The Oral Talmud

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Episode 17: The Iranian Talmud with Shai Secunda Oct 06, 2025

Show notes

“I love the world of the Talmud. I love the fact that they need to justify, they wanna justify, they wanna talk and talk and talk; the way that people who are less socially confident sometimes find themselves doing, when we're in a situation where we're in a new community, and we just, you know, ramble! That's something I love about the Talmud.” - Shai Secunda

Welcome to The Oral Talmud, our weekly deep dive chevruta study partnership, discovering how voices of the Talmud from 1500 years ago can help us rethink Judaism today.

This week Dan & Benay learn with special guest scholar Shai Secunda! Shai Secunda is Jacob Neusner Professor in the History and Theology of Judaism at Bard College. He received a bachelor’s degree from Ner Israel Rabbinical College, a master’s from Johns Hopkins University, and an MA/PhD from Yeshiva University. He is the author of “The Iranian Talmud: Reading the Talmud in its Sasanian Context” (University of Pennsylvania Press, 2014) and “The Talmud’s Red Fence: Menstruation and Difference in Babylonian Judaism and its Sasanian Context” (Oxford University Press, 2020).

What are some aspects of the geopolitical context in which the Talmud was formed? What was it about the time, space, and culture where the Rabbis lived that led them to construct the Gemara, its winding justifications and responses to the rarely justified radical changes of the Mishnah? How granular can we get into eras of the Talmudic period? Was anyone else doing what the Rabbis were? How do we navigate difficult gaps in evidence?

Find an edited transcript and full shownotes of references and further reading on The Oral Talmud webpage for this episode! Access the Sefaria Source Sheet to explore key Talmud texts and find the original video of our discussion. The Oral Talmud is a co-production of Judaism Unbound and SVARA: A Traditionally Radical Yeshiva. If you’re enjoying this podcast, please help us keep both fabulous Jewish organizations going with a one-time or monthly tax-deductible donation at oraltalmud.com. You can find a donate button on the top right corner of the website.

Episode 16: The Greatest Voices Are Anonymous with Daniel Boyarin Sep 29, 2025

Show notes

“I find it deeply moving and worthy of homilies that arguably the most influential voices in the history of Jewish thinking are anonymous.” - Daniel Boyarin

Welcome to The Oral Talmud, our weekly deep dive chevruta study partnership, discovering how voices of the Talmud from 1500 years ago can help us rethink Judaism today.

This week Dan & Benay learn with special guest scholar Daniel Boyarin! Boyarin is the Hermann P. and Sophia Taubman Emeritus Professor of Talmudic Culture in the Departments of Near Eastern Studies and Rhetoric at the University of California at Berkeley. He is the author of many articles and books on the Talmud, including “A Traveling Homeland: The Babylonian Talmud as Diaspora” (2015), “Border Lines: The Partition of Judaeo-Christianity” (2004), “Carnal Israel: Reading Sex in Talmudic Culture” (1993), “Socrates and the Fat Rabbis” (2009), “Unheroic Conduct: The Rise of Heterosexuality and the Invention of the Jewish Man” (1997), and, most recently “The No-State Solution: A Jewish Manifesto” (2023), themes of which Boyarin experiments with in this interview from the Summer of 2020.

What does it mean to approach to Talmud as a portable homeland for a Diaspora nation? How does it feel to be charmed by Talmud? Is Talmud a project of intentional incoherence? What lessons do we learn from the voice of the anonymous editor(s) of Talmud. How do we find a usable past?

Episode 15: Svara’ing Your Svara Sep 22, 2025

Show notes

“It's only when you know why, and the essence behind the whys, that you are able to create. You're able to then be free of the momentary form of a practice, which is trying to achieve a certain goal, and create other forms that achieve that same goal.” - Benay Lappe

Welcome to The Oral Talmud, our weekly deep dive chevruta study partnership, discovering how voices of the Talmud from 1500 years ago can help us rethink Judaism today.

This week we return to the legend of Rabbi Meir, who we began learning about in Episode 13. When we met him, he was a master of Rabbinic acrobatics, able to turn any law inside out, and offer his incredible logic as support. Now we’re going back a page to learn about his origins, who his teachers were - and how he learned to “Gemar his Gemara & Savar his Svara!”

