New Podcast: The Trade War With Stan McCoy Feb 24, 2025

In the inaugural episode of the Information Technology and Innovation Foundation's Trade War Podcast, host Stan McCoy discusses recent developments and challenges in global trade policy with Ambassador Susan C. Schwab and Rob Atkinson. The conversation covers the latest U.S. tariffs on steel and aluminum, the implications of President Trump's protectionist stance, and the strategic importance of recognizing China as the main adversary.
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The United States Needs a Robust Industrial Policy, With Marc Fasteau and Ian Fletcher Dec 16, 2024

What is the correct economic strategy for a nation? Rob and Jackie sat down with Marc Fasteau and Ian Fletcher, authors of Industrial Policy for the United States, to discuss how industrial policy, done right, will develop the kind of economy the United States wants.

Mentioned

Marc Fasteau and Ian Fletcher, Industrial Policy for the United States, (Cambridge University Press, November 2024).
Ian Fletcher, Free Trade Doesn't Work: What Should Replace It and Why, (Coalition for a Prosperous America, February 2011).
“Are You a “Marketist” or a “Producerist” on Economic Policy?,” (ITIF, December 2024).

Leveraging Data to Improve Communities, With Rochelle Haynes Oct 07, 2024

Data-informed and evidence-based decision making can drive optimum outcomes in local governments. Rob and Jackie sat down with Rochelle Haynes, managing director of What Works Cities, to discuss how technology and innovation are being used in cities to equitably deliver services and solve problems.

Mentioned

David S. Evans, “Why Europe Must End Its 30-Year Digital Winter to Ensure Its Long-Run Future,” (SSRN, April 2024).
Robert D. Atkinson and David Moschella. Technology Fears and Scapegoats: 40 Myths about Privacy, Jobs, AI, and Today’s Innovation Economy, (Palgrave Macmillan, 2024).

General-Purpose Technologies and the Rise of Great Nations, With Jeffrey Ding Aug 05, 2024

It’s easy to get excited about new breakthroughs, but the real power lies in diffusing technological advances throughout the entire economy. Rob and Jackie sat down with Jeffrey Ding, Assistant Professor of Political Science at George Washington University, to discuss how technological revolutions influence competition and the implications for the United States and China.

Mentioned

Jeffrey Ding. Technology and the Rise of Great Powers: How Diffusion Shapes Economic Competition, (Princeton University Press, 2024).
Robert D. Atkinson. The Past and Future of America’s Economy: Long Waves of Innovation that Power Cycles of Growth, (Edward Elgar Publishing, 2005).
Victor Appleton. Tom Swift Sr. Series, (Stratemeyer Syndicate, published between 1910 and 1941).

Information Technology Is Increasingly Critical and Increasingly Demonized, With Daniel Castro Jul 01, 2024

Over the last several years, public opinion on technology and the use of data has shifted from excitement to skepticism to fear. Rob and Jackie sat down with Daniel Castro, Vice President of ITIF and Director of the Center for Data Innovation, to discuss the negative effect of techlash on human outcomes.

Robert D. Atkinson and David Moschella. Technology Fears and Scapegoats: 40 Myths about Privacy, Jobs, AI, and Today’s Innovation Economy, (Palgrave Macmillan, 2024).
Robert D. Atkinson, Doug Brake, Daniel Castro, Colin Cunliff, Joe Kennedy, Michael McLaughlin, Alan McQuinn, and Joshua New, “A Policymaker’s Guide to the “Techlash” —What It Is and Why It’s a Threat to Growth and Progress,” (ITIF, October 2019)

Remaining Realistic and Optimistic About the Promise of the Future, With Jim Pethokoukis Jun 10, 2024

The future will be much improved if society fights the fear of technology. Rob and Jackie sat down with Jim Pethokoukis, Senior Fellow and DeWitt Wallace Chair at the American Enterprise Institute, to discuss how the sci-fi fantasy of the future isn’t as far off as we think.

Mentioned

James Pethokoukis. The Conservative Futurist: How to Create the Sci-Fi World We Were Promised, (Center Street, 2023).
Robert D. Atkinson and David Moschella. Technology Fears and Scapegoats: 40 Myths about Privacy, Jobs, AI, and Today’s Innovation Economy, (Palgrave Macmillan, 2024).

Robert D. Atkinson, Doug Brake, Daniel Castro, Colin Cunliff, Joe Kennedy, Michael McLaughlin, Alan McQuinn, and Joshua New, “A Policymaker’s Guide to the “Techlash” —What It Is and Why It’s a Threat to Growth and Progress,” (ITIF, October 2019)
Hodan Omaar, “No, We Aren’t in an Oppenheimer Moment for AI,” (ITIF, July 2023)

Embracing Innovation is the Ultimate Key to Tackling Climate Change, With Robin Gaster May 13, 2024

Climate change is a global problem, with two polarized viewpoints making it difficult to find a solution. Rob and Jackie sat down with Robin Gaster, Director of Research at ITIF's Center for Clean Energy Innovation, to discuss how price/performance parity in green technologies can bridge the gap between left and right viewpoints on clean energy.

Mentioned

Robin Gaster, Robert D. Atkinson, and Ed Rightor, “Beyond Force: A Realist Pathway Through the Green Transition,” (ITIF, July 2023).

The past few years have seen a remarkable rise in the quality and quantity of deepfakes. Rob and Jackie discussed the rise of deepfakes with Ryan Long, Vice-Chairman of the California Lawyers Association, Licensing and Technology Transactions Group, Intellectual Property Section, and explored how to harness this technology responsibly while preventing abuse.

Mentioned

Henry A Kissinger, Eric Schmidt and Daniel Huttenlocher. The Age of AI: And Our Human Future, (Little, Brown and Company, 2021).
Megan Garber, “The Man Who Saved the World by Doing Absolutely Nothing,” (The Atlantic, September 2013).

The term ‘supply chain’ is relatively new, but the activities involved are not as new as we think. Rob and Jackie sat down with Yossi Sheffi, Director of the MIT Center for Transportation and Logistics, to discuss the complex history of supply chains and how technology and AI will continue to evolve supply chain processes in the future.

Mentioned

Yossi Sheffi. The Magic Conveyor Belt: Supply Chains, A.I., and the Future of Work, (MIT CTL Media, 2023).

Amidst the burgeoning advancements in autonomous vehicles (AVs), striking a balance between expectation and reality emerges as a challenge. Rob and Jackie sat down with Richard Mudge, president and founder of Compass Transportation and Technology, to discuss how innovations in the world of AVs can affect safety, productivity, and job creation.

Mentioned

Michigan.gov. “I-94 Connected & Automated Vehicle (CAV) Corridor Proposed Project,” Michigan Department of Transportation.

While quantum computing technology is maturing more slowly than other innovations, its potential is vast. Rob and Jackie sat down with Murray Thom, vice president of product management at D-Wave, to discuss quantum computing applications already being put into place, and possible advancements in the future.

Mentioned

Hodan Omaar. “The U.S. Approach to Quantum Policy,” (Center for Data Innovation, October 2023).
Congress.gov. "Text - H.R.6227 - 115th Congress (2017-2018): National Quantum Initiative Act," December 21, 2018.

Mentioned

Thomas H. Davenport and Nitin Mittal. All-in On AI: How Smart Companies Win Big with Artificial Intelligence, (Harvard Business Review Press, 2023).
“State of AI in the Enterprise, 5th edition report,” (Deloitte United States, 2022).

Mentioned

Robert D. Atkinson, “Comments to the Commerce Department Regarding Implementation of the Regional Technology and Innovation Hub Program,” (ITIF, March 2023).

There is a troubling chasm between trade policy and competition policy. Rob and Jackie sat down with Alden Abbott, senior research fellow at the Mercatus Center, and Shanker Singham, one of the world's leading international trade and competition economists, to discuss how to bridge the gap between barriers at the border and conditions of competition inside the border.

