Script Apart with Al Horner

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1917 with Krysty Wilson-Cairns Sep 21, 2021

Show notes

This week we’re joined by Krysty Wilson-Cairns, co-writer of one of the year’s most hotly anticipated thrillers: Edgar Wright’s Last Night In Soho. Audiences are in for a seriously gripping white-knuckle ride if that movie turns out to be anything like Krysty’s first-produced feature film, the incredible 1917. Co-written with director Sam Mendes, 1917 followed two British soldiers as they embarked on a nail-biting mission across No Man’s Land in the first World War. With communication lines down, the lives of 1,600 men rest on this duo delivering a message to a stubborn battalion captain that his soldiers are about to walk into an ambush.

On release, the film garnered more attention for how it told its story, rather than the story itself. 1917 used long, intricately-choreographed takes to give the impression of a story told across just two uninterrupted shots. It was heralded as an unrelenting real-time glimpse into the horrors of war unlike anything before it. But the movie’s technical accomplishments would have felt empty were there not an emotive plot powering it forward. In the conversation you’re about to hear, Krysty pulls the curtain back on every element of that plot, detailing the painstaking research that went into forming the film’s characters. We also talk about discarded plans for a mustard gas attack sequence, why a certain central character simply had to die, and why we as a society continue to tell World War I stories a century on.

Support for today's episode comes from Screencraft, WeScreenplay and Caveday.

Script Apart is hosted by Al Horner and produced by Kamil Dymek, with music from Stefan Bindley-Taylor. Follow us on Twitter and Instagram, or email us on thescriptapartpodcast@gmail.com.
Get a free digital copy of the Script Apart Magazine by supporting us on Patreon! 50 pages of interviews with screenwriters, including exclusive conversations you won't find anywhere else. You can also now support the show on Ko-Fi.

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Sinister with C. Robert Cargill Sep 07, 2021

Show notes

Today on the show, we’re joined by screenwriter and novelist C. Robert Cargill. In 2012, Cargill and frequent collaborator Scott Derrickson put a chill down the spines of audiences with a supernatural horror that was low in budget but sky-high in imagination. Sinister saw Ethan Hawke star as Ellison Oswalt, a washed-up true crime writer who goes to extreme lengths to reignite his career. After moving his wife and kids into the small-town home of a recently murdered family, whose gruesome killing remains unsolved, he discovers in the attic a box. In it are a collection of unsettling home videos that hint at a demonic conspiracy at play. As Ellison closes in on the truth, a terrifying entity closes in on him.

The film put Cargill and Derickson on a path towards bigger projects – a Marvel movie, 2016’s trippy Doctor Strange soon followed. It’s easy to see why they were suddenly in demand. Sinister is a brutally effective masterclass in horror filmmaking that shows the power of a screenwriting philosophy Cargill swears by. The key to telling an engaging horror tale is to write a gripping grounded drama that’s then gatecrashed by a supernatural other, he explains in this episode, also delving into the origins of the film’s Bablyonian deity antagonist, Bagul the eater of Children, and all the ways Sinister evolved en route to the big screen. For example, did you know Sinister was originally titled Super 8 and presented Bagul as a “fucked up Willy Wonka” as Cargill puts it?
Support for today's episode comes from Screencraft, WeScreenplay and Caveday.

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Contact with James V. Hart Aug 24, 2021

Show notes

Our guest this week is James V. Hart, whose screenwriting talents have seen him enlisted to pen scripts for everyone from Steven Spielberg to Francis Ford Coppola. There's one movie in his extensive filmography that he looks back on with particular pride and emotion, however. Contact – the Robert Zemeckis-directed story of a scientist played by Jodie Foster, who discovers proof of extraterrestrial life – was a novel before James adapted it into one of the most celebrated sci-fi dramas of all time. The book was written by renowned astronomer Carl Sagan – a close personal friend of James'. Carl sadly didn't live to see the film's completion, passing away after a long illness just months before Contact's release.
James looks back on the movie today as a tribute to his friend and the astronomer's brilliant partner, author Ann Druyan, both of whom he worked with closely while adapting Contact. It was a tricky screenplay to get right. As you'll discover in this episode, the book was a dense meditation on what would happen if contact were made with life from another planet – the ripples it would send through politics, through religion, and everything in between. It was a book rooted, as anyone who knows Carl's work might expect, in scientific fact. Translating the novel into a piece of blockbuster entertainment without losing any of the book's authority and spirit of scientific discovery, in a time dominated by the explosions and spectacle of alien movies like Independence Day, was a daunting task.
This is the story of how James pulled it off. Over an engrossing sixty minutes, we reflect on the movies that Contact helped inspire, a version of the script that included the Pope as a major character, and why James is not satisfied with the film's ending. Truly, they should have sent a poet to interview James. Instead, you guys have Al. Sorry about that.
Support for this episode comes from MUBI, Screencraft and Launchpad.
Script Apart is a podcast about the first-draft secrets behind great movies. Each episode, the screenwriter behind a beloved film shares with us their initial screenplay for that movie. We then talk through what changed, what didn’t and why on its journey to the big screen.

