The David Frum Show

Latest Episodes:

The Preventable Return of Deadly Diseases Sep 17, 2025

Show notes

On this episode of The David Frum Show, The Atlantic’s David Frum opens with reflections on President Donald Trump’s repeated delays to enforce the congressionally mandated TikTok ban. He explains how Trump’s pattern of ignoring laws, whether by inventing tariffs, bypassing Congress on spending, or granting de facto immunity to allies, erodes the foundation of our constitutional government.

Then David is joined by the historian Kyle Harper, author of Plagues Upon the Earth, for a conversation about infectious disease and the politics of vaccination. They trace humanity’s long struggle against killers such as smallpox, polio, and measles, and the scientific breakthroughs that transformed life expectancy. Harper explains how mistrust, misinformation, and polarization have fueled a resurgence of measles in the 2020s, even after it had been eradicated in the United States. Kyle and David also discuss what Rome can teach us about living with plagues, why public trust is essential to public health, and why the next pandemic will find us less prepared than we were for COVID-19.

Finally, David ends the podcast with a discussion of Carl Schmitt’s The Concept of the Political. He examines how Schmitt’s claim that politics is defined by the division of friend and enemy is influencing modern authoritarian thinkers in America.

Get more from your favorite Atlantic voices when you subscribe. You’ll enjoy unlimited access to Pulitzer-winning journalism, from clear-eyed analysis and insight on breaking news to fascinating explorations of our world. Atlantic subscribers also get access to exclusive subscriber audio in Apple Podcasts. Subscribe today at TheAtlantic.com/Listener.

Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Trump Invades Blue America Sep 10, 2025

Show notes

On this episode of The David Frum Show, The Atlantic’s David Frum examines how President Donald Trump’s foreign-policy decisions are undermining U.S. alliances and global credibility. He discusses incidents including the detainment of South Korean workers in Georgia and alleged covert operations in Greenland. Frum argues that these actions reflect ego-driven weakness rather than leadership, and explores the broader consequences for America’s international standing.

Then Frum is joined by the Georgetown law professor and former Pentagon adviser Rosa Brooks, who also served as a D.C. reserve police officer. They discuss Trump’s deployment of 2,200 National Guard troops to Washington, D.C.; the limits of militarized policing; constitutional concerns; and the dangers of masked, unidentified federal agents. Brooks warns listeners that such tactics could normalize authoritarian behavior and set troubling precedents for future elections.

Frum closes with a new book segment, with this week’s on Mary Shelley’s Frankenstein, in which he discusses how the novel’s unreliable narrators highlight the importance of critical reading in an era of declining literacy.

Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

The Fight for Truth Sep 03, 2025

Show notes

On this episode of The David Frum Show, The Atlantic’s David Frum discusses recent questions about President Donald Trump’s health and explores what a potential J. D. Vance presidency might mean for the country. He contrasts Trump’s impulsive, ego-driven style with Vance’s methodical, ideologically driven approach, examining how each wields power, pursues personal and political goals, and shapes domestic and foreign policy. Frum explains why understanding these differences is crucial for anticipating the challenges ahead.

Then Frum is joined by Jonathan Rauch, a senior fellow at the Brookings Institution and the author of The Constitution of Knowledge: A Defense of Truth. They discuss how societies decide what’s real, why disinformation has become a central political strategy, and living in a “reality-based community.” Rauch explains the dangers of the “fire hose of falsehood,” why authoritarian regimes weaponize confusion, and why, even amid today’s “machinery of lies,” reality still has the final word.

Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Why America Isn’t Rome (And Why That Matters) Aug 27, 2025

Show notes

On this episode of The David Frum Show, The Atlantic’s David Frum opens with reflections on the misuse of history in today’s politics. He argues that fascism, once thought to have been buried by the Second World War, has reemerged in modern forms, thriving on the endless hunt for enemies, stoking culture wars, and exploiting new technologies. And he explains why the best antidotes remain liberty, equality, and sometimes humor.

Then David is joined by Mary Beard, one of the world’s foremost scholars of Rome and author of the New York Times best seller Emperor of Rome, for a conversation about what the ancient world can teach us about current politics. They discuss how Roman emperors wielded power, why excess and corruption were baked into the system, and how fragile even the strongest-seeming regimes can be. Beard explains why myths about Roman grandeur persist, what daily life actually looked like under the empire, and what lessons modern democracies should (and should not) draw from Rome’s rise and fall.

We've put together a short survey to learn more about our audience. It would be very helpful if you could take a few minutes to answer it at theatlantic.com/survey. As a thank you, the first 100 respondents will get a $20 gift card.

Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

How ICE Became Trump’s Secret Army Aug 20, 2025

Show notes

On this episode of The David Frum Show, The Atlantic’s David Frum begins with reflections on how Donald Trump’s sweeping immigration crackdown has transformed America into what he calls a “society based on fear.” Frum warns that the president’s methods risk discrediting not just immigration enforcement, but also law, police, and the very idea of democratic legitimacy.