Mentioned

Shanker Singham and Alden F. Abbott. Trade, Competition and Domestic Regulatory Policy, (Taylor & Francis Group, 2023).
Stephen Ezell, “The Bayh-Dole Act’s Vital Importance to the U.S. Life-Sciences Innovation System,” (ITIF, March 2019).

How China Continues to Shirk Its Trade Obligations, With Dennis Shea Oct 23, 2023

China has had a dismissive attitude about its obligations as a member of World Trade Organization (WTO) ever since it joined the organization. Rob and Jackie sat down with Dennis Shea, executive director of the J. Ronald Terwilliger Center for Housing Policy, to discuss how China’s current non-market economic system is simply incompatible with WTO norms.

Mentioned

Dennis Shea. China’s Trade-Disruptive Economic Model and the Implications for the WTO. (U.S. Mission to International Organizations in Geneva, 2018).
2022 Report to Congress On China’s WTO Compliance. United States Trade Representative, February 2023.
Robert D. Atkinson. How China’s Mercantilist Policies Have Undermined Global Innovation in the Telecom Equipment Industry. (ITIF, 2020).
Stephen Ezell. False Promises II: The Continuing Gap Between China’s WTO Commitments and Its Practices. (ITIF, 2021).

Getting Export Controls Right, With Kevin Wolf Oct 02, 2023

Export controls exist at the perilous intersection of economic policy and national security. What could go wrong? Rob and Jackie sat down with Kevin Wolf, a partner at Akin Gump, to discuss how to strike the right balance between keeping certain advanced technologies away from adversarial militaries without locking U.S. firms out of global markets.

Policy regarding new technologies can be reactionary, confused, and focused on the wrong things. Rob and Jackie sat down with Patrick Grady, former policy analyst at ITIF’s Center for Data Innovation, to discuss what the European Union’s policymaking process can teach us about regulating emerging tech.
Mentioned:

Proposal for a Regulation of the European Parliament and of the Council Laying Down Harmonised Rules on Artificial Intelligence, (European Commission, April 2021).

Related"

Patrick Grady, “The AI Act Should Be Technology-Neutral” (Center for Data Innovation, February 2023).
Ashley Johnson, “Restoring US Leadership on Digital Policy” (ITIF, July 2023).

Counterfeiting is a Crime Against Innovation, With Kebharu Smith Aug 07, 2023

Counterfeiting—one of the oldest, simplest crimes—has only continued to evolve as technology has grown more complex. Rob and Jackie sat down with Kebharu Smith, director of Amazon's Counterfeit Crimes Unit and Associate General Counsel, to talk about how counterfeiting negatively impacts business, taxes, intellectual property, and innovation itself.

Mentioned

Becca Trate and Daniel Castro. Best Practices to Combat Online Sale of Counterfeits in the EU and US, (ITIF, July 2022).

Over the past 150 years, humanity has generated an unprecedented amount and variety of information, surpassing the cumulative knowledge of previous eras. Rob and Jackie sat down with Jim Cortada, a senior research fellow at the Charles Babbage Institute at the University of Minnesota Twin Cities to talk about how information shapes society.

Mentioned

Jim Cortada, Birth of Modern Facts: How the Information Revolution Transformed Academic Research, Governments, and Businesses, (Sandman Books, 2023).
Sarah Lamdan, Data Cartels: The Companies That Control and Monopolize Our Information, (Stanford University Press, 2022).

Looking ahead to the technological challenges and opportunities of the next decade, social trust will be more important than ever for the tech industry. Rob and Jackie sat down with David Moschella, a nonresident senior fellow at ITIF and the author of ITIF’s “Defending Digital” series, to discuss how a lack of societal trust harms the U.S. innovation system.

Mentioned

David Moschella, “Digital Innovation Isn’t Undermining Societal Trust; It’s the Other Way Around” (ITIF, February 2023).

Mentioned

George Sciadas. Number Savvy: From the Invention of Numbers to the Future of Data, (Taylor & Francis Group, 2022).
Kirk Goldsberry. Sprawlball: A Visual Tour of the New Era of the NBA. (Mariner Books, 2019)

Containing China While Rebuilding the United States, With Jonathan Ward Apr 03, 2023

America can’t just pick up speed to beat China economically; it needs to slow down China, because there’s no use in accelerating when your adversary is along for the ride. Rob and Jackie sat down with Jonathan Ward, author of China’s Vision of Victory, to discuss where things stand in innovation and technology, and how the U.S. can maintain its position as the world’s largest and most sophisticated economy.

Mentioned

Jonathan Ward.The Decisive Decade: American Grand Strategy for Triumph Over China, (Diversion Books, 2023).
Jonathan Ward.China’s Vision of Victory: A Guide to the Global Grand Strategy of the Chinese Government, (Atlas Organization, 2023).

To improve quality of life for as many people as possible, the places to start are cities. Rob and Jackie sat down with multiple award-winning technology and business leader Jonathan Reichental to discuss why the United States is falling behind other countries in the “smart city” movement and why it matters in a data-driven world.

Mentioned

Jonathan Reichental. Data Governance for Dummies.For Dummies, 2022.
Jonathan Reichental. Smart Cities for Dummies.For Dummies, 2022.
“New Urban Mechanics.” boston.gov, January 29, 2016.

Google doesn’t create terrorist propaganda videos, doesn’t allow them on YouTube, and takes them down as fast as it can when extremist groups post them anyway. But a question now before the Supreme Court is whether Section 230 of the Communications Decency Act protects Google and other platform operators from liability if their algorithms end up spreading harmful content. To parse the potential ramifications, Rob and Jackie sat down with Senior Policy Analyst Ashley Johnson, one of ITIF’s resident experts on Internet policy issues such as privacy, security, and platform regulation.

Mentioned

Robert D. Atkinson. “A Policymaker’s Guide to the ‘Techlash’—What It Is and Why It’s a Threat to Growth and Progress” (ITIF, October 2019).

Semiconductors are arguably the most important core technology in the modern world. You can’t fully understand the current state of politics, economics, or technology until you consider the role they play. Rob and Jackie sat down with economic historian Chris Miller to discuss the extent to which microchips are the new oil.

Mentioned

Miller, Chris. Chip War: The Fight for the World's Most Critical Technology. Simon & Schuster, 2022.
Remarks by National Security Advisor Jake Sullivan at the Special Competitive Studies Project Global Emerging Technologies Summit. The White House. The United States Government, September 16, 2022.

Teaching students to combine basic ideas to solve novel, difficult problems is imperative to lay a foundation for STEM pursuits. Rob and Jackie sat down with Richard Rusczyk, founder of the Art of Problem Solving Initiative, coauthor of the original Art of Problem Solving books, and cofounder of the Mandelbrot Problem Solving Competition.
Mentioned

AoPS and Beast Academy Math programs for Advanced Students. Art of Problem Solving. (n.d.). Retrieved December 9, 2022.
Robert D. Atkinson and Merrilea Mayo, “Refueling the U.S. Innovation Economy: Fresh Approaches to STEM Education” (ITIF, December 2010)

Growth and the Character of Society, With Benjamin Friedman Nov 28, 2022

Economics is about more than the economy. It also intersects public and private institutions, culture, religion, morality, and politics. Rob and Jackie explored these subjects with Benjamin Friedman, a professor of Political Economy at Harvard and author of The Moral Consequences of Economic Growth and Religion and the Rise of Capitalism.

Mentioned:

Benjamin Friedman, Religion and the Rise of Capitalism (Vintage: 2022).
Benjamin Friedman, The Moral Consequences of Economic Growth (Vintage: 2006).
Robert D. Atkinson, “The Abandonment of Growth and the Decline of the West,” The Independent Review, Vol. 2, no. 2, Fall 2022.
Benjamin Carter Hett, The Death of Democracy (Macmillan: 2018)

Seven Ways Nations Attain and Keep National Competitiveness, With Michael Mazaar Oct 24, 2022

Rob and Jackie sat down with Michael Mazarr, a senior political scientist at the RAND Corporation, to discuss his report identifying characteristics that are associated with competitive advantage. They touch on how the U.S. is currently lacking most if not all of them, and potential steps moving forward.
Mentioned:

Michael J. Mazaar, The Societal Foundations of National Competitiveness, Santa Monica, CA: RAND Corporation, 2022.
Michael J. Mazaar, The Sources of Societal Competitiveness: How Nations Actually Succeed in Long-Term Rivalries, Santa Monica, CA: RAND Corporation, 2022.
Robert D. Atkinson and Jackie Whisman, “Investing in American Dynamism, With Ben Horowitz and Katherine Boyle,” Innovation Files podcast, April 4, 2022.
Robert D. Atkinson and Michael Lind, “National Developmentalism: From Forgotten Tradition to New Consensus,” American Affairs, Volume III, Number 2 (Summer 2019).

How Henry Ford’s Populist Attitude Led Him to Share Tech With Enemies, With Stefan Link Oct 03, 2022

Midwestern populism caused a ripple effect that extended to open technology transfers and exchanges between Ford Motor Company and both Soviet and Nazi specialists. Rob and Jackie sat down with Stefan Link, Associate Professor of History at Dartmouth University, to discuss Henry Ford and his “open door policy” regarding methods and engineering.
Mentioned:

Stefan J. Link, Forging Global Fordism: Nazi Germany, Soviet Russia, and the Contest over the Industrial Order (Princeton: Princeton University Press, 2020).
Mario Daniels and John Krige, Knowledge Regulation and National Security in Postwar America (Chicago: The University of Chicago Press, 2022).

Three Historic Tech Booms Shaping Our Times, With Peter Leyden Sep 12, 2022

There are techniques for thoroughly thinking through how technologies will be adopted, what their implications will be, how they will spur growth, and how they will create new industries. Rob and Jackie sat down with futurist and tech expert Peter Leyden, who hosts Civilization Salons at The Long Now Foundation, to discuss how digital technologies are shaping the future for the economy, the work force, manufacturing, and more.

Mentioned:

Jason Feifer, “Wearing A Walkman Was Illegal,” Building For Change podcast (formerly Pessimists Archive), September 12, 2016.

Robert D. Atkinson, “The Task Ahead of Us: Transforming the Global Economy With Connectivity, Automation, and Intelligence” (ITIF, January 2019).

What Happens to the Economy When Patent Protections Are Weakened, With Jonathan Barnett Aug 15, 2022

Robust intellectual property rights provide the incentives necessary to drive innovation by allowing markets to form for tangible and intangible assets. Without them, incentives get distorted and innovation slows. Rob and Jackie sat down with Jonathan Barnett, director of the Media, Entertainment and Technology Law Program at USC’s Gould School of Law, to discuss the recent history, current political dynamics, and economic stakes associated with patent protections.

Mentioned:

Jonathan Barnett, “The Great Patent Grab” (August 20, 2021). In The Battle over Patents: History and Politics of Innovation (eds. Stephen H. Haber and Naomi R. Lamoreaux, Oxford University Press 2021), USC CLASS Research Paper No. CLASS21-48, USC Law Legal Studies Paper No. 21-48.
Robert D. Atkinson and Michael Lind, Big Is Beautiful: Debunking the Myth of Small Business (The MIT Press, 2019).
Stephen Ezell, “TRIPS Waiver on COVID-19 IP Rights Wouldn’t Help Vaccine Access; It Would Just Harm Innovation,” ITIF Innovation Files, March 19, 2021.
Stephen Ezell, “The Bayh-Dole Act’s Vital Importance to the U.S. Life-Sciences Innovation System” (ITIF, March 2019).

Life Sciences Innovation Through the Bayh-Dole Act, With Joe Allen Aug 01, 2022

Innovation in life sciences is crucial for many key industries in the United States and across the globe. It supports advances in human biotechnology, pharmaceuticals, health care policy, and beyond. Such advances would not always have been possible without the Bayh-Dole Act. Rob and Jackie sat down with Joe Allen, who served as a professional staffer on the U.S. Senate Judiciary Committee to former Senator Birch Bayh, to discuss the importance of the Bayh-Dole Act and the future of life sciences innovation.

Stephen Ezell, “The Bayh-Dole Act’s Vital Importance to the U.S. Life-Sciences Innovation System” (ITIF, March 2019).
“Preserving Bayh-Dole—the “Inspired” Law That Underpins U.S. Leadership in Life-Sciences Innovation” (ITIF Event, March 2019).
Stephen Ezell, “How Japan Squandered Its Biopharmaceutical Competitiveness: A Cautionary Tale” (ITIF, July 2022).

Securing US Leadership in Quantum Computing, With Edward Parker Jul 18, 2022

Quantum technologies, especially quantum computing, hold great promise in revolutionizing everyday systems. Quantum computing can be applied to health care, artificial intelligence, national security, and beyond. Rob and Jackie sat down with Edward Parker, a physical scientist at the RAND Corporation, to discuss the implications of quantum computing and how the United States can remain the global leader in this technology.
Mentioned:

Edward Parker, et al., “An Assessment of the U.S. and Chinese Industrial Bases in Quantum Technology” (RAND Corporation, February 2022).
Hodan Omaar, “Why the United States Needs to Support Near-Term Quantum Computing Applications” (Center for Data Innovation, April 2021).

Ashley Johnson, “NIST Takes First Big Step in Preparing for Post-Quantum Cryptography” (ITIF, July 2022).
“How Will Quantum Computing Shape the Future of AI?” (Center for Data Innovation Event, October 2020).
“ITIF Technology Explainer: What Is Quantum Computing?” (ITIF, September 2018).

The Future of Climate Tech Through the U.S. Electric System, With Peter Fox-Penner Jul 05, 2022

The world is facing a climate crisis. But venture-backed clean energy technologies can help avert the worst outcome. Rob and Jackie sat down with Peter Fox-Penner, senior fellow and founding director of Boston University’s Institute for Sustainable Energy and chief impact officer of Energy Impact Partners, to discuss the promise of climate-tech innovation in the U.S. electrical system and venture capital’s role in slowing climate change.

Hoyu Chong, “Mission Critical: The Global Energy Innovation System Is Not Thriving” (ITIF, January 2022).
“How 5G Can Spur Climate Tech Innovation” (ITIF Event, June 2022).
Linh Nguyen, “Refreshing the Global Agenda for Climate Innovation” (ITIF, May 2021).

The Economics of Data, With David Deming Jun 21, 2022

Data is one of the most essential and valuable assets in the world. It impacts everything from the ads we see and the products we buy to national security. Rob and Jackie sat down with David Deming, the Academic Dean and a Professor of Political Economy at the Harvard Kennedy School and the Director of the Malcolm Wiener Center for Social Policy at the Harvard Kennedy School, to discuss the importance of data, data sharing, and ways to protect individual data privacy.
Mentioned

David Deming, “Balancing Privacy With Data Sharing for the Public Good,” The New York Times, February 2021.
David Moschella, “The Power of Big Tech Peaked During the Pandemic; Disruptive Forces Are on the Rise” (ITIF, June 2022).
Gillian Diebold and Chelsea Han, “How AI Can Improve K-12 Education in the United States” (Center for Data Innovation, April 2022).

Ashley Johnson, “Three Bills Show Remaining Divisions in Attempt to Reach a Compromise on Federal Data Privacy Legislation” (ITIF, June 2022).
Daniel Castro, “Review of the Proposed “American Data Privacy and Protection Act: Part One and Part Two” (ITIF, June 2022).
David Moschella, “Your Data Isn’t Gold; It’s Not Even Yours” (ITIF, April 2022).

When the Chips Are Down: Why Domestic Semiconductor Production Matters, With John Zysman Jun 06, 2022

The United States used to be a leader in semiconductor production, but its share of global output dropped from 37 percent in 1990 to just 12 percent in 2019. That helps explain why the country now faces serious supply issues. Rob and Jackie sat down with John Zysman, a professor emeritus at UC Berkeley and co-founder/co-director of the Berkeley Roundtable on the International Economy, to discuss why U.S. semiconductor production is down, what it portends, and how America can regain its footing in the industry.

Mentioned:

Stephen S. Cohen and John Zysman, Manufacturing Matters: The Myth of the Post-Industrial Economy, (Basic Books, 1987).

Rob Atkinson, “Potato Chips, Computer Chips: Yes, There Is a Difference” (ITIF, December 2020).
Rob Atkinson, “Computer Chips vs. Potato Chips: The Case for a U.S. Strategic-Industry Policy” (ITIF, January 2022).
Stephen Ezell, “Incentives Essential to Ensuring America Possesses a Leading Semiconductor Industry” (ITIF, February 2022).

China’s Race to the Top: Authoritarianism in Technology and Global Affairs, With Keith Krach May 23, 2022

China is taking an authoritarian approach in its quest to be a dominant power in technology and global affairs. Silicon Valley innovator and former Under Secretary of State Keith Krach has a unique perspective on both aspects. Rob and Jackie sat down with him to discuss how China is impacting global market competition and what it means for U.S. competition policy.

Mentioned

Keith Krach, “Present your China contingency plan at the next board meeting,” Fortune Magazine, April 2022.

Robert D. Atkinson, “China’s ‘State Capitalism’ Is Not Capitalism” (ITIF, August 2021).
Robert D. Atkinson, “A Remarkable Resemblance: Germany From 1900 to 1945 and China Today,” International Economy, January 20, 2021.
Robert D. Atkinson, “Who Lost China?” (ITIF, July 2018).

Back to the Future: Historical Lessons of U.S. AI Policy, With Arthur Herman May 02, 2022

The United States has been a leader in artificial intelligence (AI) since the 1950s. But AI and other advanced industry leadership in the United States has been threatened by increased competition with China. Rob and Jackie sat down with Arthur Herman, a senior fellow and director of the Quantum Alliance Initiative at The Hudson Institute, to discuss how AI leadership in the United States has eroded and what policymakers can do to save it for the future.

Mentioned:

Arthur Herman, Freedom’s Forge: How American Business Produced Victory in World War II, (Random House Trade, November 2013).
Arthur Herman, The Viking Heart: How Scandinavians Conquered the World, (Mariner Books, 2021).

Rob Atkinson, “Don’t Fear AI” (European Investment Bank, June 2018).
Hodan Omaar, “Creating an AI Bill of Rights Is a Distraction,” Financial Times, October 2021.
Daniel Castro and Michal McLaughlin, “Who Is Winning the AI Race: China, the EU, or the United States? — 2021 Update” (ITIF, January 2021).

The Future of Buying Cars, With Daniel Crane Apr 18, 2022

One of the benefits of electric vehicles is they cost less to maintain. But that also means there’s less profit to be had in servicing their warranties, which gives car dealers less incentive to sell them. That’s why EV makers like Tesla and Rivian depend on direct-to-consumer sales and distribution. Unfortunately, there are decades-old dealer-distribution laws standing in the way. Rob and Jackie sat down with Daniel Crane, the Frederick Paul Firth Senior Professor of Law at University of Michigan, to discuss how these laws harm consumers and undermine technological innovation.

David Hart, “Why a Measured Transition to Electric Vehicles Would Benefit the U.S.” (ITIF, November 2019).
Dorothy Robyn, “Driving Change: A Front-Loaded, Aggressive Strategy for Federal Procurement of Electric Vehicles” (ITIF, December 2020).
David Hart, “Time for a Serious U.S. Electric Vehicle Manufacturing Strategy” (ITIF, November 2020).

Investing in American Dynamism, With Ben Horowitz and Katherine Boyle Apr 04, 2022

Venture capitalists know what it feels like when a company is firing on all cylinders. But it’s been a while since the whole country had that feeling of dynamism—so why not focus on companies that help the cause by supporting the national interest, solving critical problems, and doing fundamentally new things? Rob and Jackie sat down with Ben Horowitz and Katherine Boyle of the leading VC firm Andreessen Horowitz to talk about investing in American dynamism.

Mentioned

Ben Horowitz, The Hard Things About Hard Things (Harper Business, 2014).
Ben Horowitz, What You Do Is Who You Are: How to Create Your Business Culture (Harper Business, 2019).
Rob Atkinson, The Past and Future of America’s Economy: Long Waves of Innovation that Drive Cycles of Growth (Edward Elgar Publishing, 2005).

“Doing Capitalism in the Innovation Economy,” ITIF event, January 2014.
Luke Dascoli, “AI Start-Ups Attracted Over 21 Percent of The World’s Venture Capital in 2020” (ITIF, January 2022).
John Wu, “A Small Business Innovation Research Grant Doubles an Energy-Technology Company's Chances of Later Receiving Venture Capital” (ITIF, May 2017).

The Promise of 5G, With Susie Armstrong Mar 21, 2022

Technology is rapidly developing across many sectors—and that is especially true with wireless technologies. 5G phones give consumers better, stronger, faster service and more capacity to download. But 5G goes beyond phones, it provides great innovative capacity for businesses. Rob and Jackie sat down with Susie Armstrong, senior vice president for engineering at QUALCOMM, to discuss what makes 5G unique and how it impacts smart factories, healthcare, and more.

Doug Brake, “ITIF Technology Explainer: What Is 5G?“ (ITIF, September 2018).
“A National Strategy for 5G, With Doug Brake,“ ITIF Innovation Files podcast, July 2020.
Doug Brake, “A U.S. National Strategy for 5G and Future Wireless Innovation” (ITIF, April 2020).

The Future of US-EU Trade, With Denis Redonnet Mar 07, 2022

Trade tensions between the United States and the EU have increased over the past few years. Decreasing those transatlantic tensions while promoting fair competition will be especially important with the challenge of a rising China. That is a key goal of the new U.S.-EU Trade and Technology Council (TTC). Rob and Jackie sat down with Denis Redonnet, the EU’s chief trade enforcement officer, to discuss the opportunities and challenges for the TTC and the broader implications for trade policies in the United States, the EU, and in the World Trade Organization.

Mentioned:

Rob Atkinson, “Advancing U.S. Goals in the U.S.-EU Trade and Technology Council” (ITIF, September 2021).

Nigel Cory, “How the EU-U.S. Trade and Technology Council Can Navigate Conflict and Find Meaningful Cooperation on Data Governance and Technology Platforms” (ITIF, December 2021).
Nigel Cory and Wendy Cutter, “Time for an Upgrade: Moving WTO Negotiations Into the Digital World” (ITIF, May 2020).
“China vs. The WTO: Two Decades of Dissembling and Dysfunction,” ITIF Event, December 2021.

The Challenges China Presents to U.S. Technological Capabilities, With Matt Turpin Feb 21, 2022

China’s rapid technological development has put tremendous pressure on the United States to remain competitive in strategically important industries. Rob and Jackie sat down with Matt Turpin to discuss what the United States has done so far to face the China challenge and what future policies should look like. Turpin is a visiting fellow at the Hoover Institution and has served as the National Security Council’s director for China and as the senior advisor on China to the Secretary of Commerce.

Mentioned:

James Fallows, “China’s Great Leap Backward,” The Atlantic, December 2016.
Rob Atkinson, “Weaving Strategic-Industry Competitiveness Into the Fabric of U.S. Economic Policy” (ITIF, February 2022).

David Moschella and Rob Atkinson, “Competing With China: A Strategic Framework” (ITIF, August 2020).
Rob Atkinson, “The Case for Legislation to Out-Compete China” (ITIF, March 2021).
“How China’s Role in Technology Development Affects the United States and the World, With Sam Olsen,” ITIF Innovation Files podcast, February 2022.

How China’s Role in Technology Development Affects the United States and the World, With Sam Olsen Feb 07, 2022

China views technology and the tech companies that produce it as strategic assets to be leveraged in a global race for geopolitical advantage. That’s why it doesn’t treat its domestic champions as players in a free market—the point is to make sure they win at the expense of Western competitors. Rob and Jackie sat down with entrepreneur and strategist Sam Olsen, author of What China Wants, to discuss the implications of China’s technological development.

