang

Wood Mackenzie is the leading global data and analytics solutions provider for renewables, energy and natural resources. Learn more about Wood Mackenzie on the official website: https://www.woodmac.com/

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Latest Episodes:

How banks and government are working together to achieve net zero in the UK May 07, 2024

Show notes

In the UK, the collaboration between banks and policymakers is crucial for accelerating the energy transition. The financial sector in the UK managed assets worth over 9 trillion UK pounds (11.3 trillion USD) as of 2020, with a considerable portion needing realignment towards sustainable investments to meet the 2050 net zero goal. The Climate Change Committee, an independent advisory board to the UK government, estimates 50 billion UK pounds, or US$60 billion per year, is needed to meet net zero goals.

Heather Buchanan is co-founder of Bankers For Net Zero, an initiative aiming to involve banks with governments to make better investment and policy decisions for the energy transition. One significant need for investment is the retrofitting of the housing stock; over half of the UK’s homes are old and inefficient. This a major challenge for banks. With host David Banmiller, Heather explores the financial implications of decarbonizing financed emissions from all banking products by 2050.

Plus, the importance of Energy Performance Certificates and measuring efficiency, the financial incentives to de-risk clean energy investments, and how B4NZ is working to engage banks, government and NGOs to drive us to net zero. Collaboration is crucial, but it’s a constant struggle.

For more information visit woodmac.com/podcasts. The Interchange is back at Wood Mackenzie’s Solar Energy and Storage Summit, in San Francisco on June 12. To secure your ticket visit woodmac.com/events/solar-energy-storage-summit.

In this episode:

00:00:08: Importance of collaboration between banks and policymakers for energy transition

00:00:43: About Bankers for Net Zero initiative

00:01:20: Discussion begins about financial community involvement in energy transition

00:01:35: Introduction and milestones of Bankers for Net Zero

00:04:19: Focus area for Bankers for Net Zero

00:06:06: Challenges faced in housing issue and retrofit issue

00:08:33: Introduction to National Retrofit Hub and role of energy performance certificate

00:10:40: Ideas to de-risk financial burden of energy efficiency

00:12:24: Coordinating energy efficiency on a larger scale

00:14:41: Importance of convincing constituents

00:15:22: Role of communities in the energy efficiency transition

00:16:20: Designing policy to support the energy efficiency efforts

00:18:01: Importance and issues of EPC in retrofitting

00:20:00: Balancing energy security and costs

00:23:35: The Role of Financial Institutions & SME's

00:25:50: Changes to GHG Protocols

00:27:04: Introduction to Project Perseus

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What’s the energy transition going to cost? Apr 23, 2024

Show notes

Estimates for the cost of decarbonising could be inaccurate. What does that mean for investment and policy-making?

About $1.2 trillion is invested annually in climate technology and infrastructure worldwide, with significant portions allocated to China due to its accelerated decarbonization goals. However, experts argue that about $9 trillion could be needed annually to effectively counter climate change, indicating a substantial gap in current funding. Debate continues over the economic feasibility of such costs, to the detriment of progress, but what if the cost was actually far less? RMI, the research and clean energy advocacy group, says that this may indeed be the case. These forecasts could be overinflated by trillions of dollars. If that’s true, what will it mean for investors, markets and policy?

We are joined by Dan Goldman, managing partner at Clean Energy Ventures, a VC that funds startups developing early stage breakthrough technologies. He says the there’s a significant investment shortfall – regardless of the total cost of decarbonising – currently to stabilise global temperatures. He discusses a downturn in venture capital investments in climate tech, particularly affecting early-stage companies and innovation in new technologies. Challenges remain in scaling up clean energy technologies due to a combination of high interest rates, inflationary pressures, and supply chain disruptions, which increase costs and complicate project implementations.

There's a specific shortfall in investment for infrastructure necessary for large-scale renewable energy implementations, like wind and solar, which are essential for a robust energy transition. We discuss how this could be addressed, and analyse the current economic environment, characterized by high costs and uncertain returns.

Is it these barriers that are hindering significant capital flow into this sector, or the forecasted cost for decarbonising global energy systems? How can global financial strategies be adjusted to accelerate the necessary investments in clean energy and technology? Find out on the show.

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Can we rely on nuclear as a source of clean, reliable power? Apr 09, 2024

Show notes

SMRs: a new horizon in Nuclear Power.

This week on The Interchange: Recharged, we are joined by Ted Nordhaus, Executive Director at the Breakthrough Institute, an environmental research centre in Berkley, California. They focus on finding technological solutions to environmental problems.

Achieving a net-zero emission grid by 2050, they claim, with a significant nuclear component would not only be feasible but also cost-effective compared to over-reliance on variable renewable energy sources. This approach requires substantial investment, estimated between US$150 to US$220 billion by 2035, escalating to over a trillion dollars by 2050. Together they discuss the likelihood that the private sector will drive this investment, provided that nuclear technologies are economically viable and regulatory uncertainties are addressed. They look at the Build Nuclear Now campaign, which aims to rally public support for nuclear energy and drive towards grassroots pro-nuclear advocacy. Is this a sign that public sentiment is changing?

