Drowned in Sound

Latest Episodes:

An ethical guide to quitting Spotify Oct 09, 2025

Show notes

In part two of our Drowned in Sound podcast series on the Spotify exodus, Sean Adams sits down with Alexa Speed (founder of Cut Off The Spigot), and artist Kadhja Bonet alongside returning guest Laura Burhenn (The Mynabirds) to unpack the growing backlash against Spotify and other streaming giants.

From Spotify’s billion-dollar AI investments and Daniel Ek’s controversial war drone ventures to the ethics of billionaire ownership and music’s place in post-capitalist culture, Sean and this week’s guests dive into the details and ask what happens when artists say enough is enough.

We hear why Kadhja pulled her music from Spotify, how Alexa interrogates corporate influence behind streaming platforms, and what the alternatives are (including Bandcamp, Qobuz and more). We also imagine a future where creativity and community outweigh convenience, and where art is valued for its inherent social good, not algorithmic profitability. Far-fetched? Let’s find out.

Chapters:

00:00 – Introduction: The Spotify Exodus

03:15 – Why Artists Are Leaving Streaming Platforms

08:45 – Daniel Ek’s Investments in AI and Defence Tech

13:20 – The Ethics of Streaming: Profit vs Planet

18:05 – Billionaires, Protest, and Power

22:40 – Kadhja Bonet: Why I Pulled My Music from Spotify

27:55 – Laura Burhenn on Journalism, Accountability & Platforms

34:10 – Alternatives: Bandcamp, Qobuz, and Ethical Listening

40:00 – The Role of Joy and Dance in Resistance

46:45 – Building a Post-Capitalist Music Culture

52:30 – What Comes After Spotify?

57:00 – Closing Reflections & Future Visions

Try Qobuz (Ethical Streaming Alternative):

Artists get paid 10x more than Spotify. Human-curated playlists. High-quality audio. Start your free trial via DiS (supporting independent music journalism).

Continue the Conversation:

Head to the Drowned in Sound community to chat about the topics in this episode.

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Links & Mentions

Drowned in Sound is 25 today: Big lessons from the past and a new era unfurls Oct 02, 2025

Show notes

DiS founder Sean Adams sits down with DiS’s newest staff writer, Emma Wilkes, to mark 25 years of Drowned in Sound and what the future holds for the website, newsletter, and podcast.

They reflect on Emma’s recent interview with Jeremy Corbyn as he champions grassroots venues, and turn the tables by asking each other questions usually reserved for podcast guests. Sean finally reveals how he would spend the $450m Spotify gave Joe Rogan, as this conversation explores the intersection of music, politics, journalism, and the survival of independent culture.

Sean and Emma discuss how music can be a gateway into politics (and vice versa), the pressures facing artists, publicists, and journalists in today’s music industry, and what a fairer ecosystem could look like. They also imagine music’s future in 2050 - the hopes, fears, and possibilities of where culture might go next.

Chapters:

00:00 – Introducing Emma Wilkes & 25 years of DiS
02:00 – Jeremy Corbyn, grassroots venues & music for the many
07:00 – Why music and politics can’t be separated
14:00 – Music as a gateway into politics
15:00 – Ticketmaster, Live Nation & the fight for fairness
18:00 – What is journalism today?
24:00 – Asking questions, telling stories & accountability in music journalism
29:00 – $450m for Joe Rogan: how should money flow into culture?
33:00 – Building connections between artists and audiences
37:00 – Music media as infrastructure
39:00 – Supporting mental health and addiction in the music industry
45:00 – Stress behind the scenes: labels, PRs & campaign work
46:00 – The albums we love and buried treasures
48:00 – Music in 2050: hopes, fears & future sounds
57:00 – What’s next for DiS at 25

Continue the Conversation:

Head to the Drowned in Sound community to chat about the topics in this episode.

Subscribe:

Links:

Is music finally ready to confront misogyny? DiS meets CheerUpLuv Sep 25, 2025

Show notes

In music, abuse, harassment and discrimination is normalised whilst accountability and justice is rare, so how can change finally happen?

In this episode of the Drowned in Sound podcast:

For the past eight years, journalist and photographer Eliza Hatch has been documenting everyday harassment through her platform Cheer Up Luv. Following her recent Glamour investigation into misogyny in music, which has reached over a million people, DiS founder Sean Adams sat down to talk about the reactions to the stat that more than half of women in the industry have faced discrimination.