Mentioned:

Sam Olsen, What China Wants, (Substack, 2022).
Stefan Link, Forging Global Fordism: Nazi Germany, Soviet Russia, and the Contest over the Industrial Order, (Princeton University Press, 2020).

Rob Atkinson, “China’s ‘State Capitalism’ Is Not Capitalism” (ITIF, August 2021).
Rob Atkinson, “The Case for Legislation to Out-Compete China” (ITIF, March 2021).
Rob Atkinson, “The U.S. Needs to Copy China’s Tech Strategy to Remain the Top Economy in the World” (ITIF, November 2019).

How China Influences U.S. Innovation and Technological Capabilities, With Barry Naughton Jan 24, 2022

Concerns about China’s rapid rise in recent decades have affected U.S. policies on technology, innovation, and industrial competitiveness. Rob and Jackie discussed the history of Chinese industrial policy and its implications for America and its allies with Barry Naughton, the So Kwanlok Chair of Chinese International Affairs at UC San Diego and author of The Rise of China’s Industrial Policy, 1978 to 2020.

Mentioned:

Barry Naughton, The Rise of China’s Industrial Policy, 1978 to 2020, (Academic Network of Latin America and the Caribbean on China, March 2021).
Nigel Cory, “Heading Off Track: The Impact of China’s Mercantilist Policies on Global High-Speed Rail Innovation,” (ITIF, April 2021).

Rob Atkinson, “Time for a Coherent U.S. Strategy to Address Chinese Innovation Mercantilism” (ITIF, March 2020).
Rob Atkinson, “What Is Chinese “Innovation Mercantilism” and How Should the UK and Allies Respond?” (ITIF, June 2021).
“Chinese Innovation Mercantilism: An Essential Reading List of ITIF Policy Analysis and Commentary” (ITIF, June 2020-2021).

How APIs Are Transforming the Internet, With Rob Dickinson Jan 03, 2022

Application programming interfaces (APIs) are among the most important technologies for Internet the today, enabling software-based systems to automate tasks and redraw the lines between organizations, suppliers, customers, and partners in ways not seen since the birth of the web. Rob and Jackie sat down with Rob Dickinson, co-founder and CEO of Resurface Labs, to discuss the future of APIs and the implications for public policy.
Mentioned

Ashley Johnson and Daniel Castro, “Improving Accessibility of Federal Government Websites,” (ITIF, June 2021).

Daniel Castro and Michael Steinberg, “Blocked: Why Some Companies Restrict Data Access to Reduce Competition and How Open APIs Can Help” (ITIF, November 2017).
Daniel Castro, “Improving Consumer Welfare With Data Portability” (ITIF, November 2021).
“Accelerating the Digital Transformation of Healthcare, With Pat Combes” (ITIF Podcast, June 2020).

The Keys to Diversifying Computer Science Education, With Dr. Juan Gilbert Dec 13, 2021

STEM-related fields are booming in the United States, but they often lack diversity. If the United States wants to remain a leader in these fields, policymakers must take steps to adequately fund state institutions to ensure that all students receive access to STEM programs. Rob and Jackie sat down with Dr. Juan Gilbert, chair of the University of Florida’s Computer & Information Science & Engineering Department, to discuss how the United States has fallen behind in recruiting students in science, technology, engineering, and math and what policymakers, universities, and industries can do diversify their candidate pools.
Related:

Kevin Gawora, “United States Needs to Expand Domestic STEM Doctorates” (ITIF, December 2020).
Stephen Ezell, “Assessing the State of Digital Skills in the U.S. Economy” (ITIF, November 2021).
“Innovation Fact of the Week: Students Are More Likely to Pursue STEM Degrees in College If They Are Exposed to More Science Subjects During High School” (ITIF, August 2016).

The Ghosts of Supply Chains Past, Present, and Future, With Chris Caine Nov 29, 2021

Global supply chains are cracking up. Even before the pandemic, a confluence of economic and geopolitical factors were accelerating the trend—from rising wages in China to nationalist sentiments sweeping the West, to the beginnings of a U.S.-China decoupling. Rob and Jackie sat down with Chris Caine, president of the Center for Global Enterprise, to break down the reasons for the massive disruption, discuss how different industry sectors are making different strategic calculations, and consider what the future might hold.

“Global Supply Chains Under Pressure, With Willy Shih,” ITIF Innovation Files podcast, May 2020.
Stephen Ezell, “Digital Trade Growth, Rule-Making, and Supply Chain Resiliency: U.S. and Global Perspectives” (ITIF, October 2021).
“Biden Officials Discuss White House Supply Chain Report,” ITIF event, June 2021.

R&D Costs, Rx Prices, and the Formula for Success in Life Sciences Innovation, With Stephen Ezell Nov 15, 2021

The United States is the leader in life sciences innovation, but that has not always been the case. As global competition intensifies, it needs to continue spurring investment in R&D to stay on top. Rob and Jackie sat down with Stephen Ezell, vice president of global innovation policy at ITIF, to discuss the history of U.S. life sciences innovation and break down R&D costs versus the market prices of innovative biopharmaceuticals.
Mentioned

Anusuya Chatterjee and Ross C. DeVol, “Estimating Long-Term Economic Returns of NIH Funding on Output in the Biosciences” (Milken Institute, 2012), 4.

Rob Atkinson and Stephen Ezell, “Five Fatal Flaws in Rep. Katie Porter’s Indictment of the U.S. Drug Industry” (ITIF, May 2021).
Joe Kennedy, “The Link Between Drug Prices and Research on the Next Generation of Cures” (ITIF, September 2019).
Event, “How Intellectual Property Has Played a Pivotal Role in the Global COVID-19 Response,” (ITIF, April 2021).

How Giants Rise and Fade in Silicon Valley, With Avram Miller Nov 01, 2021

Silicon Valley obviously has a rich history of technological innovations that have transformed technology and the world as we know it. But with increased competition and stringent policies coming from Washington, its landscape has shifted. Rob and Jackie sat down with Avram Miller, co-founder of Intel Capital and author of The Flight of a Wild Duck to discuss how the decisions made by Intel and other tech giants have impacted Silicon Valley and how policymakers can better support the IT industry.
Mentioned

Avram Miller, The Flight of a Wild Duck, (BOOKBABY, 2021).

Andrew S. Grove, Only the Paranoid Survive: How to Exploit the Crisis Points, (Currency Doubleday, 1996).

Mark Zachary Taylor, The Politics of Innovation: Why Some Countries Are Better Than Others at Science and Technology, (Oxford University Press, 2016).
Related

Rob Atkinson and Jackie Whisman, “The Real History of Silicon Valley and the Lessons It Holds for Innovation Policy Today, With Margaret O’Mara” (ITIF, 2020).

Rob Atkinson and Jackie Whisman, “The Rise, Fall, and Reinvention of IBM, With Jim Cortada” (ITIF, 2021).

Rob Atkinson, “Be Grateful for ‘Big Tech’,” RealClearPolicy, June 6, 2018.

The Evolution of Robotics and Prospects for Maximizing Adoption, With Rian Whitton Oct 18, 2021

The first industrial robots appeared in the early 1960s and were initially optimized for production lines. These days, innovation in robotics is progressing rapidly as sophisticated localization and mapping enables improved robotic mobility, and as new levels of flexible manipulation allow robots to perform more specialized tasks. Rob and Jackie sat down recently with Rian Whitton, a strategic technologies analyst at ABI Research, to discuss the evolution of robotics and the prospects for accelerating productivity gains.

Robert D. Atkinson, “In Defense of Robots,” National Review, April 2017.
Robert D. Atkinson, “Robotics and the Future of Production and Work” (ITIF, October 2019).
Robert D. Atkinson, “The Case Against Taxing Robots” (ITIF, April 2019).

Why There Is a Disconnect Between the Economics of Innovation and U.S. Antitrust Policy, With David Teece Oct 04, 2021

Antitrust policy should favor dynamic, innovation-driven competition, yet antitrust regulators generally don’t see it that way. Why is that? Rob and Jackie sat down recently with David Teece, the Thomas W. Tusher Professor in Global Business at UC Berkeley’s Haas School of Business, to discuss the intersection of innovation and economics in antitrust policy.

