Think Inclusive

Latest Episodes:

Alfie Kohn on Whether Behaviorism Belongs in the Classroom Mar 18, 2021

Show notes

Alfie Kohn — Author and speaker on human behavior, education, and parenting; writer of 14 books and hundreds of articles; lectures at education conferences, universities, parent groups, and corporations. Known for Punished by Rewards and widely cited work challenging rewards, punishments, and behaviorist approaches in schools.

In this episode, Alfie Kohn argues that rewards (“positive reinforcement”) and punishments are two sides of the same coin—tools for short‑term compliance that erode curiosity, relationships, and intrinsic motivation. He critiques PBIS and behaviorist frameworks for centering control and compliance, and offers a “working‑with” alternative grounded in student interests, democratic class meetings, and co‑created curriculum. The episode also touches on inclusion, ungrading, and practical ways educators can reduce harm while pushing for structural change.

Complete show notes and transcript: https://mcie.org/think-inclusive/alfie-kohn-does-behaviorism-belong-in-the-classroom/

Why UDL Is Not Just Differentiation: A Conversation with Katie Novak Feb 18, 2021

Show notes

Katie Novak is an internationally renowned education consultant, practicing education leader, and graduate instructor at the University of Pennsylvania Graduate School of Education. She designs and presents workshops on Universal Design for Learning (UDL), MTSS, inclusive practices, and more. She’s the author of several books, including UDL Now, Innovate Inside the Box, Equity by Design (with Mirko Chardin), and Unlearning (with Allison Posey).

She previously served six years as an assistant superintendent and now facilitates professional learning while leading through her site, novakeducation.com.

In this conversation, Katie Novak unpacks what UDL really means and why it’s not just “differentiation by another name.” She argues that when we design from the start for learner variability—academic, linguistic, cultural, and emotional—students with the widest range of support needs can access grade‑level goals without lowering expectations.

Katie also addresses standardized testing pressures, urging educators to focus on impact over intent and to create accessible, trauma‑informed, and culturally sustaining classrooms—then let students face the (often imperfect) tests. She explains the principle of “supplement, not supplant,” the centrality of least restrictive environment (general education first), and why inclusive placement plus flexible pathways is essential for real equity.

Complete show notes and transcript: https://mcie.org/think-inclusive/katie-novak-common-misconceptions-about-udl/

Why I Call Myself An Inclusionist Jan 22, 2021

Show notes

Solo episode featuring Tim Villegas — host of Think Inclusive and Director of Communications at MCIE. In this episode, Tim shares his journey from teaching in self-contained (“segregated”) classrooms to advocating for inclusive education system-wide, including a later district-level role and his current work helping schools move toward inclusion.

In “Why I Call Myself an Inclusionist,” Tim Villegas reframes the term inclusionist—not as “get rid of special education,” but as a commitment to the careful planning, collaboration, and systems change required to make inclusive education work. He traces his path from skepticism to advocacy through student-centered successes (like Nathan and Damien), argues that IDEA’s Least Restrictive Environment is the legal starting point, and contends the biggest barrier isn’t teachers or funding but administrator belief and leadership. He closes with a concrete litmus test for placement decisions: What about these supports can’t be provided in a general education classroom?

Complete show notes and transcript: https://mcie.org/think-inclusive/why-i-call-myself-an-inclusionist/

The Baked Potato Approach: Shelley Moore on Inclusive Lesson Planning Nov 26, 2020

Show notes

Shelley Moore — Vancouver, BC–based inclusive education consultant, teacher, researcher, speaker, and storyteller. She’s the author of One Without the Other, a follow‑up to her TEDx talk “Under the Table,” and the creator/host of the Five Moore Minutes video series and companion podcast. Shelley works with school districts and community organizations across Canada and the United States.

In this episode of Think Incluive, Tim Villegas talks with Shelley Moore about her path into special education and why inclusion matters. Shelley explains her Plan A / Plan B framing (every student belongs with their grade‑level peers as “Plan A,” with supports and temporary breaks as needed—but with a clear path back), contrasts BC/Canada’s less‑standardized approach with U.S. systems, and unpacks her now‑famous baked potato metaphor for strategic planning that keeps rigor high while widening access.

Complete show notes and transcript: https://mcie.org/think-inclusive/shelley-moore-what-is-all-the-fuss-about-baked-potatoes/

Creating Truly Inclusive Schools: Insights from Jennifer Spencer‑Iiams Oct 22, 2020

Show notes

Jennifer Spencer‑Iiams — Assistant Superintendent for the West Linn–Wilsonville School District (Greater Portland, OR). She co‑authored Leading for All: How to Create Truly Inclusive and Excellent Schools with Josh Flosi, and led districtwide transformation toward inclusive practices.

In this episode, Jennifer Spencer‑Iiams shares how her district shifted from segregated models to inclusive schools by focusing on better instruction for all learners, cultivating inclusive culture, and elevating student voice. She walks through concrete goals (neighborhood schools, co‑curricular participation, student‑led IEPs), the systems that kept momentum (weekly “Monday message,” measurable data), and stories—from a graduate’s “once they let me out” reflection to a stadium redesign—that show what real inclusion looks like.

Complete show notes and transcript: https://mcie.org/think-inclusive/jennifer-spencer-iiams-leading-for-all-how-to-create-truly-inclusive-and-excellent-schools/

The Power of Placement: Why LRE Discussions Matter Sep 17, 2020

Show notes

In this final episode of Season 7, host Tim Villegas explores the challenges and strategies surrounding the Least Restrictive Environment (LRE) in special education. Amy Langerman shares her personal and professional experiences advocating for inclusive placements, highlighting stark differences between Arizona and California’s approaches. She discusses how systemic barriers and lack of support often push families toward private education, and how legal action can sometimes be the only path to inclusion.

Later, Amanda Selogie and Vickie Brett join the conversation to break down how IEP teams often mishandle placement discussions. They emphasize the importance of starting with general education as the default and encourage families to ask critical questions about existing inclusion practices. Their insights offer practical strategies for parents advocating for their children, even later in their educational journey.

This episode is a powerful call to action for educators, families, and advocates to push for meaningful inclusion and challenge outdated assumptions about disability and education.

Complete show notes and transcript: https://mcie.org/think-inclusive/amy-langerman-amanda-selogie-vickie-brett-lre/

Building Authentic Inclusive Education with Carol Quirk Jun 11, 2020

Show notes

In this episode of the Think Inclusive Podcast, host Tim Villegas speaks with Carol Quirk, an advocate for inclusive education and CEO of the Maryland Coalition for Inclusive Education. This meaningful discussion reveals the intricacies involved in promoting inclusive education for children with disabilities across the country. Tim and Carol delve deeply into the practices that bring educators, parents, and disability rights advocates together to create a more inclusive environment for all students.

Carol explains the role of the Maryland Coalition for Inclusive Education in transforming school districts from exclusive to inclusive systems. The podcast highlights how school districts can systematically change their approach to educating students with disabilities by focusing on the entire school environment, rather than treating special education as an isolated endeavor. Carol makes a compelling case for the involvement of superintendents and other district-level leaders in propagating these inclusive practices. She addresses common misconceptions regarding the cost of inclusion and shares insights about overcoming barriers at the administrative and educational levels to ensure long-term sustainability.

Complete show notes and transcript: https://mcie.org/think-inclusive/carol-quirk-systems-change-and-inclusive-education/

Including Students with Intellectual Disabilities in General Education Feb 23, 2020

Show notes

In this episode of the Think Inclusive podcast, Tim Villegas dives into the vital topic of inclusive education, underscoring its importance for all students, regardless of disability. Through a comprehensive discussion with Juanita Pritchard, an expert in intellectual disabilities, this episode unravels the intricacies of inclusion within the educational system. Tim shares his personal journey from skepticism to advocacy for inclusion, ignited by a powerful classroom experience that taught him the unbounded potentials of inclusive education. This episode illuminates why inclusion isn't just about integration but about crafting learning environments that respect and leverage every student's potential.

The conversation expands to cover pragmatic strategies and challenges around fostering inclusive classrooms, with a special focus on modifying curriculum for intellectual disabilities. Juanita reflects on her extensive experience, emphasizing the need for adaptive teaching methods and collaboration among educators. This episode provides educators, parents, and advocates with actionable insights on how to ensure inclusion is meaningful and effective. Keywords such as inclusive education, modifying curriculum, and intellectual disabilities weave through the discussion, promising valuable strategies and advice for those eager to push the boundaries of educational accessibility and equality.

Complete show notes and transcript: https://mcie.org/think-inclusive/including-students-with-intellectual-disabilities-in-general-education/

Addressing Teacher Preparedness for Inclusive Education Nov 02, 2019

Show notes

The Think Inclusive Podcast, hosted by Tim Villegas, dives into the pressing challenges faced by educators when teaching in inclusive classrooms. In this episode, education journalists Jackie Mader and Christina Samuels offer their unique perspectives on the preparedness of general education teachers to support students with disabilities. Through recounting field studies and personal experiences, Jackie Mader highlights how some teacher preparation programs strive for better inclusivity and the ongoing obstacles they confront.

This episode sheds light on the ongoing national shortfall of special education teachers, as discussed by Christina Samuels. She explores the reasons behind the persistent shortage and potential solutions, including the role of co-teaching and more inclusive training for general educators. Their discussions highlight educators’ struggles, legal obligations, pedagogical challenges, and a crucial need to elevate expectations and practices in inclusive education.

Complete show notes and transcript: https://mcie.org/think-inclusive/christina-samuels-jackie-mader-unprepared-teachers-and-the-special-educator-shortage/

Exploring Inclusion in Faith, Disability, and Sexual Identity Oct 01, 2019

Show notes

In this thought-provoking episode of the Think Inclusive Podcast, host Tim Villegas delves deep into the complexities of inclusion, especially for LGBTQ individuals and those with disabilities, within the context of Christian educational institutions. The conversation begins with a look at Azusa Pacific University's fluctuating policies regarding same-sex relationships, highlighting the challenges and isolation faced by LGBTQ students. Erin Green of Brave Commons elaborates on these struggles, emphasizing the profound emotional and psychological impact of non-affirming environments.

The narrative transitions to a compelling dialogue with Mike McHargue, who shares his journey of being diagnosed with autism as an adult. He reflects on how this late diagnosis has shaped his understanding of his own behaviors and the broader societal implications of inclusion. Mike’s discussion touches on his early experiences in special education, the significant barriers he faced, and how the integration of technology, such as typing tools, was a game-changer for him. The episode wraps up with a hopeful vision for a future where all individuals—regardless of gender identity, sexual orientation, or disability—are fully included and accommodated in society.

Complete show notes and transcript: https://mcie.org/think-inclusive/mike-mchargue-erin-green-same-sex-relationships-autism-inclusion/