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Black Widow with Eric Pearson Aug 19, 2021

Show notes

Today on the show – a deep dive into Marvel's latest superhero adventure, Black Widow with Eric Pearson! Eric is the screenwriter responsible for giving Natasha Romanoff – the Avengers’ super-spy with a dark past and powerful fighting skills – the solo movie she’s always deserved. His account of writing the film is a fascinating glimpse inside the Marvel machine: how their movies are written, the relentless pace at which that machine moves, and how each film is made to fit into a much bigger interconnected story at script-level. We’ll warn you now, though – you may well feel stressed just hearing about the challenges in front of him as he came onboard the project.

Eric had inherited an outline mapped out by Ned Benson and Wandavision showrunner Jac Shaefer. Within that outline was a bunch of puzzle pieces, and not much time to make them fit – production was looming and sets for the movie were already being constructed for Black Widow. In this episode, Eric shares how he navigated that intense pressure, what guided him towards the theme of family at the heart of this movie and all the different avenues the movie explored – including the truth behind rumours of a planned cameo from Tony Stark.

This is a spoiler-filled conversation so if you’re yet to see Black Widow, hit pause now, get yourself to a cinema then come back as we jump into all of this movie’s twists and turns.

Support for this episode comes from Screencraft, MUBI and WeScreenplay.

Script Apart is a podcast about the first-draft secrets behind great movies. Each episode, the screenwriter behind a beloved film shares with us their initial screenplay for that movie. We then talk through what changed, what didn’t and why on its journey to the big screen.
Script Apart is hosted by Al Horner and produced by Kamil Dymek, with music from Stefan Bindley-Taylor. Follow us on Twitter and Instagram, or email us on thescriptapartpodcast@gmail.com.

Get a free digital copy of the Script Apart Magazine by supporting us on Patreon! Featuring 51 pages of interviews with great screenwriters, including exclusive conversations you won't find anywhere else. You can also now support the show on Ko-Fi.

Support the show

Advertising Inquiries: https://redcircle.com/brands
Privacy & Opt-Out: https://redcircle.com/privacy

Speed with Graham Yost Aug 17, 2021

Show notes

Pop quiz, hot shots – which pedal-to-the-metal Keanu Reeves blockbuster set a breakneck new pace for action cinema in 1994? The answer is, of course, Speed – directed by Jan de Bont and written by our guest today, the fantastic Graham Yost. Graham had the idea for the film after a conversation with his father about Akira Kurusawa’s unproduced script, Runaway Train. Taking the Japanese auteur’s loose idea and throwing a bomb into the mix, as well as a maniacal bomber played by Dennis Hopper, the film saw Keanu star as Jack Traven, an LAPD officer tasked with saving a bus full of people from a device that will explode if the vehicle slows below 50mph. Full of nerve-shredding tension and death-defying set pieces, it’s regularly voted among the best action movies of all time, and rightly so if you ask us.
We caught up with Graham, who you might also know for his work on Justified and From The Earth To The Moon, to hear about how he wrote Speed. We talk about his shockingly different original villain for the movie, the alternate way his first draft ended, the lines from the film that Joss Whedon punched up and his pitches for two further Speed movies that sadly never got off the ground. You don’t have to listen to this episode on a runaway bus tearing through traffic, but it might heighten the experience.
Support for this episode comes from Screencraft, MUBI and Launchpad.
Script Apart is hosted by Al Horner and produced by Kamil Dymek, with music from Stefan Bindley-Taylor. Follow us on Twitter and Instagram, or email us on thescriptapartpodcast@gmail.com.
Get a free digital copy of the Script Apart Magazine by supporting us on Patreon! 51 pages of interviews with great screenwriters, including exclusive conversations you won't find anywhere else. You can also now support the show on Ko-Fi.

