For The Love With Jen Hatmaker Podcast

Latest Episodes:

For the Love of Therapy: Wellness Doesn’t Come From a Product, It Comes From Within: Dr. Pooja Lakshmin Nov 08, 2023

Show notes

In this latest installment of our For The Love of Therapy series, we delve into a timely discussion on mental wellness with a focus on genuine self-care. Our guest, Dr. Pooja Lakshmin, a renowned psychiatrist and advocate for women, offers fresh insights that urge listeners to break free from the superficial beauty and wellness industry's narrative that is steadily being pushed at us through all kinds of media, but in a dizzying fashion on social media, in particular. Steering the talk away from quick-fix solutions, Dr. Lakshmin illuminates the essence of true self-care, which, in her research, links to four major chambers rarely associated with this concept. From the importance of saying 'No' when overwhelmed, to understanding that self-care is more than just a beauty regimen, she reminds us that wellness comes from within. Dr. Lakshmin, an accomplished writer for the New York Times and founder of the Gemma community, also shares insights from her book, 'Real Self-Care: A Transformative Program for Redefining Wellness (Crystals, Cleanses, and Bubble Baths Not Included)'. Join us for this enlightening conversation and let's start redefining what wellness truly means.

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Thought-Provoking Quotes:

“We have to talk about the systems, the social structures that have gotten us to this place where the expectation for a woman, a mom to feel better is this very condescending, ‘well just go to a yoga class, just pour your bubble bath and a glass of wine and there… you'll feel better.’ I find that to be condescending at best, manipulative at worst.” - Dr. Pooja Lakshmin

“Real self-care is an internal process. It brings you closer to yourself. It's a verb. It's not a noun.” - Dr. Pooja Lakshmin

“Guilt is just there all the time when it comes to boundaries and when it comes to compassion too; how we talk to ourselves.“ - Dr. Pooja Lakshmin

“Therapy is this cozy little corner where you can be with yourself and be curious.” - Dr. Pooja Lakshmin

Resources Mentioned in This Episode:

Real Self-Care: A Transformative Program for Redefining Wellness (Crystals, Cleanses, and Bubble Baths Not Included) by Dr. Pooja Lakshmin

Audre Lorde

Bell Hooks

Codependent No More: How to Stop Controlling Others and Start Caring for Yourself - by Melody Beattie

For the Love Podcast episode featuring Brené Brown

For the Love Premium Bonus Podcast episode featuring Melodie Beatty

Gemma

Guest’s Links:

Dr. Pooja Lakshmin’s Website

Dr. Pooja Lakshmin’s Twitter

Dr. Pooja Lakshmin’s Instagram

Dr. Pooja Lakshmin’s Facebook

Connect with Jen! Jen’s website

Jen’s Instagram Jen’s Tw ...

For the Love of Therapy: Are You Happy? Dr. Sara Kuburic Wants Us To Stop Lying To Ourselves and Take Ownership of Our Choices Nov 01, 2023

Show notes

It’s time for this week’s podcast therapy session and we’ve got another great therapist in our “office” as part of our For the Love of Therapy series. Dr. Sara Kuburic is an existential psychotherapist, author and the force behind The @Millennial.Therapist account on Instagram. Dr. Kuburic believes that each of us is a free and responsible agent who determines our own development through acts of our will. Though this isn’t always a popular view to take, as we often look to outside forces to blame for our unhappiness, Dr. Kuburic wants us to understand that we have this amazing opportunity to engage in life and we can take ownership and responsibility over our choices. In that vein, she asks a very important question: how much of what we deal with in life happens to us, and how much of it did we inflict on ourselves? (that’s a fun thing to spend a few hours pondering). But as a therapist, she helps people find tools to address whatever stage of life they’re–maybe it is a bad situation and you just can’t change it–but as she likes to ask: “what can you change or how can you change your attitude so the situation is less painful for you?” In addition to thinking about our lives existentially, Jen and Dr. Kuburic also discuss the concept of self-loss and how we can deceive ourselves into thinking we’re living the life we want, when our bodies are telling us otherwise by devolving into depression, anxiety and panic.