Mentioned

David J. Teece, Dynamic Capabilities and Strategic Management: Organizing for Innovation and Growth (Oxford: Oxford University Press, 2009).
Rob D. Atkinson, Michael Lind, Big Is Beautiful: Debunking the Myth of Small Business, (MA: MIT Press, 2018).

Event, “Schumpeter v. Brandeis v. Chicago: The Antitrust Debate of Our Times” (ITIF, 2021).
Rob Atkinson, “The Emergence of Anticorporate Progressivism” (American Compass, 2021).
Rob Atkinson, “Antitrust Can Hurt U.S. Competitiveness” (The Wall Street Journal, 2021).

AI and Defense Innovation, With Lt. Gen. Jack Shanahan Sep 20, 2021

For the military, capabilities in the field matter most, not R&D. So, when it comes to artificial intelligence, the Defense Department has been moving quickly by standing up a special team, like a startup enterprise. Its first pilot project, “Project Maven,” began as an intelligence application. Now the push is on to apply it in other areas. Rob and Jackie sat down with retired Lt. Gen. Jack Shanahan, the first director of the Defense Department’s Joint Artificial Intelligence Center (JAIC), to discuss how AI is being used in the defense world and the implications for the broader AI ecosystem.

Mentioned

Daniel Castro, Michael McLaughlin, “Who Is Winning the AI Race: China, the EU, or the United States? — 2021 Update” (Center for Data Innovation, 2021).
Rob Atkinson, Jackie Whisman, “Podcast: Innovating in the Defense Sector to Remain Competitive With China, Featuring Michael Brown” (ITIF, 2021).

Event, “How to Deepen Transatlantic Cooperation in AI for Defense” (CDI, 2021).
Rob Atkinson, “Emerging Defense Technologies Need Funding to Cross ‘The Valley of Death’” (RealClear Defense, 2020).
ITIF, “ITIF Technology Explainer: What Is Artificial Intelligence?” (ITIF, 2018).

Inside U.S. Industrial Policy and Operation Warp Speed, With David Adler Sep 07, 2021

Industrial policy can produce great technological innovations to address major challenges for society. A perfect example is Operation Warp Speed, which has saved millions of lives during the COVID-19 pandemic. Rob and Jackie sat down with David Adler, an adviser on industrial strategy at the Common Good Foundation in the United Kingdom and author of “Inside Operation Warp Speed: A New Model for Industrial Policy,” published in the summer issue of the American Affairs Journal, to discuss lessons we can draw from the success of Operation Warp Speed to strengthen U.S. industrial policy in the future.

Mentioned

David Adler, “Inside Operation Warp Speed: A New Model for Industrial Policy,” American Affairs Journal 5, no. 2 (2021).
Richard Lipsey, Kenneth I. Carlaw, Clifford T. Bekar, Economic Transformations: General Purpose Technologies and Long-Term Economic Growth(Oxford University Press, 2005).
Erica Fuchs, “Cloning DARPA Successfully,” Issues in Science and Technology 26, no. 1 (2009).
William B. Bonvillian, The DARPA Model for Transformative Technologies - Perspectives on the U.S. Defense Advanced Research Projects Agency(Cambridge: Open Book Publishers, 2020).

Stephen Ezell, “Moore’s Law Under Attack: The Impact of China’s Policies on Global Semiconductor Innovation“ (ITIF, 2021).
Robert D. Atkinson, “No Adopting an Industrial Policy Doesn’t Mean We’re Emulating China“ American Compass, 2021.
Stephen Ezell, “TRIPS Waiver on COVID-19 IP Rights Wouldn’t Help Vaccine Access; It Would Just Harm Innovation“ (ITIF, 2021).

Addressing Climate Change Through Innovation, With David Hart Aug 23, 2021

Addressing climate change requires accelerating clean energy innovation across the full range of economic sectors—from transportation to electricity, manufacturing, and agriculture. Rob and Jackie sat down with David Hart, a professor of public policy at George Mason University’s Schar School of Policy and Government and director of ITIF’s Center for Clean Energy Innovation, to discuss the scope of the challenge and the best paths forward for policymakers.
Mentioned:

United Nations Framework Convention on Climate Change, “Paris Agreement” (UNFCCC, November 2016).
Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change, “AR6 Climate Change 2021: The Physical Science Basis” (IPCC, August 2021).

Peter Fox-Penner, et al., “Clean and Competitive: Opportunities for U.S. Manufacturing Leadership in the Global-Low Carbon Economy” (ITIF, June 2021).
Robert D. Atkinson, “Growth Through Innovation Will Help Fight Climate Change” (ITIF, August 2021).
Linh Nguyen, “Refreshing the Global Agenda for Climate Innovation” (ITIF, 2021).

Demystifying Industrial Automation, With Dave Vasko Aug 09, 2021

From bottle manufacturing to machine repair, automation has made just about every industry more efficient and adaptive to consumer demands. But despite its omnipresence, policymakers have failed to fully understand what drives industrial automation and why it matters for the economy. Rob sat down with Dave Vasko, director of advanced technology at Rockwell Automation, to discuss the latest trends in industrial automation—including innovations powered by artificial intelligence and virtual reality—and to consider how policymakers can spur manufacturing productivity and ensure the United States is globally competitive.
Mentioned:

Robert D. Atkinson and Daron Acemoglu debate: “Is the United States Tax System Favoring Excessive Automation?” (ITIF event, November 2020).
Robert D. Atkinson, “Federal Statistical Needs for a National Advanced Industry and Technology Strategy” (ITIF, July 2021).
Stephen J. Ezell, “Why Manufacturing Digitalization Matters and How Countries Are Supporting It” (ITIF, April 2018).
Lawrence Summers and Alan Auerbach, “The Investment Tax Credit: An Evaluation” (National Bureau of Economic Research, November 1979).

Robert D. Atkinson, “10 Types of Work to Automate or Move Online for a COVID-19 World” (ITIF, July 2020).
Robert D. Atkinson, “The Enterprise Automation Imperative—Why Modern Societies Will Need All the Productivity They Can Get” (ITIF, November 2019).
Robert D. Atkinson, “How MIT’s ‘Work of the Future’ Project Gets It Wrong: Raising Taxes on Machinery and Software Would Kill Jobs and Hamper Wage Growth” (ITIF, 2020).

Chinese Antitrust Exceptionalism, With Dr. Angela Zhang Jul 26, 2021

Antitrust policy provides a perfect lens to see the systematic differences between China and Western liberal democracies, according to Dr. Angela Zhang, director of the Center for Chinese Law at the University of Hong Kong. In her book Chinese Antitrust Exceptionalism: How the Rise of China Challenges Global Regulation, Zhang argues China leverages antitrust law to achieve industrial policy objectives—including in the tech sectors that are crucial to its rivalry with the United States—but it does so through an insular bureaucracy that is surprisingly fragmented and therefore difficult for outsiders to understand. Rob and Jackie sat down with Dr. Zhang to discuss the internal power dynamics that shape China’s regulatory environment and how it affects the competitive balance of power in the global economy.

Mentioned:

Angela Huyue Zhang, Chinese Antitrust Exceptionalism: How the Rise of China Challenges Global Regulation(Oxford University Press, 2021).
Robert D. Atkinson and Michael Lind, Big Is Beautiful: Debunking the Myth of Small Business (The MIT Press, 2018).

Robert D. Atkinson and Michael Lind, Who Wins After U.S. Antitrust Regulators Attack? China. (ITIF, 2018).
Robert D. Atkinson and David Moschella, Competing With China: A Strategic Framework (ITIF, 2020).

A Doorman for the Masses—Debunking Attacks on Facial Recognition, With Daniel Castro Jul 12, 2021

Facial recognition technology has faced widespread allegations of discrimination in recent years, leading some cities to restrict its use—but exactly how valid are these claims? Rob and Jackie sit down with ITIF’s vice president and director of the Center for Data Innovation, Daniel Castro, to discuss why many of the claims are misleading, and how facial recognition can make public and private services more accessible, efficient, and useful.

Mentioned:

Joy Buolamwini and Timnit Gebru, Gender Shades: Intersectional Accuracy Disparities in Commercial Gender Classification (FAT, 2018).
Jacob Snow, Amazon’s Face Recognition Falsely Matched 28 Members of Congress With Mugshots (ACLU, 2018).
NIST, NIST Study Evaluates Effects of Race, Age, Sex on Face Recognition Software(NIST, 2019).

Daniel Castro,Note to Press: Facial Analysis Is Not Facial Recognition(ITIF, 2019).
Daniel Castro and Michael McLaughlin, Banning Police Use of Facial Recognition Would Undercut Public Safety(ITIF, 2019).
Daniel Castro and Michael McLaughlin, The Critics Were Wrong: NIST Data Shows the Best Facial Recognition Algorithms Are Neither Racist Nor Sexist(ITIF, 2020).
Information Technology and Innovation Foundation, ITIF Technology Explainer: What Is Facial Recognition?(ITIF, 2020).

The Political Economy of Big Retail, Then and Now: The Story of the Great Atlantic & Pacific Tea Company, With Marc Levinson Jun 28, 2021

Long before Walmart and Amazon, there was A&P—The Great Atlantic & Pacific Tea Company—which started as a mail-order tea business in the Civil War era before displacing Sears, Roebuck & Co. in the 1920s to become the world’s largest retailer. Its pioneering innovations made the mom-and-pop grocery business more efficient and less expensive, and in so doing it pitted consumer and civil rights advocates against small-business groups. Rob and Jackie sat down with historian and economist Marc Levinson, author of The Great A&P and the Struggle for Small Business in America, to discuss the life and times of the company and how the debates around its growth resemble the antitrust debates we are having again today.

Mentioned:

Marc Levinson, The Box: How the Shipping Container Made the World Smaller and the World Economy Bigger (Princeton University Press, 2008).
Marc Levinson, Outside the Box: How Globalization Changed from Moving Stuff to Spreading Ideas (Princeton University Press, 2020).
Marc Levinson, The Great A&P and the Struggle for Small Business in America (Marc Levinson, 2019).
Robert D. Atkinson and Michael Lind, Big Is Beautiful: Debunking the Myth of Small Business (The MIT Press, 2018).

The Rise, Fall, and Reinvention of IBM, With Jim Cortada Jun 14, 2021

IBM shaped the way the world did business for decades, driving the government’s technological innovation, competing to build the first PCs, and adapting to service economy. Few people know IBM’s fascinating history as well as Jim Cortada, a senior research fellow at the University of Minnesota and the author of IBM: The Rise and Fall and Reinvention of a Global Icon. He spent 38 years at IBM in sales, consulting, managerial, and research roles. Rob and Jackie sit down with Jim to discuss how IBM’s strategies led to its biggest successes and failures, and how these decisions shed light on global history.

Mentioned:

James W. Cortada, IBM: The Rise and Fall and Reinvention of a Global Icon(The MIT Press, 2019).
James W. Cortada, The Digital Hand: How Computers Changed the Work of American Manufacturing, Transportation, and Retail Industries (Oxford University Press, 2003).
Alfred D. Chandler Jr., The Visible Hand: The Managerial Revolution in American Business (Belknap Press, 1993).
Robert D. Atkinson, “Who Lost Lucent?: The Decline of America’s Telecom Equipment Industry,” American Affairs Journal, 2020.
Aurelien Portuese, “The Digital Markets Act: European Precautionary Antitrust“ (ITIF, 2021).

Dynamic Antitrust Policy in the Digital Era, With Aurelien Portuese Jun 01, 2021

When it comes to the innovation economy, there is no hotter issue these days than antitrust. Technology companies, in particular, are on the firing line as an increasingly vocal populist movement seeks to refashion late 19th century antitrust laws to guard against monopoly power and slow down disruptive innovation in the digital era. In these conditions, there is a risk that the so-called “precautionary principle” will take hold at the expense of economic dynamism. Rob and Jackie parse the debate and weigh the best options for policymakers with Aurelien Portuese, ITIF’s director of antitrust and innovation policy.

Mentioned:

Aurelien Portuese, Antitrust Populism: Competition Policy in the Digital Era (Oxford University Press, forthcoming).
Robert D. Atkinson, “Freedom, Fairness or Flourishing: America’s Fundamental Economic Policy Choice,” American Compass, April 1, 2021.

“Dynamic Antitrust With Aurelien Portuese: Discussions on the Future of Competition and Innovation,” ITIF webinar series, March 12, 2021.
Aurelien Portuese, “Precautionary Antitrust: A Precautionary Tale in European Competition Policy,” in Law and Economics of Regulation, edited by Mathis, et al. (Springer International Publishing, 2021), DOI: 10.1007/978-3-030-70530-5.
“Schumpeter v. Brandeis v. Chicago: The Antitrust Debate of Our Times,” ITIF webinar, June 15, 2021.
About ITIF’s Schumpeter Project: Competition Policy for the Innovation Economy

How Public Financing Advances Innovation, With Richard Lipsey May 17, 2021

Throughout modern history, public financing has made possible some of the most important and impactful innovations society has enjoyed—from refrigeration to the Internet—and the spillover benefits have been incalculable. But what are the optimal ways for the public sector to intervene in the innovation process to maximize those benefits and solve big problems? Rob and Jackie explore these questions and the implications for science and industrial policy with Dr. Richard Lipsey, emeritus professor of economics at Simon Fraser University.

Mentioned:

Richard G. Lipsey and Kenneth I. Carlaw, “Industrial Policies: Common Not Rare,” Discussion Papers dp20-11, 2020, Department of Economics, Simon Fraser University.

Norway’s Innovation Ecosystem and the Pivot to Renewable Energy, With Hege Barnes May 03, 2021

When it comes to national innovation ecosystems, Norway has been a standout performer. After discovering oil, it vaulted from being one of Europe’s poorest countries in the 1950s to become a high-wage, high-cost nation with strengths in B2B products, heavy industry, shipping, and shipbuilding. Now it is pivoting toward renewable energy—including offshore wind and electric vehicle technologies—while broadening and deepening its national innovation ecosystem to encourage new firms in a range of industries to scale up and compete globally. Rob and Jackie discuss the secrets of Norway’s success with Hege Barnes, regional director for the Americas at Innovation Norway.

Mentioned:

World Commission on Environment and Development, Our Common Future (New York: Oxford University Press, 1987), also known as the Brundtland Report.
Colin Cunliff, “Omission Innovation: The Missing Element in Most Countries’ Response to Climate Change” (ITIF, December 2018).
Stephen Ezell, Frank Spring, and Katarzyna Bitka, “The Global Flourishing of National Innovation Foundations” (ITIF, April 2015).

A New Roadmap for Workforce Education, With Bill Bonvillian and Sanjay Sarma Apr 19, 2021

There is a deep disconnect between the U.S. education system and the workplace. How can policymakers bridge the gap and create clear pathways to good jobs? How do technical schools, community colleges, employers, governments, and universities fit together as pieces of the workforce education puzzle—and how can new education technologies help deliver the training workers need? Rob and Jackie discuss the challenges, opportunities, and policy solutions with Professor Sanjay Sarma and Bill Bonvillian of MIT, authors of the new book Workforce Education: A New Roadmap.

Mentioned:

William B. Bonvillian and Sanjay E. Sarma, Workforce Education: A New Roadmap (Cambridge, Massachusetts: The MIT Press, February 2021).
Joe Kennedy, Daniel Castro, Robert D. Atkinson, “Why It’s Time to Disrupt Higher Education by Separating Learning From Credentialing” (ITIF, August 2016).

Robert D. Atkinson, “How to Reform Worker-Training and Adjustment Policies for an Era of Technological Change” (ITIF, February 2018).