From government failures to arena tours by artists like Chris Brown and Marilyn Manson, this is a wide ranging conversation about the challenges and the solutions. We also hear how artists like Lambrini Girls and Nova Twins reacted to hearing that over 50% of women in music have faced discrimination.

And we talk about the role men can play in smashing the patriarchy, the rise of the far right, and what a safer, more equal music industry could look like by 2050.

Chapters:

00:00 – Misogyny and music: the scale of the problem
10:30 – Everyday discrimination that builds hostile spaces
20:00 – When the government rejects reform: stalled progress and NDAs
24:00 – The role of media, libel laws, and silence in enabling abuse
26:00 – Chris Brown, Marilyn Manson, and the “separating art from artist” debate
33:00 – Why accountability is so rare in the music industry
42:00 – Smashing the patriarchy is good for men, too
52:00 – The far right, feminism, and why musicians need to speak out
57:00 – What the industry could and should look like in 2050

Continue the Conversation:

Email sean@drownedinsound.org with your thoughts or experiences
Subscribe to the DiS newsletter for weekly insights on music, culture, and resistance

Links:

Cheer Up Luv on Instagram
Sign up to the Cheer Up Luv Newsletter
Eliza Hatch’s piece for Glamour
We Are Music - resources for musicians facing harassment
On Wednesdays We Wear Black - Podcast documenting Marilyn Manson’s crimes

Is national identity in music a good thing? In conversation with Idlewild Sep 18, 2025

Show notes

What creates a national sound? How does Scotland run through the veins of a band like Idlewild, despite their American influences?

Roddy Woomble and Rod Jones from Scottish indie stalwarts Idlewild join us to explore their new self-titled album and dig into the complexities of musical identity. Beginning in Scotland's tight-knit music community, then feeling like outsiders in London, the band reveal how geography and culture have shaped their sound and music over three decades.

Chapters:

03:00 – Exchange of Ideas: What music as conversation means beyond technical ability

06:00 – Literary Influences: Books, writers, and the Patti Smith revelation

09:00 – Sonic Youth Revolution: How Daydream Nation changed everything about playing guitar

13:00 – Scottish Identity: Self-deprecating culture and the outsider mentality

20:00 – Not Fitting Scenes: Missing Britpop and feeling closer to American bands

26:00 – Community Culture: Regional success and Scottish musical support networks

29:00 – Working with Producers: People skills and studio education

36:00 – New Album Production: Rod as producer capturing "melodic chaos"

40:00 – Visual Identity: Photography, album art, and the 28-year bookend

43:00 – Six Year Gap: COVID, solo projects, and finding renewed energy

47:00 – Rock's Resilience: Why rock refuses to die…

Continue the Conversation:

Email sean@drownedinsound.org with your thoughts on regional music scenes
Share your own experiences of musical identity and belonging
Subscribe to DiS newsletter for weekly insights on music and culture

Links:

Why it's time to quit Spotify Sep 11, 2025

Show notes

Have music artists finally had enough of the multi-billion dollar streaming platform?

Laura Burhenn makes music as The Mynabirds and has played in the Postal Service's live band. When she learned Spotify CEO Daniel Ek invested $700 million in military AI startup Helsing, she pulled her music and uploaded a protest monologue.

Her "Disarm Spotify" TikTok videos sparked millions of views and a wave of artist departures followed. Recent acts that have taken their music down include King Gizzard & The Lizard Wizard and Godspeed You! Black Emperor.

In this episode, we're not just talking about streaming rates but getting into the wider systemic issues with music being turned into bombs.

Featured voices from the movement:
Novo • Violetta Zironi • Naley By Nature • Dan Mangan

Chapters:

00:00 – Musicians boycotting Spotify: the fury and the interconnected issues
04:00 – When music money becomes military funding: the Daniel Ek investment
09:00 – AI drones and the dystopian timeline we're already living
13:00 – The snowball effect: how individual protest becomes movement
18:00 – Platform alternatives: Qobuz, ethics, and where artists go next
23:00 – Releasing protest music on the platform you're protesting
27:00 – Artists participating in their own devaluation: the bigger picture
35:00 – From DC punk to Palestine solidarity: political music evolution
40:00 – Why outspoken artists stay silent about their own platforms

Continue the Conversation:

Email sean@drownedinsound.org with your platform organising experiences
Join the discussion about collective action in the creator economy
Subscribe to DiS newsletter for weekly insights on music and resistance

Try Qobuz (Ethical Streaming Alternative):
Artists get paid 10x more than Spotify. Human-curated playlists. High-quality audio. Start your free trial via DiS (supporting independent music journalism).