Support the show

Advertising Inquiries: https://redcircle.com/brands
Privacy & Opt-Out: https://redcircle.com/privacy

The Suicide Squad with James Gunn Aug 12, 2021

Show notes

And we’re back! Welcome to season two of Script Apart – a podcast about the first draft secrets of great movies. Each episode, a brilliant screenwriter revisits their initial screenplay for what became a beloved movie, discussing what changed, what didn’t and why – from first draft to the big screen.

Because we’ve missed you, we’re kicking off the season with not one, not two, but three episodes over the coming week. Joining us for the first is a writer-director who needs very little introduction. James Gunn’s hyper-bright, ludicrously funny adventure comedies have made him a blockbuster cinema household name, known for ripping up the rulebook on superhero storytelling. Having made two acclaimed Guardians of The Galaxy movies for Marvel, James recently turned his attention to another comic book stable of characters – DC. The Suicide Squad, his latest movie, starring Idris Elba and Margot Robbie, sees a group of incarcerated villains from the world of Batman, Superman and Wonder Woman blackmailed into taking on a dangerous mission for the US government.

Part reboot, part sequel to 2016’s Suicide Squad, The Suicide Squad features, among other things, a talking shark, a grumpy sharpshooter, a homicidal cheerleader and a man made up almost entirely of polka dots. Together, they visit a remote South American island, where they do battle with a giant starfish from outer space, as you do. On today’s episode, we hear how the film’s hilariously sharp screenplay came together. Get ready to discover why James originally toyed with pitting his ragtag team of misfits up against Superman in the movie, why the American government is the real villain of the film, why he loves rooting outlandish characters in a humanising sadness and how he originally planned to kill a beloved character in The Suicide Squad – only to decide that it would be just too heartless.

This film famously coincided with a tumultuous time in James’ life: in 2018, he was fired by Marvel over historic tweets that were deemed offensive by his Guardians Of The Galaxy bosses. This was the project that, in his own words, saved him. He’s since been rehired by Marvel, and is back working on Guardians Of The Galaxy 3, but at that time, James feared for his career. Listen out for the philosophy about storytelling that got him through that difficult time, and ensured he came out of it a better writer and filmmaker. Also in the episode, James’s guide to writing great action and how to get yourself out of a corner when you kill a character in your script who – uh oh – it transpires DC aren’t done with yet.

This is a spoiler-filled conversation so if you’re yet to see The Suicide Squad, hit pause now, get yourself to a cinema then come back as we dive into this film’s major plot points like a javelin-wielding Harley Quinn into the eyeball of a giant alien starfish.

Support for this episode comes from Screencraft, MUBI and WeScreenplay.
Script Apart is hosted by Al Horner and produced by Kamil Dymek, with music from Stefan Bindley-Taylor. Follow us on Twitter and Instagram, or email us on thescriptapartpodcast@gmail.com. Get a free digital copy of the Script Apart Magazine by supporting us on Patreon! 51 pages of interviews with great screenwriters, including exclusive conversations you won't find anywhere else. You can also now support the show on Ko-Fi.

Support the show

Advertising Inquiries: https://redcircle.com/brands
Privacy & Opt-Out: https://redcircle.com/privacy

The Last Of Us Part II with Neil Druckmann and Halley Gross Apr 27, 2021

Show notes

Script Apart is a podcast about the first drafts of great movies. Or at least, it usually is. Today, in the final episode of our 2021 awards season mini-series, we’re delving deep into this year’s BAFTA Game Awards’ Game of The Year – The Last of Us Part II, with director Neil Druckmann and co-writer Halley Gross.
If you’ve played this emotionally devastating survival thriller, you’ll know exactly why we wanted to cover it on this show. Set in a post-apocalyptic America brought to its knees by a parasitic infection, the game caught up with teenage survivor Ellie, five years after the events of the first Last Of Us. What begins as a tale of revenge eventually gives way to a profound meditation on the futility of violence, split into an ambitious two-part structure that forces players to empathise with the so-called enemy. There’s a reason why it sold over four million copies in its first weekend alone: The Last of Us Part II is a masterpiece in storytelling, full of brilliantly realised characters and sharp observations on who we are and who we could be as a society.
We caught up with Neil and Halley to hear about how they wrote the game, turning back the clock to an early, open-world iteration of the Last of Us Part II that had a very different ending. Across a fascinating conversation, covering as much about this 20-hour game in forty minutes as humanly possible, we discuss the parts of their own lives they drew on to tell this story, the theme-building advice of author Robert McKee that helped shape The Last Of Us, and how a single detail in their first draft of the game’s final scene almost cast the future of the franchise in a totally different light.
Speaking of the future – you may want to stick around till the end for some tantalising updates on a potential Last Of Us Part III, as well as the upcoming HBO TV series based on the first game. This is of course a spoiler-filled conversation so if you’re yet to play this astonishing game, hit pause, grab a copy on PlayStation today, then come back as we delve into every detail of this phenomenal game.
Support for this episode comes from Arc Studio – the beautifully-designed screenwriting programme whose intuitive interface and host of innovative features helps you get the most out of your writing time – and Coverfly, who curate the best screenwriting talent-discovery programs into one place and connect emerging screenwriters with industry professionals who can bring their ideas to screen.
Script Apart is a podcast about the first-draft secrets behind great movies. Each episode, the screenwriter behind a beloved film shares with us their initial screenplay for that movie. We then talk through what changed, what didn’t and why on its journey to the big screen. All proceeds go to Black Minds Matter UK, the NHS Charities Covid-19 Appeal and the Film and TV Charity.
Script Apart is hosted by Al Horner and produced by Kamil Dymek, with music from Stefan Bindley-Taylor. You can follow Script Apart on Twitter and Instagram. You can also email us on thescriptapartpodcast@gmail.com.