Then Frum is joined by his Atlantic colleague Caitlin Dickerson, whose Pulitzer Prize–winning reporting has laid bare the human and institutional realities of immigration enforcement. They discuss her latest investigation into the staggering expansion of ICE and the One Big Beautiful Bill Act, which has supercharged its budget to unprecedented levels. Dickerson explains how billions of dollars in new funding are fueling mass detention, empowering private-prison companies, and reshaping U.S. diplomacy while failing to solve the core challenges of immigration.

Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Why Housing Feels Hopeless Aug 13, 2025

Show notes

On this episode of The David Frum Show, The Atlantic’s David Frum opens with reflections on the upcoming 80th anniversary of the end of World War II and what Donald Trump’s recent statements about “Victory Day” reveal about how America is forgetting the meaning of peace, cooperation, and democratic leadership.

Then David is joined by Glenn Kelman, CEO of Redfin, for a candid look at the broken state of the U.S. housing market. Kelman explains why both buyers and sellers are miserable, how pandemic-era mortgage rates have frozen supply, and why the next generation is increasingly stuck, unable to buy, and often unable to move. They discuss zoning reform, immigration, housing deterioration, and why, despite the bleak outlook, Kelman still believes there’s hope for long-term correction—if America can relearn how to build.

Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Ukraine Won’t Surrender Aug 06, 2025

Show notes

On this episode of The David Frum Show, The Atlantic’s David Frum opens with a warning about the crumbling of U.S. support for Ukraine under President Donald Trump. He lays out how the Trump administration has slowed the flow of weapons to Ukraine, undermined sanctions on Russia, and made empty promises about future action while spending more money upgrading Trump’s private jet than aiding Ukraine’s defense.

Then David is joined by the journalist Tim Mak, reporting from Kyiv, and Adrian Karatnycky, a senior fellow with the Atlantic Council’s Eurasia Center, for a conversation about Ukraine’s resilience in the face of U.S. abandonment. They discuss why the Ukrainian people remain united, how battlefield conditions have evolved, and why no politician—Ukrainian or American—can force a peace that rewards Russian aggression. They also talk about President Volodymyr Zelensky’s controversial anti-corruption reforms, the surge of youth-led protests, and whether Ukraine’s Western allies truly understand what’s at stake.

Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Trump’s Tariff Disaster Jul 30, 2025

Show notes

On this episode of The David Frum Show, The Atlantic’s David Frum examines how protectionism, once a fringe idea in U.S. politics, became central to modern Republican trade policy. He traces how President Donald Trump made tariffs a political weapon, and why these policies continue to carry political appeal despite their economic cost.

Then David is joined by the historian and trade expert Doug Irwin for a conversation about what tariffs actually do. Irwin explains how protectionist policies have repeatedly backfired in American history, why they persist, and how the U.S. abandoned the bipartisan free-trade consensus that lasted for nearly a century. The two discuss who really pays for tariffs, why tariffs rarely achieve their stated goals, and what it would take to rebuild political support for open markets.

Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

The Fight for the Political Center Jul 23, 2025

Show notes

On this episode of The David Frum Show, The Atlantic’s David Frum opens with a warning about President Donald Trump’s escalating attacks on press freedom. David discusses Trump’s lawsuit against The Wall Street Journal, explains how Trump is using presidential power to suppress coverage of his alleged ties to Jeffrey Epstein, and argues that Trump’s second term represents a deeper threat to the First Amendment than anything seen in modern American history.

Then David is joined by Representative Ritchie Torres of New York for a conversation about the future of the Democratic Party. Torres explains why the Democratic center has become too passive; how the far left gained influence through intensity, not majorities; and why slogans alone can’t solve America’s affordability crisis. They discuss the rise of performative politics, the need for a serious governing agenda, and Torres’s personal journey from public housing to Congress.

Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

The Wrecking of the FBI Jul 16, 2025

Show notes

On this episode of The David Frum Show, The Atlantic’s David Frum opens with a warning about President Donald Trump’s decision to shut down the conversation around the federal investigation into Jeffrey Epstein. David explains why Trump’s move has triggered backlash from parts of his own base and why it reveals a deeper political fracture inside the MAGA movement.

Then David is joined by the former FBI counterintelligence official Peter Strzok, who shares his insights on what’s happening at the bureau during Trump’s second term. Strzok, who is still engaged in a lawsuit with the government over his 2018 firing, explains how Trump loyalists such as the FBI’s director, Kash Patel, and its deputy director, Dan Bongino, are dismantling the agency’s national-security functions: purging experts, sidelining investigations, and leaving the United States dangerously vulnerable to terrorism, foreign espionage, and cyberattacks.

Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices