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Let’s Talk About Sects — True Crime
Let’s Talk About Sects

Let’s Talk About Sects is an award-winning monthly podcast focusing on a different cult each episode. Sarah takes a storytelling, deep dive approach, looking at the history of a sect’s leaders, the recruitment of members, their experiences, psychological aspects, and notable incidents during its existence.

You can support us on Patreon, with a one-off donation, or grab some merch. Sarah Steel’s debut book Do As I Say is available now.

“A fascinating and well-researched look into cults and the charismatic leaders behind them.” Peter Wells, The Sydney Morning Herald

“A fantastic examination of sects, cults, and religion… a fact-based program that’ll hook you in and keep you coming back for more.” Zach Johnston, Uproxx

“Cleverly named, meticulously researched.” Elena Nicolaou, Refinery29

“The best podcast of its kind – I can’t wait for another episode!” Apple Podcasts review from a US listener

“I study cults and sects and for this reason listen to many podcasts on these subjects. This one is by far the best.” Apple Podcasts review from a US listener

“Best podcast about cults I’ve found.” Apple Podcasts review from an Australian listener

Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Copyright: © Sarah Steel

Latest Episodes:

Interview Episode: Victorian Inquiry into Cults with Ryan & Catherine Carey May 20, 2025

Show notes

The Parliament of Victoria has launched an Inquiry into the recruitment methods and impacts of cults and organised fringe groups, which is open for submissions until 31 July 2025. If you or anyone you know has been involved with a cult that has a presence in Victoria, Australia, you're highly encouraged to make a submission. There’s also an anonymous questionnaire option available for those who might not wish to make a full submission.

Ryan and Catherine Carey are two former members of the Geelong Revival Centre who – along with a working group of other cult survivors – have been at the forefront in instigating this inquiry. They secured the support of Victoria’s Labor State Member for Geelong and Parliamentary Secretary for First Peoples Christine Couzens, and Victorian Attorney-General Sonya Kilkenny, who launched the Inquiry in April 2025. It's due to deliver its findings in September 2026.

Links:

Inquiry into the recruitment methods and impacts of cults and organised fringe groups — Parliament of Victoria, open for submissions until 31 July 2025 and due to deliver findings in September 2026
Secrets We Keep: Pray Harder podcast
Stop Religious Coercion Australia — websitem Facebook group, TikTok and Instagram
Victorian Cult Survivors Network — Facebook group

You can support us on Patreon. Sarah Steel's book Do As I Say is available on audiobook.

If you have been personally affected by involvement in a cult, or would like to support those who have been, you can find support with or donate to Cult Information and Family Support if you’re in Australia (via www.cifs.org.au), and you can find resources outside of Australia with the International Cultic Studies Association (via www.icsahome.com).

Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Falun Gong Apr 22, 2025

Show notes

Falun Gong is familiar to many as a spiritual exercise movement, and a sect that has been persecuted by the People’s Republic of China. In Sydney you'll often see practitioners demonstrating by Town Hall with flyers sharing stories of organ harvesting of wrongfully imprisoned members. But former devotees have come forward with stories of coercion and abuse, alleging that in one thing the CCP is correct: Falun Gong is a socially harmful cult.

Full research sources listed here.

Links:

“I am the only one propagating true Dharma”: Li Hongzhi’s Self-Presentation as Buddha and Greater — by James R. Lewis, ColomboArts Journal of Social Sciences and Humanities, Vol II, Issue 2, 2017
The life and times of Li Hongzhi: ‘Falun Gong’ and Religious Biography — by Benjamin Penny, The China Quarterly 175, 643–661, 2003
The power of Falun Gong — By Eric Campbell and Hagar Cohen, Foreign Correspondent-Background Briefing, ABC, 21 July 2020
Shen Yun: The Dark Side of a Dance Troupe — The Daily, New York Times Podcasts, 3 April 2025
Facebook bans ads from The Epoch Times after huge pro-Trump buy — by Brandy Zadrozny and Ben Collins, NBC News, 23 August 2019
This Pro-Trump YouTube Network Sprang Up Just After He Lost — by Craig Silverman, BuzzFeed News, 8 January 2021
A key source for Covid-skeptic movements, the Epoch Times yearns for a global audience — by Alessio Perrone & Darren Loucaides, coda, 10 March 2022
DoJ accuses far-right Epoch Times of being money-laundering operation — by Richard Luscombe, The Guardian, 4 June 2024
Behind the Pageantry of Shen Yun, Untreated Injuries and Emotional Abuse — by Nicole Hong & Michael Rothfeld, The New York Times, 15 August 2024
Stepping Into the Uncanny, Unsettling World of Shen Yun — by Jia Tolentino, The New Yorker, 19 March 2019
Their posters are everywhere, but behind Shen Yun lies a darker story — by Anthony Segaert, The Sydney Morning Herald, 25 February 2025
Consider supporting Decult in NZ

Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Children in Scientology with Mirriam Francis Apr 08, 2025

Show notes

In the wake of updates to Child Safety Standards emerging from Australia’s Royal Commission into Institutional Responses to Child Sexual Abuse, Mirriam Francis wrote to Victoria’s Commission for Children and Young People outlining the ways in which she sees Scientology teachings and practices to be violating these standards. While concepts of religious freedom and choice can muddy the waters of certain discussions around coercive organisations, Mirriam sees the regulations and laws to protect children as a key lens through which such practices need to be viewed and pursued. She speaks from personal experience that spans three countries.

Links:

Child Safe Standards — Commission for Children and Young People Victoria (you can raise a concern here); Queensland Family & Child Commission (you can raise a concern here)
Child Safe Scheme — NSW Office of the Children's Guardian (you can raise a concern here)
Australian Child Safe Standards – A State By State Guide 2024 — Safe Space Legal
Rage Against the Dark Arts — Mirriam Francis' Substack
Thetans in Young Bodies — Season 2, Episode 1 of Leah Remini's Scientology and the Aftermath in which Mirriam Francis features
Report of the Board of Enquiry into Scientology — by Kevin Victor Anderson, Q.C., the State of Victoria, Australia, 1965
The Body Keeps the Score: Brain, Mind, and Body in the Healing of Trauma — by Bessel van der Kolk, Penguin, 2015
Truth and Repair: How Trauma Survivors Envision Justice — by Judith Lewis Herman, Basic Books, 2023
Dianetics excerpt re: 7-year-old child responding to kiss from adult male
A Children of God message to members mentioning their "friends in Scientology"
Introduction to Scientology Ethics High Crimes

You can support us on Patreon. Sarah's book Do As I Say is available on audiobook.

Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

SGAs with Maria Esguerra Apr 01, 2025

Show notes

Maria Esguerra escaped the Children of God at the age of 22 with her two children who have disabilities. Maria’s firsthand experience drives her passion to support fellow survivors of cults and institutions, advocating for specialised understanding, interventions and access to governmental schemes such as Redress. Maria has actively engaged in media and advocacy efforts to raise awareness about the challenges faced by people escaping coercive environments. She founded a support group for second and multi-generational survivors (also referred to as SGAs or MGAs) from all cults. It addresses the devastating impacts from these groups, including abuse, denial of basic rights and forced labour. Maria is also a psychologist and the founder of Assessable.

Links:

Maria Esguerra — Linktree
Maria Esguerra — Director at Assessable
Decult profile — Maria's information at the recent Decult Conference
I lived under the so-called 'law of love' and it was terrifying – cult survivor — by Ryan Boswell, 1News, 17 October 2024
CIFS Australia — Cult Information & Family Support
The Olive Leaf Network
Escaping Utopia — by Janja Lalich & Karla McLaren, Routledge, 2017
The Strange Situation Experiment — more about Mary Ainsworth's work on attachment theory
Erikson's stages of psychosocial development — more about Erik Erikson's work
Make it Meaningful: How to find purpose in life and work — by Debbie Haski-Leventhal, Simon & Schuster, 2023
Walking Free from the Trauma of Coercive, Cultic and Spiritual Abuse: A Workbook for Recovery and Growth — by Gillie Jenkinson, Routledge, 2023
Stop Religious Coercion Australia — Advocacy group started by a former Geelong Revival Centre member
Writing to Reckon — Gerette Buglion's workshops, retreats, journal, and more

You can support us on Patreon. Sarah Steel's book Do As I Say is available on audiobook.

Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Interview Episode: An Everyday Cult with Gerette Buglion Mar 25, 2025

Show notes

Gerette Buglion holds a B.A. in Elementary Education and Special Education, and earned her ‘Master's Degree’ in cult awareness education from the school of life. She emerged from her 18-year cult odyssey in 2014 at age 52, and asked herself, "How did I, an educated, caring mother, wife, and business owner become that lost and for that long?" Gerette then set to work studying cultic dynamics, while reclaiming her autonomy with the help of a supportive family, therapy, and countless hours immersed in nature and writing.

Gerette's memoir An Everyday Cult was published in 2021, and followed by her second book, Writing to Reckon Journal – for Survivors of Spiritual, Religious, and Cultic Abuse. She is the founder of Living Cult Free, a nonprofit supporting the creative expression of survivor stories and empowering advocacy through education.

Links:

Gerette Buglion — Gerette's website
An Everyday Cult — by Gerette Buglion, 2021
Writing to Reckon Journal — by Gerette Buglion, 2023 (PDF version for US$5 here)
Writing to Reckon — Gerette's workshops, retreats, journal, and more
Living Cult Free — 501c3 nonprofit empowering and educating cult survivors and advocates
Living Cult Free: the podcast
Dr Dan Siegel — executive director of the Mindsight Institute and founding co-director of the Mindful Awareness Research Center at UCLA
Gentle Souls Revolution — Esther Friedman's website
Faith Jones — author of I Own Me and Sex Cult Nun
Beth Matanaer — Finding the Path Within You (or as Beth says, "You are your own expert")

You can support us on Patreon. Sarah Steel's debut book Do As I Say is available on audiobook now.

Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Interview Episode: The Community of Jesus Mar 18, 2025

Show notes

Ewan Whyte's feature essay, ‘The Cult That Raised Me’ – about the United States based Community of Jesus and Grenville Christian College – includes the introduction, “When I was 11, my parents sent me to Grenville Christian College, a prestigious Anglican boarding school in Brockville. It turned out to be a perverse fundamentalist cult that brainwashed, abused and terrorized students. For decades, the school tried to intimidate us into silence. It didn’t work.”

Ewan Whyte is a writer, art and cultural critic. He has written for the Globe & Mail and the Literary Review of Canada. He is the author of Desire Lines: Essays on Art Poetry & Culture, Shifting Paradigms: Essays on Art and Culture and Entrainment, a book of poetry, and a translation of the rude ancient Roman poet Catullus. His feature essay 'The Cult that Raised Me' was a finalist for a National Magazine Award. Ewan's upcoming book, Mothers of Invention: Essays on the Community of Jesus and Grenville Christian College, will be released in June and is available for preorder now. In advance of its release, Ewan shared some of his research and thoughts about these two organisations.

You can support us on Patreon. Sarah Steel's debut book Do As I Say is available on audiobook now.

Links:

Mothers of Invention: Essays on the Community of Jesus and Grenville Christian College — by Ewan Whyte, Wolsak & Wynn, 2025
The Cult That Raised Me — by Ewan Whyte, Toronto Life, 5 January 2021
I-Team: Former Members Of Cape Religious Group Allege Emotional Abuse, 'People Don't Realize The Mind Control' — WBZ News, 4 November 2021
Aaron Bushnell: Friends struggle to comprehend US airman's Gaza protest death — by Kayla Epstein & Angelica Casas, BBC News, 3 March 2024

Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

ISKCON / Hare Krishnas – Part 2 Feb 18, 2025

Show notes

When asked about the Hare Krishnas, most people will conjure images of dancing, chanting people with colourful robes and joyful dispositions. Members of the general public, whom Hare Krishnas refer to as 'karmis', may have encountered devotees through their vegetarian food offerings at music festivals or city restaurants. Their anti-LGBTQI+ and patriarchal beliefs, as well as the darker aspects of their history – including horrifying stories of abuse, and even murders – come as a surprise to many.

Full research sources listed here. You can support us on Patreon. Sarah Steel's debut book Do As I Say is available on audiobook now.

Links:

Srila Prabhupada’s arrival in the USA — by Ramai Swami, 27 September 2021
Authoritarian Culture and Child Abuse in ISKCON — by Nori J. Muster, Cultic Studies Review, 3(1), 2004
Children of ISKCON vs. ISKCON complaint — Plaintiffs’ original petition in the Dallas lawsuit, Surrealist.org, filed 25 October 2001
How I Once Was a Hare Krishna… — by Christopher Fici, Medium, 7 January 2023
Holy Cow, Swami — documentary by Jacob Young, 1996
History — ISKCON Child Protection Office, accessed January 2025
Child Abuse in the Hare Krishna Movement: 1971-1986 — by E. Burke Rochford, Jr. with Jennifer Heinlein, ISKCON Communications Journal, Vol. 6, #1, June 1998
Children of ISKCON vs. ISKCON Timeline — Surrealist.org (Nori Muster’s website), accessed January 2025
Tortured Souls — by Mark Donald, Dallas Observer, 6 December 2001
Dial Om for Murder — by John Hubner & Lindsey Gruson, Rolling Stone, Issue 497, 1987
Religion: Control Stressed at Krishna Children’s School — by Eleanor Blau, The New York Times, 25 November 1973
Why ISKCON Needs to be on Guard Against “Cultic Behavior” — by Anuttama Dasa, ISKCON News, 26 July 2024
The Krishna Cult — by Paul Ford, Mad After Krishna, 1994

Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

ISKCON / Hare Krishnas – Part 1 Feb 11, 2025

Show notes

When asked about the Hare Krishnas, most people will conjure images of dancing, chanting people with colourful robes and joyful dispositions. Members of the general public, whom Hare Krishnas refer to as 'karmis', may have encountered devotees through their vegetarian food offerings at music festivals or city restaurants. Their anti-LGBTQI+ and patriarchal beliefs, as well as the darker aspects of their history – including horrifying stories of abuse, and even murders – come as a surprise to many.

Full research sources listed here.

Links:

Srila Prabhupada’s arrival in the USA — by Ramai Swami, 27 September 2021
Authoritarian Culture and Child Abuse in ISKCON — by Nori J. Muster, Cultic Studies Review, 3(1), 2004
Children of ISKCON vs. ISKCON complaint — Plaintiffs’ original petition in the Dallas lawsuit, Surrealist.org, filed 25 October 2001
How I Once Was a Hare Krishna… — by Christopher Fici, Medium, 7 January 2023
Holy Cow, Swami — documentary by Jacob Young, 1996
History — ISKCON Child Protection Office, accessed January 2025
Child Abuse in the Hare Krishna Movement: 1971-1986 — by E. Burke Rochford, Jr. with Jennifer Heinlein, ISKCON Communications Journal, Vol. 6, #1, June 1998
Children of ISKCON vs. ISKCON Timeline — Surrealist.org (Nori Muster’s website), accessed January 2025
Tortured Souls — by Mark Donald, Dallas Observer, 6 December 2001
Dial Om for Murder — by John Hubner & Lindsey Gruson, Rolling Stone, Issue 497, 1987
Religion: Control Stressed at Krishna Children’s School — by Eleanor Blau, The New York Times, 25 November 1973
Why ISKCON Needs to be on Guard Against “Cultic Behavior” — by Anuttama Dasa, ISKCON News, 26 July 2024
The Krishna Cult — by Paul Ford, Mad After Krishna, 1994

Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Interview Episode: Two by Twos Update Feb 06, 2025

Show notes

Let’s Talk About Sects did a deep dive episode about the Two by Twos, also known as The Truth, in October 2020. In the years since we recorded, huge numbers of followers in the USA in particular have left as more and more allegations of child sexual abuse have been made against workers, and the FBI is currently investigating the organisation.

It was never Abbi and Mike Prussack's intention to become involved in advocacy work, but once the couple became aware of the extent of the abuse and how it was concealed, there didn’t seem to be an option other than putting the real truth out into the world and attempting to create some transparency where there was none before. Abbi and Mike have been releasing information that the Two by Twos have kept hidden for decades, and Abbi co-founded a not-for-profit called Voices for the Truth to help provide education and resources to victim-survivors of the organisation.

You can support us on Patreon. Sarah Steel's debut book Do As I Say is available on audiobook now.

Links:

Voices for the Truth — victim-survivor-led NFP co-founded by Abbi
Seeking Victim Information in 2x2 Investigation — FBI page with links to form to submit tips
Voices for the Truth RAINN Hotline: 928-756-8654 (US only)
Ex-2x2 Support Group on Facebook — this group membership is limited to ex-members or those who are in the process of leaving
Ex-2x2 Support Group on YouTube
2x2 Church Updates — current events page
Our 2x2 Story — Mike & Abbi's TikTok
Kyle Hanks' YouTube — channel discussing many aspects of 2x2 life
Timeline of events and publicly named perpetrators since the release of the Dean Bruer letter
Bridges and Balm — Survivor care organisation with funding available internationally to help with therapeutic care
Preserving the Truth — by Cherie Kropp-Ehrig, Clarion Call Publishing, 2022 (also on Amazon)
Telling the Truth — Cherie Kropp-Ehrig's informational website

With thanks to The Finance and Property Survival Guide, presenting partner of Let's Talk About Sects.

Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Interview Episode: Geelong Revival Centre with Richard Baker Jan 07, 2025

Show notes

Richard Baker's Pray Harder podcast for LiSTNR's Secrets We Keep series delves into the world of the Geelong Revival Centre, which Richard describes as “one of Australia’s most extreme” Pentecostal churches. The GRC has the same roots as the Revival Fellowship, and its pastor was a man named Noel Hollins who died in April 2024 after 65 years in leadership. Pray Harder shares some shocking stories of a number of former members, and it’s a vital listen.

You can support us on Patreon. Sarah Steel's debut book Do As I Say is available on audiobook now.

With thanks to The Finance and Property Survival Guide, presenting partner of Let's Talk About Sects.

Links:

Secrets We Keep: Pray Harder podcast
Stop Religious Coercion Australia — Facebook page
Southern Ocean Media — Richard Baker's production company

If you have been personally affected by involvement in a cult, or would like to support those who have been, you can find support with or donate to Cult Information and Family Support if you’re in Australia (via www.cifs.org.au), and you can find resources outside of Australia with the International Cultic Studies Association (via www.icsahome.com).

Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

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