Why hone our gemirna and savirna? How do we learn to find the radical messages on every page of Talmud? What do we get from different teachers? When do we turn to Rashi’s commentary, and how do we put it in context? Why do we ask “why”?

This week’s text: Rabbi Meir’s Origins (Eruvin 13a and Sotah 20a)

Episode 14: Reading the Angel of Death with Ruth Calderon Sep 15, 2025

Show notes

“Even if the good book was not written by God, the Talmudic page is often a good place to encounter the Divine.” - Ruth Calderon

Welcome to The Oral Talmud, our weekly deep dive chevruta study partnership, discovering how voices of the Talmud from 1500 years ago can help us rethink Judaism today.

This week Dan & Benay learn with special guest scholar Ruth Calderon, author of “A Bride for One Night: Talmud Tales” (2014). In 1996, Calderon founded ALMA: A Home for Jewish Culture in Tel Aviv, where she built pathways for secular Jews to enter into Talmud study. Calderon also served on the Knesset from 2013-2015, and reflects on dynamics between secular and religious Israelis, as well as the impact of coronavirus in 2020 (when this episode was recorded).

How do we find our paths to Talmud? What is Talmud doing that gives the sense of the Divine? What does it mean to “read against grain,” and how can it help us expand our perspective? What can the story Ruth brings teach us about how the Rabbis thought of approaching death? Who do we see in this relationship with Death now?

This week’s text: Rabbi Yehoshua ben Levi and the Angel of Death (Ketubot 77b)

Episode 13: Using Tradition to Overturn Tradition Sep 08, 2025

Show notes

“You don't have to stand outside of the tradition to fix it. If you realize where the tradition is wrong, that doesn't put you outside of it. That puts you squarely in the center of it, standing on the shoulders of the greatest ones who have the ability to, from the inside of tradition, using the Torah’s mechanisms and ideas to overturn it.” - Benay Lappe

Welcome to The Oral Talmud, our weekly deep dive chevruta study partnership, discovering how voices of the Talmud from 1500 years ago can help us rethink Judaism today.

Part 2 of our exploration of L’Taher et HaSheretz! Using the Torah to make ritually pure the very creepy crawlies which the Torah says are ritually impure! Last week we learned that this feat of Rabbinic acrobatics was a requirement for holding a position in the Sanhedrin, the ancient Jewish court system. This week we learn about Rabbi Meir, who could justify changing ritually purity and impurity statuses like he was juggling!

What is the discussion of shifting ritual purity status a radical metaphor for in the Talmud? When does argument get us closer to the truth, and when is it just arguing to derail? How do we peel apart the historical figures in the Talmud from what they’ve come to symbolize? How would YOU purify the sheretz?

Tune in next week for an exciting interview with Ruth Calderon, author of “A Bride for One Night: Talmud Tales”.

This week’s text: Rabbi Meir, Sumakhus, Ravina, and the Sheretz (Eruvin 13b)

Episode 12: The Ideal Person Sep 01, 2025

Show notes

“And in Jewish law, if you get 23 Jews to agree on something? You know something is wrong!” - Benay Lappe

Welcome to The Oral Talmud, our weekly deep dive chevruta study partnership, discovering how voices of the Talmud from 1500 years ago can help us rethink Judaism today.

Come and learn BENAY’s favourite text in all Talmud: L’Taher et HaSheretz! Here the Rabbis ask what qualities are required in someone who will serve in the ancient Jewish court system, the Sanhedrin. We get two very different, absolutely radical opinions, and the second will be our jumping off point for the next few episodes.

Are the story sections and legal sections of Talmud really all that different? How do they relate to each other? When do we desire unanimity, and when is it a sign of a greater problem? Who do we want in charge of decisions of life and death? How do the Rabbis teach us to overturn Torah this time?

This week’s text: Who is Fit for the Sanhedrin (Sanhedrin 17a-17b)

Episode 11: The Broken Social Contract Aug 25, 2025

Show notes

Welcome to The Oral Talmud, our weekly deep dive chevruta study partnership, discovering how voices of the Talmud from 1500 years ago can help us rethink Judaism today.