Support the show

Advertising Inquiries: https://redcircle.com/brands
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Sound Of Metal with Darius Marder Apr 13, 2021

Show notes

In our latest awards season mini-series special, we chat with Darius Marder – director and co-writer of the astounding Sound of Metal. Nominated for six Academy Awards, including Best Picture and Best Original Screenplay, the film’s an intimate look into the life of a punk drummer with a history of substance abuse, whose world is thrown into disarray when he suffers hearing loss. Desperate to avoid relapsing into drug dependency again, our hero Ruben joins a community of deaf recovered addicts on a remote farm, where he begins on a path towards relearning who he is and reconstructing his life. Riz Ahmed is sensational as the wiry, introverted Ruben, working from a script that treats its characters not as conduits to tell a story, but living breathing people with depth and flaws.
Achieving that depth on the page required an intense amount of work for Darius and his brother/writing partner Abraham. On top of the countless hours spent writing out hundreds of pages of back story for their characters, the pair put a massive amount of emotional labour into Sound of Metal to make their story as grounded as possible. As you’ll hear in this episode, Darius drew on his own experience of a crumbling relationship while writing scenes between Ruben and his partner Lou, while Abraham let his own history of debilitating medical problems inform the feeling of freefall that Ruben finds himself in when his hearing begins to falter.
We spoke to Darius about the many meanings of the film’s title, the punishing process of writing the film and why it was important to him not to present deafness as a problem to be fixed. Darius also shared with me how Sound Of Metal was originally envisioned as not just one film but two – with another movie delving into what happens to Lou intended to be released simultaneously. This is a spoiler-filled conversation, so if you haven’t yet seen Sound Of Metal, you know the drill by now – hit pause, head to Amazon Prime Video to watch it, then come back as we dive into every detail of this great movie.
Support for this episode comes from Arc Studio – the beautifully-designed screenwriting programme whose intuitive interface and host of innovative features helps you get the most out of your writing time – and Coverfly, who curate the best screenwriting talent-discovery programs into one place and connect emerging screenwriters with industry professionals who can bring their ideas to screen.
Script Apart is a podcast about the first-draft secrets behind great movies. Each episode, the screenwriter behind a beloved film shares with us their initial screenplay for that movie. We then talk through what changed, what didn’t and why on its journey to the big screen. All proceeds go to Black Minds Matter UK, the NHS Charities Covid-19 Appeal and the Film and TV Charity.
Script Apart is hosted by Al Horner and produced by Kamil Dymek, with music from Stefan Bindley-Taylor. You can follow Script Apart on Twitter and Instagram. You can also email us on thescriptapartpodcast@gmail.com.