Links:

Protect grassroots music, save so much more. A chat with Enter Shikari’s Rou Reynolds Sep 02, 2025

Show notes

How do artists decide what to say when everything from grassroots music to the climate is in crisis?

Backstage at Reading Festival, Drowned in Sound’s Sean Adams and Emma Wilkes sat down with Rou Reynolds, the frontman of Enter Shikari, one of the UK's most politically engaged bands. We discuss a range of topics including the St Albans music scene and how they pioneered the grassroots music venue levy - adding £1 to arena tickets to support small venues.

With 20 years of activism and seven albums under the band’s belt, Rou’s learned that having a platform means constantly choosing which crisis at a time or polycrisis deserves the spotlight. And we chat a lot about the interconnected issues and the need for system change.

Chapters:

03:00 – How the £1 venue levy actually works in practice
05:00 – Why supporting grassroots is community organizing, not charity
07:00 – How St Albans scene prepared Enter Shikari for mainstream success
09:00 – The neoliberal isolation crisis and music's role as antidote
11:00 – Connecting Gaza, climate crisis, and music industry exploitation
12:30 – Climate speech: "430 parts per million" and the season finale
16:00 – The impossible choice: which crisis gets the platform tonight?
22:00 – Reading Festival Gaza speech: "This is not a tragedy, it's a war crime"

"To be silent in times of atrocity is to assist in maintaining that atrocity"

Continue the Conversation:

Email sean@drownedinsound.org with your platform responsibility experiences
Join the discussion about choosing battles in poly-crisis times
Subscribe to DiS newsletter for weekly insights on building alternatives

Links:

DiSpatch: Raging at Reading Festival - Backstage with Enter Shikari, Sofia Isella, Cliffords, and more Aug 26, 2025

Show notes

Is rage the soundtrack of summer 2025? Can joy exist alongside political solidarity when climate change turns fields into dust clouds? Are main stages becoming platforms for resistance? And how do grassroots venues create the community foundations that allow festivals like Reading to exist at all?

This DiSpatch captures Reading Festival 2025 as both a celebration and political flashpoint - a weekend where Chappell Roan's euphoric main stage triumph coexisted with Palestine solidarity, climate crisis manifestations, and urgent conversations about the grassroots music ecosystem that supports it all. Sean Adams and Emma Wilkes navigate backstage conversations revealing how artists choose which urgent topics to address when "there's a lot of things happening in the world."

From Enter Shikari's pioneering grassroots levy work to Cliffords’ Cork scene community building, the episode maps how small venues create the collaborative culture that eventually reaches festival main stages. These conversations connect individual artist journeys to systemic challenges: venue closures, climate impacts, and the intersection of music with broader political movements.

Chapters:

00:00 – Introduction: Festivals as cultural battlegrounds in climate crisis era
05:00 – Chappell Roan: Joy as political resistance on main stage
08:00 – Cliffords on optimism as radical act and Cork scene collaboration
11:00 – Sofia Isella: From classical training to festival mud, building versatile artistry
16:00 – Rage as summer's soundtrack: Artist perspectives on political expression
22:00 – Enter Shikari: Choosing urgent topics and grassroots levy pioneer work
28:00 – Grassroots venues: Community infrastructure beyond music
35:00 – Climate crisis reaches UK festivals: Dust storms and venue sustainability
43:00 – Political solidarity: Palestine flags and artist platform responsibility
47:00 – Reading 2025: Cultural battleground assessment

Featured Links:

DrownedInSound YouTube Channel - Full artist interviews from Reading Festival
DiS Instagram - Behind-the-scenes festival content and artist clips
Grassroots Music Venue Crisis - Learn about the £1 levy supporting venues
Muse at Reading Festival 1999 - A history of Muse performances at Reading Festival
DiS Bookshop - Supporting independent bookstores and music writing

Artists Featured:

Chappell Roan, Cliffords, Sofia Isella, Enter Shikari, Heartworms, The Linda Lindas, Mannequin P*ssy, Amyl and the Sniffers, Lambrini Girls, and more

About DiSpatch:

DiSpatch episodes capture music events as cultural moments that reveal broader political and environmental currents. These aren't traditional festival reviews - they're explorations of how live music spaces become essential infrastructure for community building, political discourse, and cultural resistance in the climate crisis era.