Jen and Dr. Kuburic get honest about:

What it’s like when you love the “idea” of who you are more than who you actually are–and how to stop lying to yourself
What happens when not making a change in your life actually becomes more painful than changing
Realizing that our bodies do have limits–no matter how strong you think you are or how strong you’ve been—your body is sending up red flags with feelings of anxiousness, fear or panic for seemingly no reason
How sometimes our dedication to make something work can be so all consuming–even if that thing isn’t the right thing for our lives and hat commitment, which is normally a good quality, can lead us to our weakest moments if we don’t face up to the truth

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Thought-Provoking Quotes:

“I think I got into psychology to try to understand what makes humans tick and try to understand my own human experience.” - Dr. Sara Kuburic

“We get to engage in life; we can take ownership, we can take responsibility, we can make choices, and I think that that's really how I see human suffering. My question is always, ‘how much of it happened to you? How much of it did you inflict on yourself?’” - Dr. Sara Kuburic

“I think if you're stagnant, that's where the loss happens. That's when we overcommit to one version of ourselves. When you’re not being stagnant, you are always being fluid–I think you’re understanding the assignment, which is constant creation and adaptation of yourself to fit your experiences, your context, and what life is asking of you in that moment.” - Dr. Sara Kuburic

“Stop assuming you know someone well enough to stop paying attention.” - Dr. Sara Kuburic

“I think having someone that I've known for eight years sit me down and just be like, ‘Hey, are you happy,” was the first time anyone, including myself, asked that question.” - Dr. Sara Kuburic

“Someone else made the mess and now you have to clean it up when it wasn't your mess. But, the reason you're cleaning it up is because you deserve not to live in a mess, not because they deserve for you to clean it up. It's for you.” - Dr. Sara Kuburic

Resources Mentioned in This Episode:

It's On Me: Accept Hard Truths, Discover Yourself and Change Your Life by Dr. Sara Kuburic

Dr. Sara Kuburic’s USA Today Column

Guest’s Links:

For the Love of Therapy: Jada Pinkett-Smith on Trauma, Grief, and the Power of Embracing Your Journey Oct 25, 2023

Show notes

We’re in the thick of our “For the Love of Therapy” series, and this week we’re getting a full helping of candor and insight from the multifaceted actress and author, Jada Pinkett Smith. Jada candidly reveals another side to her journey that many might not know from her highly public persona, a story where she takes charge of her narrative in the face of what people have decided for themselves who they think she is. Jada recounts the formative and often traumatic events of her past, and talks in stark terms about her present day pain points. Without sparing the hard parts, Jada leans into what it’s like for her, as it is for so many of us to be a woman today, what it’s like to reckon with our trauma, and marriage is really like behind the curtain, in hopes that what she’s learned will resonate with other women, no matter what their story is.

Jen and Jada compare notes from their own lives about:

Jada’s encounters with complex trauma, PTSD, panic attacks, and suicidal ideation
How mental health issues can visit anyone at any time, regardless of privilege or upbringing
The slow acceptance to admitting they’ve faced trauma, thinking “others have had it worse” - and the continued work toward reckoning with that truth
The reality that all of us, especially those in the public sector, will be judged by others, and a new understanding that judgment is most often about people’s own pain and how they’ve been hurt by others’ judgment, rather than it is about the person being judged

Through sharing her life journey, which she covers in much greater detail in her newly released book “Worthy,” it’s Jada’s hope to encourage others navigating similar struggles towards wellness and understanding.