Like our previous week’s episode, this was recorded in June of 2020, in response to the brutal murder of George Floyd at the hands of police. Likewise, we turn to another text which emphasizes the culpability of bystanders and those who remain silent when witnessing cruelty – a story of how one wrong party invitation devolves into the Fall of Jerusalem. When is it time to speak up? How do victims of harm understand our silence? What compromises are we willing to make to avoid worse consequences? Which actions become understandable when we recognize how deeply the social contract has been violated? When we tell stories about our past, what are we saying about our present?

This week’s text: Kamtza, bar Kamtza, and the Fall of Jerusalem (Gittin 55b-56a)

Episode 10: The Obligation to Protest Aug 18, 2025

Show notes

“You’ve got to decide with whom and where your voice is going to be heeded. Where are you going to have the power to effect change? That’s your olam. If we get to this big world, we can become actually overcome with powerlessness. But I think that’s the driving question of the bottom line of this text. What’s your world? Who’s your kahal?” - Benay Lappe

Welcome to The Oral Talmud, our weekly deep dive chevruta study partnership, discovering how voices of the Talmud from 1500 years ago can help us rethink Judaism today.

This week’s episode was recorded in June of 2020, in response to the brutal murder of George Floyd at the hands of police. We turn to a piece of Talmud which SVARA shared out in the days following, a lens for understanding the enormous groundswell of protests and political action which followed in response. What is the context of this powerful slogan about the responsibility to protest? Who is in a meaningful position to speak out in different spheres? What does it mean to be impactful without being able to immediately solve systemic issues?

This week’s text: The Obligation to Protest (Shabbat 54b-55a)

Episode 9: Turning Around Aug 11, 2025

Show notes

“That was the rabbinic genius, to say that that which is wholly new also is given from God at Mount Sinai. That’s a genius sleight of hand that allows you to feel a sense of continuity and connection and history and sacredness in what is absolutely new.” - Benay Lappe

Welcome to The Oral Talmud, our weekly deep dive chevruta study partnership, discovering how voices of the Talmud from 1500 years ago can help us rethink Judaism today.

This week we reach the end of the Rabban Gamliel story we’ve been learning for the past two episodes. After being deposed as leader of the study hall, and watching in awe the flood of new students to the academy, Rabban Gamliel visits Rabbi Yehoshua, the man he had embarrassed so much that the rest of the scholars impeached him. Does Rabban Gamliel really drop by to make peace, or are there other motivations at play? How does Rabbi Yehoshua’s response echo through the eons to call out/in leaders of today?

The episode does have a broad re-cap from the two of us, but of course we recommend listening to the previous episodes as well.

And then! For a special Shavuot text (we recorded this at the end of May 2020), we visit Mount Sinai, and follow Moses’s mystical time-traveling journey through the twists and turns of Torah interpretation to the back of Rabbi Akiva’s classroom. What are the metaphors of this story illustrating? What model is it building for teaching us how to connect our innovation to our history?

This week’s text:

The Removal of Rabban Gamliel, Conclusion (Berakhot 28a)
Moses in Rabbi Akiva’s Classroom (Menachot 29b)

Access the full Sefaria Source Sheet with additional show notes via this link. Find an edited transcript and full shownotes of references and further reading on The Oral Talmud webpage for this episode! The Oral Talmud is a co-production of Judaism Unbound and SVARA: A Traditionally Radical Yeshiva. If you’re enjoying this podcast, please help us keep both fabulous Jewish organizations going with a one-time or monthly tax-deductible donation at oraltalmud.com. You can find a donate button on the top right corner of the website.

Episode 8: Dreams and Discovery Aug 04, 2025

Show notes

“I don’t have to win; I don’t have to get the person to capitulate to me. I don’t have to hear the person’s apology – as long as I’ve gotten the world to be the way I need the world to be.” - Dan Libenson

Welcome to The Oral Talmud, our weekly deep dive chevruta study partnership, discovering how voices of the Talmud from 1500 years ago can help us rethink Judaism today.

This week we continue discussing the story of Rabban Gamliel, this week focusing on his reaction to being deposed as the head of the study hall, and the massive influx of new students to the yeshiva that followed. The episode does have a generous re-cap from Benay, but of course we recommend listening to the previous episode as well. What lessons can we be learning as marginalized people trying to build spaces and find our voices? What do we do when the repentance we hope for from people who have hurt us just doesn’t come? How do we make sure we’re not withholding Torah from the world?

This week’s text: The Removal of Rabban Gamliel, Aftermath (Berakhot 28a)

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