Continue the Conversation:

Email sean@drownedinsound.org with your thoughts on festivals as political spaces
Join the discussion in our community forum about venue sustainability
Subscribe to DiS newsletter for climate crisis generation journalism

Meet The Music Researcher Making Sense of the Techpocalypse Aug 19, 2025

Show notes

What happens when the tech platforms care more about engagement and profits than music?

DiS meets music & technology journalist Cherie Hu, the founder of Water & Music, who's spent years mapping how tech giants from Spotify's recommendation algorithms to the venture capital funding streaming platforms. She's built one of music's most essential research operations to help fans and artists understand who really benefits from the current system and how best to use the tech of tomorrow..
Chapters

00:00 – Introduction

03:20 – Defining practical futurism and collaborative research

05:40 – From Forbes freelancer to community builder

07:55 – The evolution of Water & Music's collaborative model

12:40 – What collaboration enables now vs. the past

17:25 – Music and media's parallel challenge

22:15 – Building relationships and networks in the attention economy

23:50 – Domain specialisation vs. generalist approach in a noisy media landscape

29:20 – Artists and founders engaging with Water & Music

31:40 – Evergreen content, catalog lessons, and growth strategies

37:25 – Community building fundamentals: patience, trust, and institutional memory

40:05 – Math, music, and creativity

42:10 – Defining what community means

43:30 – Sean's Outro

Guest Links:

About the Host:

Sean Adams is the founder of Drowned in Sound, championing independent music since 2000. Through DiS, he maps music's future while supporting artists and fans building alternatives to platform control.

How Lore, DIY Music Scenes & The Cure Inspired This Viral Tiktokker (And What Musicians Can Learn) Aug 12, 2025

Show notes

Nirvana, TikTok, analogue aesthetics, and virality don't usually go together. Meet the creator who is bucking all the trends.

How do you build genuine community around music in an attention economy designed for extraction? What happens when Nirvana's DIY punk ethics meets TikTok algorithms? Can analog aesthetics and primary source research create alternatives to clickbait culture?

This week, Drowned in Sound founder Sean Adams talks with Royce aka ShoshinBoy - the TikTok creator behind viral music history videos that blend VHS cameras, rotary phones, and deep cultural excavation. From viral Nirvana content (2 million views) to uncovering forgotten Cure folklore, his analog-meets-digital approach reveals how authentic passion can cut through algorithmic noise.

Inspired by DIY punk rock culture, ShoshinBoy developed research methodology that prioritises primary sources and contemporary context over Wikipedia aggregation. His anti-gimmick gimmick - talking through vintage technology while analysing YouTube clips of Arctic Monkeys, The Clash, Pavement and many more - started as platform critique but evolved into genuine community building around shared musical mythology.

The conversation explores creator economy extraction, the death of mysterious rockstars in parasocial media landscapes, and why nostalgia both preserves and destroys cultural memory. Most importantly, it reveals how DIY ethics can survive on corporate platforms when creators prioritise community service over algorithmic optimisation.

Chapters:

00:00 – Introduction
04:30 – Defining journalism
08:37 – Everett True's book to TikTok virality
11:59 – The analog setup: Anti-gimmick philosophy
17:05 – Primary sources vs Wikipedia
24:11 – Creator economy critique
34:04 – Nostalgia as cultural force
42:15 – Alternative funding
45:04 – The future of musical mythology in algorithm-driven culture

Quotable Moments:

"I think that like. At its core, I just wanna be genuine and, and like I said, I'm only doing this 'cause it's fun and it's what I'm compelled to do anyways." [24:00]

"I don't think the idea of selling out exists in the year 2023. Acknowledging the idea that just to even pay rent or, or exist as a creative online in the current economy is, is it's so difficult." [26:00]