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Thought-Provoking Quotes:

“I just wanted to offer other women breadcrumbs that are on this journey called life. Our journeys aren't going to look exactly the same, but there are just some universal challenges that we have just being human and specifically being women. I just wanted to go, ‘Listen, I don't care what's going on. Instagram and Facebook, life is messy. Life is difficult. It's challenging. We're all trying to figure this out, and I'm just going to show you little things along the way that I figured out.’” - Jada Pinkett Smith

“When you really start to understand the human condition, and when you really start to see people's fears, you really start to see people's pain. That's why people want to strike at you. That's why people want to spew whatever they can your way because of how they've been hurt, how they've hurt themselves, how they've been hurt from others' judgment.” - Jada Pinkett Smith

“I am so lucky--yes, my mother was deep in her addiction, but I'm going to tell you--she showed up [for me] at some of the most pivotal times.” - Jada Pinkett Smith

“It would take me years to really detach myself from chaos because chaos became normal for me.” - Jada Pinkett Smith

“It's not other people's judgment that's the problem. It's how you judge yourself. When you know who you are and you are in the process of healing your self-judgment, you realize that any judgment that anybody's got on you is really a reflection of where they are sitting within themselves.” - Jada Pinkett Smith

Resources Mentioned in This Episode:

Time's 100 Mo ...

For the Love of Therapy: Women and Emotions - No More Apologies: Dr. Anita Phillips Oct 18, 2023

Show notes

Have you ever been told you are “too emotional,” or if you display sadness or anger that you’re “overreacting,” or (gasp) - even “hysterical?” Women have long had their emotions weaponized against them. And as part of our For the Love of Therapy series, we have a trauma therapist and mental health expert Dr. Anita Phillips at the mic to share her thoughts and findings on why embracing our emotions can be the key to living our most powerful life. Dr. Phillips extensively explores the societal pressures that often lead women to suppress their emotions. She argues that emotions are not a sign of weakness, but a source of strength, and should be embraced rather than hidden. Women's emotions are a reflection of their experiences and individuality, and they deserve to be expressed freely and without apology. She believes that if we can shift our perspective around emotions, we can achieve a healthier mental state and improved relationships, fostering a culture that values emotional authenticity and rejects unnecessary emotional censorship.

Jen and Dr. Anita discuss:

The agency we have over our emotions and we won’t flourish unless we stop and listen to what our bodies and our feelings are telling us
That our emotions are not “red flags” they are clues that guide us to the best and healthiest way forward
We shouldn’t see emotions as our enemy, and that internal war over them is not our destiny–we are created to flourish
Principles from Dr. Anita’s book, The Garden Within

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Thought-Provoking Quotes:

“Not having an explanation for what's happening is its own form of trauma. The trauma overwhelms not only our body's capacity to cope with what's happening, but it breaks our frame of reference when we cannot explain this in any way. That is also traumatizing because the world becomes chronically unsafe.” - Dr. Anita Phillips

“I was having these experiences with my emotions and my body that did not line up with this idea that our thoughts reigned supreme. That's one of the things that opened the door to me looking at trauma more deeply.” - Dr. Anita Phillips

“My emotional pain does not squelch my spiritual power.” - Dr. Anita Phillips

“We've been taught as Christians that if we believe and have faith, it's going to turn out good. Then we wouldn't be crying. We wouldn't be sad or we wouldn't be scared. That's insane because we have bodies and we're humans.” - Dr. Anita Phillips

“Emotion brings flexibility to our decision-making that is important. We don't want robotic decision-makers. We want people who have heart, and who recognize humanity. Emotion has always been a part of human decision making.” - Dr. Anita Phillips

“Because we have stigmatized emotions in order to not feel the painful ones, we have disconnected from our bodies. That's another problem; seeing the body as a problem as well.” - Dr. Anita Phillips

“Women are taught not to trust their gut, not to trust their intuition, but we have so much power in that space.” - Dr. Anita Phillips

“I'm emotional. I'm emotional all the time, a ...

For the Love of Funny: It’s Funny Where Life Takes Us Sometimes: Anjelah Johnson-Reyes Oct 11, 2023

Show notes

It’s so fun when we get to have guests back on the show that we love, but it’s especially fun when we get to catch up after we haven’t talked to them for awhile! This guest joined us in the very first year of our show in the For the Love of Laughter series, and she was fire then, and she’s fire now, 5 years later. We’re talking about the amazingly talented and hilarious Anjelah Johnson-Reyes, one of our favorite comedians in the whole wide world! You know her from her awesome Nail Salon comedy sketch, which launched her career, or as her character from MadTV, Bon Qui Qui, and from her amazing comedy specials. When Anjelah was with us last time, she shared that she and her husband had chosen to pursue their careers to the fullest and had made the very personal decision to not have kids. But it’s funny what can change in five years, and Anjelah is now the proud mom of 3 month old Rosie Harlow Reyes. She shares what led to the decision to have a baby, what she’s learned in this season - which she also candidly shares on her YouTube channel via a series of videos called Postpartum Confessions. Whether she’s on stage doing comedy, acting on TV and in movies, or hosting podcasts with her husband Manny, Anjelah gives a great perspective on how life can take us where we least expect to go, and how we can laugh about it a little along the way.

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Thank you to our sponsors!

BetterHelp | Visit betterhelp.com/forthelove to save 10% on your first month!

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Resources Mentioned in This Episode:

Anjelah’s Comedy Specials

Anjelah’s Latest Special at the Ryman in Nashville

Anjelah’s Nail Salon Bit

Who Do I Think I Am: Stories of Chola Wishes and Caviar Dreams by Anjelah Johnson

Anjelah’s Podcasts Including Manjelah

Guest’s Links:

Connect with Jen! Jen’s website

Jen’s Instagram Jen’s Twitter

Jen’s Facebook Jen’s YouTube

For the Love of Funny: Laughing Toward The Light: Comedian Kevin James Thornton Finds Himself at 50 Oct 04, 2023

Show notes

We’re keeping the laughs going as we continue our For the Love of Funny series–and this week we’ve got Kevin James Thornton, a comedian and entertainer, who, after spending his youth in a fundamentalist church in the 90’s, found a lot to laugh about. After moving to LA to make his way on stages at the Comedy Store and as an actor, Kevin wasn’t sure he was happy with how his life was going. After a move to Nashville and some serious contemplation about where to go next, the pandemic hit. Bored at home, Kevin discovered a little thing called TikTok and decided it might be fun to share some of the stories of what it was like to grow up gay in a fundamentalist church in the 90’s, and much to his surprise his videos were wildly successful. At 50 years old, Kevin had found his niche, and now he brings his unique brand of comedy (often sung as a story through an auto-tune device—because it was the 90’s, after all) ) with audiences across the U.S. and Europe and with over 2 million followers on social media.

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Thank you to our sponsors!

Chime | Visit chime.com/forthelove to learn how you can benefit from using Chime!

FOCL | Visit https://focl.com/ and use code FORTHELOVE at checkout for 20% off of your purchase

Jen Hatmaker BookClub | Visit jenhatmakerbookclub.com and use code READ at checkout $5 off your purchase!

Resources Mentioned in This Episode:

A Comedy Bit on Kevin’s YouTube Channel

The Comedy Store in West Hollywood

For the Love Episode with Nate Bargatze

Kevin James Thornton's Upcoming Shows

Guest’s Links:

Connect with Jen! Jen’s website

Jen’s Instagram Jen’s Twitter

Jen’s Facebook Jen’s YouTube

For the Love of Funny: Tom Papa Takes His Comedy Personally Sep 27, 2023

Show notes

We’re knee-deep in our “For the Love of Funny” series, celebrating all things hilarious and witty. Jen’s been a long-time fan and amateur participant in the world of comedy, and our guest today explores one of her tip-top favorite genres of comedy. He's a master of observational humor, turning even the most mundane moments of life into pure comedy gold. Our guest, Tom Papa, is not just a comedian—he's a whirlwind of talent with a remarkable career spanning two decades. From his uproarious Netflix specials "What A Day" and "You're Doing Great," to his writing and stand-up projects in comedy clubs and for shows like NPR’s "Live From Here," to his acting roles, Tom has done it all. He and Jen discuss the common theme of mining gold from your family to create some of your best comedy material (but avoiding presenting that said material to them, because family can be brutal critics). They also discuss Tom’s new passion–baking, and how between writing, doing comedy and various shows, he’s in the kitchen tending to all the processes involved with producing amazing bread and other baked goods. To that end, Tom also hosts his own podcast called "Breaking Bread with Tom Papa," where he invites guests for lively discussions over meals. Like a lot of comedians, Tom is more than just funny—he's a thoughtful, insightful individual who gives you something to think about between all the laughs.