The main challenges hindering the adoption of nuclear energy include regulatory hurdles, financial barriers and ongoing concerns surrounding nuclear safety. Ted explains that regulatory reform and public sector commitment could overcome these obstacles. The Nuclear Energy Innovation and Modernisation Act are examples of a policy aimed at modernising the regulatory environment, to facilitate the licensing of advanced nuclear reactors.

So, are SMRs the solution to everything nuclear? They’re designed to produce between 50 to 300 MW of electricity per module, which is about one-third of the generation capacity of traditional nuclear power reactors. NuScale's design (listen back to our episode from April last year for more on this) for instance, is for a 77 MW module, with plans to deploy modules in groups that can generate up to 924 MW. The U.S. Department of Energy (DOE) has been actively supporting SMR development, investing over US$600 million in the past decade to assist in the design, licensing and siting of new SMR technologies in the U.S. The technology seems to be there, as does the baseline investment.

What’s next for the nuclear industry? Listen to find out.

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$802 billion on the horizon: the current state of the EV market Mar 26, 2024

Show notes

New battery technology could get EV prices down and drive mass adoption

In this week’s episode of Wood Mackenzie’s The Interchange Recharged, we look at the rapidly evolving landscape of EVs and the battery technology that powers them. Market sentiment in the US is up and down; despite a 40% sales increase from the last quarter of 2022 to the same period in 2023, the industry is struggling with competition from China amid a price war. Batteries have a critical role to play in accelerating mass EV adoption and so their dramatic cost reduction - nearly 90% over the past 14 years – has potentially sparked an EV revolution.

Joining us is Haresh Kamath, an expert in energy storage and clean tech from the Electric Power Research Institute (EPRI). Together, they explore the nuances of battery economics, the potential of cutting-edge technologies like solid-state batteries and the imperative of developing efficient recycling methods to sustain this green momentum.

They examine the challenges of scaling EV infrastructure and supply chains, looking forward at the technologies that will continue to drive down costs and extend EV ranges.

Subscribe to The Interchange Recharged on your preferred podcast platform, and join the conversation on X – we’re @interchangeshow.

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A ground-breaking new method of sustainable aviation fuel production Mar 12, 2024

Show notes

A breakthrough way of producing hydrocarbons, crucial to the aviation industry, could reduce costs and accelerate decarbonisation.

Sustainable aviation fuel (SAF) is a key component in the aviation industry's path to decarbonization, which contributes to only 2% of global carbon emissions but is actively seeking cleaner solutions. Airbus and other aerospace companies are leading the charge, with Airbus integrating over 11 million litres of SAF in its operations in 2023, reducing carbon emissions significantly. The industry aims to increase SAF production to 17.5 billion litres by 2030, supported by initiatives like the IRA.

On this episode of Wood Mackenzie's The Interchange Recharged, we speak with Andrew Symes, founder and CEO of OXCCU. They’re developing a more efficient way of converting CO2 and hydrogen into hydrocarbons, potentially a monumental step towards more scalable and environmentally-friendly fuels.

Despite technological advancements, challenges in financing, regulatory support, and talent acquisition persist. SAF's integration with existing aviation infrastructure without the need for modifications is one key benefit; it could create a smoother transition to greener aviation, with expectations for SAF to achieve cost parity with Jet A fuel (the current standard) as technology and scale improve. The SAF industry enjoys broad support from airlines, governments and regulatory initiatives, who are pushing for increased SAF adoption towards a net-zero future by 2050. The technology behind SAF, and as Andrew explains, the science behind OXCCU, not only promises to revolutionise aviation but also has applications in producing chemicals and plastics, signalling a broader impact on sustainability across various sectors and the goal of a circular economy.

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How to create the skilled workforce of 2030 Feb 27, 2024

Show notes

Half of the energy workforce is employed in clean energy technologies. By 2030, over 10 million new jobs will need to be filled as the energy transition continues. China, for example, employs 3 million workers in clean energy manufacturing – accounting for 80% of solar PV and EV battery manufacturing jobs globally. Skill shortages are as significant a bottleneck as lack of investment or supply chain constraints, so how can the industry ensure there’s enough people to build, maintain and design clean energy infrastructure?

On the show today, we are joined by Caleigh Andrews, Energy Analyst and Modeller at the International Energy Agency. The IEA emphasises the need for clear policies that drive demand for clean technologies, in order to attract and retain skilled labor. Reskilling and attracting new people to the energy workforce require a combination of market incentives and political will, so what are these incentives? And what can governments do to incentivise reskilling?

AI can play a role in easing the skilling burden and establishing standardised credentials, but with manufacturing and maintenance a large part of it, are the use cases for AI limited?

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Cutting the red tape around geothermal energy Feb 13, 2024

Show notes

Recent legislation in the US promises to be a boon for geothermal energy production.