Continue the Conversation:

Email sean@drownedinsound.org with your thoughts on DIY ethics in the creator economy
Join the discussion in our community forum about preserving musical mythology
Share your experiences building authentic community around music passion

Guest Links:

@shoshinboy on TikTok - Analog music history through VHS and telephone
Shoshin Boy on Instagram

Referenced in Episode:

Everett True – Live Through This: American Rock In The 90s - The story of the grunge phenomenon by Everett True
Careless Talk Costs Lives Magazine - Everett True's magazine mentioned
Meta Label - Yancy Strickler's collective-focused creative platform
Artist Corps - Creative collective experiment mentioned
Simon Reynolds - Retromania - Book on nostalgia culture referenced

About the Host:

Sean Adams is the founder of Drowned in Sound, an independent music publication that has championed underground and independent artists since 2000. Through the DiS podcast, newsletter, and community, Sean explores how to build a fairer, more sustainable music industry while supporting the artists and fans who make it meaningful.

This evergreen episode of the DiS podcast was recorded in 2023 and explores how DIY punk ethics can survive and thrive in platform capitalism, revealing alternative paths for creators who prioritise community building over algorithmic extraction in the attention economy.

What Great Music Journalists Hear That Algorithms Miss: DiS meets Ilana Kaplan Aug 05, 2025

Show notes

How do music journalists spot breakthrough artists before they become household names? What does it take to get leftfield artists like Zola Jesus into mainstream publications like Vogue? How can music journalists build trust that transforms both interviews and careers?

This week, Drowned in Sound founder Sean Adams talks with Ilana Kaplan - the music editor at People Magazine and author of "Nora Ephron at the Movies" (Abrams Books, 2024). Following conversations about discovery and algorithms, this episode explores the craft of music journalism: how experienced writers develop taste, build industry relationships, and create the stories that shape how we discover music.

From researching artists at the Barnes & Noble magazine racks to recognising Billie Eilish's potential at a Mercury Lounge show to creating the viral boygenius Brokeback Mountain-inspired cover stories for Alternative Press, Ilana's career journey reveals the human curation that algorithms can't replicate.

The conversation covers discovery methods, editorial strategy, the changing definition of "alternative music," and why building trust with artists creates better journalism than aggressive questioning.

Chapters:

00:00 – Introduction
04:30 – What journalism means in the misinformation age
08:37 – Ilana's career beginnings from SPIN intern to music obsessive
11:59 – Spotting stars early: the Billie Eilish gamble that paid off
17:05 – Getting Zola Jesus into Vogue: selling leftfield artists to mainstream editors
24:11 – What does 'alternative' actually mean?
25:07 – boygenius desert shoot: spending your own money for viral covers
34:04 – Blacklisted for honest reporting: when PR controls journalism
45:04 – The hope in innovation and how models are changing
53:22 – Sean's Outro

Key Takeaways:

Discovery requires human curation: The Hype Machine's organic blog aggregation created an outlet for excitement that algorithms can't replicate
Trust transforms journalism: Giving artists space to be heard reveals more than aggressive questioning
Editorial bridges build community: Getting Zola Jesus into Vogue shows how to connect leftfield artists with mainstream audiences
Investment creates lasting impact: The boygenius desert cover succeeded because someone fought for the vision and funded it personally
Taste-making is community service: Early discovery of artists like Billie Eilish demonstrates journalism's role in cultural development

Continue the Conversation:

Email sean@drownedinsound.org with your thoughts on music journalism's craft
Join the discussion in our community forum

Guest Links:

Nora Ephron at the Movies - Ilana's book published October 2024
@lanikaps on Twitter
@lanikaps on Instagram
Ilana on Bluesky

Referenced in Episode:

Defector - Writer-owned sports publication mentioned as model
The Hype Machine - Music blog aggregator that shaped early 2010s discovery
Rob Sheffield at Rolling Stone - The writer who inspired Ilana's career
boygenius in AltPress - The cover feature we discuss
The Future Is Written - Huck Magazine profile mentioned in outro

About the Host:

This episode was recorded in November 2023 during Ilana's transition between staff and freelance work, capturing insights about journalism craft and industry navigation during a period of significant media industry change.

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