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Jen Hatmaker BookClub | Visit jenhatmakerbookclub.com and use code READ at checkout $5 off your purchase!

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Thought-Provoking Quotes:

“My uncle Tony was really funny. He would sit at the table and hold court. Then some cousins were funny, and so I definitely gravitated toward those people; that always kind of informed me. And I started doing that around my friends very, very early.” - Tom Papa

“[In my comedy] I relate through family and the small stuff. It's like it is observational, but it's not. It's very personal observational, in a way." - Tom Papa

"When you’re around people that are doing what you want to do, in time, you just want someone to say, 'it'll work. Just tell me. It'll work out.' It's like sometimes you go to the doctor, 'just tell me everything's all right.'" - Tom Papa

“[My favorite thing] is standup, but that almost goes without saying. That's just me. So to even call that one of the things is kind of not fair. It's so good. It's so great. You get the response, you get the physical, the mental, the applause, the scariness, all of it is so raw and potent out of the other stuff that I do." - Tom Papa

"One of the biggest hurdles that writers have is, is your own head saying, 'is this good enough?' And you start tearing it down and stop yourself from working with your critical mind." - Tom Papa

Resources Mentioned in This Episode:

Class Clown (Comedy Album by George Carlin)

Let's Get Small (Comedy Album by Steve Martin)

Sheltered Kids Who Grew Up To Be Funny: Trey + Katie Kennedy and Jake Triplett Sep 20, 2023

Show notes

We’re back with more funny, and this week doesn’t disappoint. For those of you who grew up in the Bible Belt and maybe went to a conservative church (or even if you didn’t), perhaps you were a bit sheltered like our guests this week. Before racking up over 12 million combined followers on Instagram, TikTok, Facebook and elsewhere, and hosting the hit podcast Correct Opinions, comedian Trey Kennedy came to fame on the short-form videosharing app Vine. His hilarious and pointed videos ranged from imitating a church youth pastor who is cornily trying to be cool and up on pop culture, to an overly sunny Dad who tries to drag his teenage son out of bed to go to church. Now, Trey has teamed up with his friend Jake Triplett, who he met at a Christian camp, and the two co host the podcast, along with Trey’s wife Katie (who keeps the pair on track and from going down too many rabbit holes). In this episode, the trio and Jen share the commonalities of their Baptist church upbringings, their naivete about dating customs (hearing Jake’s assessment of what he thought french kissing was will make you howl), and how Trey’s Bible wielding grandmother had a serious talk with him about rumours of him being gay (He’s not. Not that there’s anything wrong with that). They've managed to turn being 'sheltered' into comedy gold, and they’ve been taking their brand of comedy all around the country with their recent “Grow Up” tour and their clean comedy is resonating everywhere. Their funny spin on their past doesn't just give us a good laugh; it also makes anyone who had a similar childhood feel like part of a big, quirky family.

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Thank you to our sponsors!

Jen Hatmaker BookClub | Visit jenhatmakerbookclub.com and use code READ at checkout $5 off your purchase!

FOCL | Visit https://focl.com/ and use code FORTHELOVE at checkout for 20% off of your purchase

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Resources Mentioned in This Episode:

Vine

Correct Opinions (Podcast hosted by Trey, Katie, and Jake)

Trey Kennedy’s Grow Up Comedy Tour

Jake Triplett’s Sheltered Kid Special

Shiny Happy People Docuseries

For the Love Episode ft. John Crist

Make Me Care About Podcast Interview with Melinda Gates

Guest’s Links:

Connect with Jen! Jen’s website

Jen’s Instagram Jen’s Twitter

Jen’s Facebook Jen’s YouTube

For the Love of Funny: Finding The Funny In Our Wins and Losses with R. Eric Thomas Sep 13, 2023