Support the show

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The Trial Of The Chicago 7 with Aaron Sorkin Mar 23, 2021

Show notes

Our guest this week is one of the most celebrated screenwriters in film and TV today. Aaron Sorkin is the storytelling titan behind The Social Network, Steve Jobs, The West Wing, Moneyball, A Few Good Men and Charlie Wilson’s War… the list goes on. Across a glittering three-decade career, his screenplays – full of snappy dialogue, rousing speeches and engrossing drama – have imagined an America in which principled heroes stand tall against Goliath-like institutions. His latest film, The Trial Of The Chicago 7, which Aaron also directed, is no different.
When a group of eight anti-war activists are charged with inciting a riot outside the 1968 Democratic Convention, the future of free speech seems to hinge on the ensuing court case. It’s a timely true-life tale that was this week nominated for six Oscars, including Best Picture and Best Original Screenplay.
Aaron took time out of pre-production on his next movie to tell me about how it took fourteen years and multiple rewrites to bring Chicago 7 to the screen. We also delve into the troubling Trump-era political developments that gave the story new urgency, his own process when it comes to writing first drafts, the importance of writing dialogue as though your characters are yelling at God, and what happened when he took a meeting about writing movies for Marvel.
Since we started this show, our DMs have been full with listener requests for incredible screenwriters they’d love to hear on the show. Aaron is as you might expect among the most requested so we’re delighted to bring you this episode, the latest in our awards season mini-series talking to writers behind this year’s Oscar and BAFTA contenders.
This is a spoiler-filled conversation so if you haven’t seen The Trial Of The Chicago 7, hit pause now, go check it out on Netflix and then come back as we delve into every detail of this great movie.
Support for this episode comes from Arc Studio – the beautifully-designed screenwriting programme whose intuitive interface and host of innovative features helps you get the most out of your writing time – and Coverfly, who curate the best screenwriting talent-discovery programs into one place and connect emerging screenwriters with industry professionals who can bring their ideas to screen.
Script Apart is a podcast about the first-draft secrets behind great movies. Each episode, the screenwriter behind a beloved film shares with us their initial screenplay for that movie. We then talk through what changed, what didn’t and why on its journey to the big screen. All proceeds go to Black Minds Matter UK, the NHS Charities Covid-19 Appeal and the Film and TV Charity.
Script Apart is hosted by Al Horner and produced by Kamil Dymek, with music from Stefan Bindley-Taylor. You can follow Script Apart on Twitter and Instagram. You can also email us on thescriptapartpodcast@gmail.com.

Support the show

Advertising Inquiries: https://redcircle.com/brands
Privacy & Opt-Out: https://redcircle.com/privacy

Wolfwalkers with Will Collins Mar 09, 2021

Show notes

Next up in our awards season mini-series is an insight into the creation of one of the most enchanting animations in recent memory. Wolfwalkers is the latest gorgeously-drawn and beautifully-told adventure from Irish studio Cartoon Saloon. It follows a young named Robyn, living in 17th century Kilkenny. One day while exploring forbidden woodland, she meets Mebh: a free-spirited girl by day with the ability to transform into a wolf. The pair join forces to search for Mebh’s missing mother, uncovering secrets along the way that park a tense standoff between the townsfolk, Robyn’s father, the sinister Lord Protector and Mebh’s tribe of wolves.
Inspired by Irish folklore, screenwriter Will Collins wrote the film based on a story by the film’s directors Tomm Moore and Ross Stewart. On the surface it’s a children’s fairytale, full of adorable animal sidekicks and flourishing forests where there’s adventure to be had and magic at every turn. Look deeper into this densely layered drama, however, and you’ll also find environmental worry, coming-of-age excitement, exploration of society’s fear of the “other” and empowering messages about choosing your own path in life.
Wolfwalkers almost was a very different movie. As Will reveals in this episode, the film’s creative team originally flirted with a much darker story, in which Mebh’s mother is discovered dead and Robyn is shot by her own father. We get into all of those abandoned plot threads in this episode, as well as the real-life historical darkness underpinning this magical tale.
As you may have already guessed, this is a spoiler-filled discussion, so we highly recommend watching Wolfwalkers before listening.
Support for this episode comes from Arc Studio – the beautifully-designed screenwriting programme whose intuitive interface and host of innovative features helps you get the most out of your writing time – and Coverfly, who curate the best screenwriting talent-discovery programs into one place and connect emerging screenwriters with industry professionals who can bring their ideas to screen.
Script Apart is a podcast about the first-draft secrets behind great movies. Each episode, the screenwriter behind a beloved film shares with us their initial screenplay for that movie. We then talk through what changed, what didn’t and why on its journey to the big screen. All proceeds go to Black Minds Matter UK, the NHS Charities Covid-19 Appeal and the Film and TV Charity.
Script Apart is hosted by Al Horner and produced by Kamil Dymek, with music from Stefan Bindley-Taylor. You can follow Script Apart on Twitter and Instagram. You can also email us on thescriptapartpodcast@gmail.com.

Support the show

Advertising Inquiries: https://redcircle.com/brands
Privacy & Opt-Out: https://redcircle.com/privacy

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