In January, the US House Energy and Commerce Committee passed a bipartisan bill that could have a big impact on the geothermal sector. Effectively putting geothermal on the same footing as oil and gas - by excluding geothermal development from strict NEPA rules – the bill could cut the red tape and boost production in the sector.

Geothermal has a lot of potential. The DOE estimates it could contribute almost 10% of US energy capacity by 2050. New geothermal technology, which uses horizontal drilling to drill multiple wells into geothermal reservoirs from a single location, is a promising start, but more innovation is needed to become cost competitive.

Joining us to discuss the legislation, and the technology that underpins the geothermal sector, are Dr Joseph Moore - Research Professor at the University of Utah and Managing Principal Investigator at Utah FORGE, a geothermal research facility managed by the Energy & Geoscience Institute at the University of Utah, and sponsored by the DOE – and Lauren Boyd, Director of the EERE’s Geothermal Technologies Office, which is sponsoring the Utah FORGE laboratory.

Together they examine the cost, operation and scope for geothermal energy in the US.

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Transforming EV battery development through the power of AI Jan 30, 2024

Show notes

The traditional process of battery development is slow, expensive, and capital-intensive. AI can help overcome the challenges of predicting battery performance, exploring the vast design space, and conducting time-consuming cycle life testing. We are joined by Alán Aspuru-Guzik, a professor at the University of Toronto specialising in Chemistry and Computer Science, and Jason Koeller, the CTO and Co-founder of Chemix, to examine the role of machine learning in EV battery development.

Chemix is exploring new ways of developing batteries for electric vehicles (EVs) by utilising AI, aiming to make it faster and more efficient compared to the traditional, slower, and costlier methods. AI not only speeds up the development process by predicting performance and exploring design options, but also – as Professor Aspuru-Guzik explains - leads to innovative battery compositions that improve performance. The machines can do calculations in timeframes inconceivable for a human.

There are wide-ranging applications for AI in areas beyond battery development, including grid optimisation and materials design. Professor Aspuru-Guzik shares insights into the work of the Acceleration Consortium, which aims to be a leading hub for AI-driven scientific advancements in various sectors. Jason addresses some of the practical challenges in the EV industry, such as the need for adaptable battery solutions and the hurdles in introducing new manufacturing technologies. Technological advancement in battery technology and charging infrastructure are progressing together, enabling growth in the EV market.

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Checking in on the hydrogen sector Jan 17, 2024

Show notes

What’s the outlook for low-carbon hydrogen in 2024?

Green hydrogen energy, by now well-regarded as a critical component in the energy transition, is still faced with significant challenges. It’s anticipated to significantly contribute to energy needs, with projections suggesting it could supply up to 35% of the UK's energy by 2050, and there's a push in the US to dramatically reduce hydrogen production costs. The sector is experiencing rapid growth with many projects in development but reaching the Final Investment Decision (FID) stage is a key hurdle, especially in the current economic climate of high interest rates and inflation. The sector is trying to manage high initial costs and a tendency for investments to favour blue hydrogen, which is currently more cost-effective.

To discuss the hydrogen market, and the policy and financial decisions to be made to accelerate the rollout, we are joined by Murray Douglas and Vicky Paley. Murray is responsible for Wood Mackenzie’s global hydrogen and ammonia research, while Vicky heads up project delivery at Protium Green Solutions.

Together they look at the updates in legislation, permits and overall government policy we’ve seen in the last 6 months and can expect this year. The US, for example, has set definitive treasury rules to give a bit more clarity to the industry.

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AI is transforming demand-side management Jan 03, 2024

Show notes

The impact of Artificial Intelligence in energy management.

We're at a crossroads in the world of energy. The landscape is shifting with the increasing role of renewables, growing demand and the need for resilience against extreme weather. How do we manage power effectively to keep the grid stable and efficient? Using AI to manage demand is one possibility. The role of artificial intelligence in energy management is an exciting development. It's set to transform how we predict, price, trade and use power, all while boosting efficiency and reliability.

Managing the grid is like solving a complex puzzle in real-time. The old grid, built for predictable loads, now grapples with erratic consumption and the fickleness of renewables like solar and wind. AI steps in here, using data and machine learning to improve efficiency and strengthen the grid. AI outperforms traditional models in forecasting. While these conventional models are valuable, they often miss the finer details which can lead to forecast errors. AI, on the other hand, adapts rapidly to real-time changes, enhancing the predictability of supply and demand at a detailed level.

For the first Interchange episode of the year, we welcome David Miller from Gridmatic to discuss the ever-evolving use of AI in grid management.

Together they explore how AI is transforming strategic forecasting, risk management and optimisation in energy infrastructure. What are the current challenges for the grid and how could AI help? What investment is required in infrastructure to optimise the grid? And what are the regulatory measures in place that are helping and hindering the rollout of smart grids?

Subscribe to the Interchange Recharged so you don’t miss an episode. Find us on X – we’re @interchangeshow.

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