Show notes

We’re back with more of our For the Love of Funny series, and this week we’re asking the question; is it possible to find humor not only in our lighter moments, but also in our vulnerable and difficult times? Our guest this week specializes in wit through the written word–and he has found that it is possible to find joy, while being heartfelt and hilarious at the same time. We’re welcoming R. Eric Thomas, back to the show! Whether he’s writing about politics, pop culture, or celebrity craziness–Eric has a refreshing and hilarious perspective–which really helps when regular reporting on politics and news might send us spiraling into the darkness. Eric is also a television writer (Dickinson on AppleTV+, Better Things on FX), a playwright, and a bestselling author of several books, including Here For It: Or How To Save Your Soul in America and his newest work, a collection of hilarious essays called Congratulations The Best Is Over. Eric brings that laugh we need when the world seems bonkers, and helps remind us that we can find something to laugh at in almost every situation–we just have to be open to it.

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Thank you to our sponsors!

BetterHelp | Visit betterhelp.com/forthelove to save 10% on your first month!

Trust and Will - Get 10% and Free Shipping when Visit trustandwill.com/forthelove. See how Trust and Will can benefit you!

FOCL - Visit https://focl.com/ and use code FORTHELOVE at checkout for 20% off of your purchase

Thought-Provoking Quotes:

“Be grateful that you got to this place because this is where you wanted to be. Don't spend so much time thinking, ‘What if it all goes away?’” - R. Eric Thomas

“I think to myself, ‘If you were better, then you'd be busier and that would make you happier.’ I don't know that busier equals happier. I don't know if that's true.” - R. Eric Thomas

“I remember the first time somebody came up to me in the street and said, ‘Hey, this is weird, but I follow your Facebook, a friend of mine told me to, and you're funny.’ And I'm like, ‘Who are you? What's happening? Where are the cameras?’” - R. Eric Thomas

“I know from my own experience as a reader and as a writer, you can have a good time with something that is both funny and heartfelt.” - R. Eric Thomas

“I posted an Instagram story that was essentially like, ‘I got rejected from this thing, but my Beyonce´ hat came. So there are pluses and minuses.’ People really responded. They were like, ‘Thank you for sharing not only your wins but your losses. It seems like you're always winning.’ I'm like, ‘baby, I am always losing, but I'm not going to share that.’” - R. Eric Thomas

Resources Mentioned in This Episode:

For the Love of Finding Truth ft. Eric Thoma ...

Yelled at By A Clown: How Nate Bargatze Found His Funny Sep 06, 2023

Show notes

We’re looking for laughs and we found them in all the right places, and we’re sharing the hilarity with a brand new series called For the Love Of Funny. If you’ve hung out with us for any amount of time, you know that Jen is an avid devotee of all things funny. So we’ve rounded up some of her favorite funny people to not only bring us laughs, but to unpack the art and science of making people laugh. And for our very first episode, we couldn’t be more delighted to welcome “The Tennessee Kid” himself–Nate Bargatze! Nate’s known for his down-to-earth humor and deadpan comedy delivery, his highly viewed Netflix specials, and his favored status as a frequent guest on “The Tonight Show Starring Jimmy Fallon: (10+ times!). Surprise guest interviewer Tyler Merritt joins Jen as they pull back the curtain on Nate’s comedy journey. Often referred to as the “nicest man in standup,” Nate talks about growing up in a performance forward home (his dad was a Christian magician), the origins of some of his funniest jokes (Yelled at By a Clown, anyone?) and the side of fame that isn’t so pretty–like his sister’s incredulity that anyone would want to take a selfie with him.

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Thank you to our sponsors!

Chime | Visit chime.com/forthelove to learn how you can benefit from using Chime!

Jen Hatmaker BookClub | Visit jenhatmakerbookclub.com and use code READ at checkout $5 off your purchase!

FOCL | Visit https://focl.com/ and use code FORTHELOVE at checkout for 20% off of your purchase

Resources Mentioned in This Episode:

For the Love Episode ft. Kevin Nealon

Nate Bargatze: The Tennessee Kid

Nate Bargatze: The Greatest Average American

The Nateland Podcast

The Be Funny Tour

The Second City Comedy Club