How Pack Journalism and Predictable Crisis PR Responses Have Influenced the Techlash, With Nirit Weiss-Blatt Apr 05, 2021

The “techlash” is a story of extreme pendulum swings—from an era in which splashy product launches earned gushing media reviews to a relentless crisis narrative in which the tech industry is viewed with harsh suspicion. How has this happened? Is it a case of pack journalism run amok, or have tech companies contributed to the narrative with predictable formulas for handling a PR crisis? Rob and Jackie discuss all this with Nirit Weiss-Blatt, a former research fellow at the University of Southern California, Annenberg School for Communication and Journalism, and author of the new book The Techlash and Tech Crisis Communications.

Mentioned:

Nirit Weiss-Blatt, The Techlash and Tech Crisis Communications (UK: Emerald Publishing Limited, 2021).
Patrick Grother, Mei Ngan, and Kayee Hanaoka, Face Recognition Vendor Test (FRVT) Part 3: Demographic Effects, National Institute of Standards and Technology, Interagency Report 8280, December 2019.

Robert D. Atkinson, et al., “A Policymaker’s Guide to the ‘Techlash’—What It Is and Why It’s a Threat to Growth and Progress” (ITIF, October 2019).
Doug Allen and Daniel Castro, “Why So Sad? A Look at the Change in Tone of Technology Reporting From 1986 to 2013” (ITIF, February 2017).
Michael McLaughlin and Daniel Castro, “The Critics Were Wrong: Data Shows the Best Facial Recognition Algorithms Are Neither Racist Nor Sexist” (ITIF, January 2020).

Podcast: The Hype, the Hope, and the Practical Realities of Artificial Intelligence, With Pedro Domingos Mar 22, 2021

There is an inordinate amount of hype and fear around artificial intelligence these days, as a chorus of scholars, luminaries, media, and politicians nervously project that it could soon take our jobs and subjugate or even kills us off. Others are just as fanciful in hoping it is on the verge of solving all our problems. But the truth is AI isn’t nearly as advanced as most people imagine. What is the practical reality of AI today, and how should government approach AI policy to maximize its potential? To parse the hype, the hope, and the path forward for AI, Rob and Jackie sat down recently with Pedro Domingos, emeritus professor of computer science at the University of Washington and author of The Master Algorithm.
Mentioned:

Pedro Domingos, The Master Algorithm: How the Quest for the Ultimate Learning Machine Will Remake Our World (Basic Books, 2015).
Robert D. Atkinson, “The 2015 ITIF Luddite Award Nominees: The Worst of the Year’s Worst Innovation Killers” (ITIF, December 2015).
Richard Dawkins, The Selfish Gene (Oxford University Press, 1990).
Carl Benedikt Frey and Michael A. Osbourne, “The Future of Employment: How Susceptible Are Jobs to Computerisation?” (University of Oxford, September 17, 2013).
Michael McLaughlin and Daniel Castro, “The Critics Were Wrong: NIST Data Shows the Best Facial Recognition Algorithms Are Neither Racist Nor Sexist” (ITIF, January 2020).
“The Case for Killer Robots,” ITIF Innovation Files podcast with Robert Marks, August 10, 2020.

Assessing Chinese Industrial Policy and the Impact of U.S. Export Controls, With Dan Wang Mar 08, 2021

In the final weeks of the Trump administration, Rob and Jackie sat down with Dan Wang, a technology analyst and China expert at Gavekal Dragonomics Research, to discuss the successes and failures of Chinese industrial policy and to evaluate the impact of U.S. export restrictions. In the previous four years, there weren’t many Chinese tech companies that the Trump administration didn’t sanction or at least threaten. What did that achieve in the technological race with China? What was the impact on the American brand writ large? And what should the Biden administration do next?

Mentioned:

Dan Wang, “New U.S. Restrictions Will Help Make China Great Again” (Bloomberg Opinion, December 18, 2020).
Dan Wang’s website, danwang.co.

Stephen Ezell and Caleb Foote, “How Stringent Export Controls on Emerging Technologies Would Harm the U.S. Economy” (ITIF, May 2019).

The Ins and Outs of the Section 230 Debate, With Ellysse Dick and Ashley Johnson Feb 22, 2021

Section 230 of the Communications Decency Act is at the center of a contentious, high-stakes debate about free speech, intermediary liability, and the future of the Internet. Why is a 1996 law so important today? Why have Presidents Biden and Trump both said they want to repeal it? Was it to blame when Twitter and Facebook banned Trump from their platforms, or was it the reason they didn’t ban him sooner? Rob and Jackie discuss the issue with ITIF policy analysts Ellysse Dick and Ashley Johnson, co-hosts of the new podcast series Ellysse and Ashley Break the Internet, which will start dropping on all major distribution platforms on February 24.

Ellysse and Ashley Break the Internet: The Ins and Outs of the Section 230 Debate (ITIF podcast series, 2021).

The Promise of Artificial Intelligence, With Steven Shwartz Feb 08, 2021

Artificial intelligence (AI) is a branch of computer science devoted to creating computer systems that perform tasks characteristic of human intelligence, such as learning and decision-making. AI overlaps with other areas of study, including robotics, natural language processing, and computer vision. Understanding what AI can do—and perhaps more importantly what it cannot—is critical for understanding the substantial benefits AI can bring to many sectors of the economy and society. Rob and Jackie talk to veteran AI researcher, statistician, and investor Steve Shwartz about the mechanics of AI and how to spur further development and adoption of the technology.

Mentioned:

Steven Shwartz, Evil Robots, Killer Computers, and Other Myths: The Truth About AI and the Future of Humanity (Fast Company Press, February 2021).

“What Is Artificial Intelligence?” (ITIF Technology Explainer, September 2018).
Steven Shwartz, “Artificial Intelligence 101,” AI Perspectives, online book.

Maintaining a Robust VC Ecosystem Despite Changing Tides, With Dan Scheinman Jan 25, 2021

Venture capital firms have reined in their funding for resource-intensive start-ups trying to commercialize new technologies in fields such as clean energy, advanced manufacturing, and robotics. Today, for a fraction of the costs involved in those enterprises, you can bring innovations to market in months—and be relatively capital efficient—thanks partly to the transition to cloud computing. Rob and Jackie discuss what’s needed to maintain a robust VC ecosystem in the United States with veteran angel investor Dan Scheinman.

Mentioned:

“The COVID-19 ‘Reallocation Shock,’ With Nick Bloom,” ITIF Innovation Files podcast, August 17, 2020.
Adams Nager, et al., “The Demographics of Innovation in the United States” (ITIF, February 2016).

Robert D. Atkinson, Mark Muro, and Jacob Whiton, “The Case for Growth Centers: How to Spread Tech Innovation Across America” (ITIF and Brookings, December 9, 2019).
“The Real History of Silicon Valley and the Lessons It Holds for Innovation Policy Today, With Margaret O’Mara” ITIF Innovation Files podcast, June 8, 2020.
Daniel Castro and Alan McQuinn, “The Privacy Panic Cycle: A Guide to Public Fears About New Technologies” (ITIF, September 2015).

The Dangerous Campaign Against Genetically Modified Foods, With Val Giddings Jan 11, 2021

Crops and foods improved through biotechnology, popularly known as “GMOs” (for “genetically modified organisms”) remain at the center of a maelstrom of conflicting claims and assertions. It is difficult for a layperson to make sense of it all, and this becomes even more important when the layperson is a government official in a position to make or influence policy decisions. Rob and Jackie talk about the unfounded fears surrounding GMOs with L. Val Giddings, senior fellow at ITIF and leading expert on policy relating to biotechnology innovations in agriculture and biomedicine.

Mentioned

Nancy Marie Brown, Mendel in the Kitchen: A Scientist's View of Genetically Modified Foods (Joseph Henry Press, 2004).
Rachel Carson, Silent Spring (Houghton Mifflin, 2002).
Val Giddings, “A Policymaker's Guide to the GMO Controversies” (ITIF, February 2015).

The Importance of Being Wise Stewards of National Innovation Capacity, With John Kao Dec 21, 2020

The United States has no national, coordinated innovation policy system. In fact, its overall innovation system has been deteriorating. The country’s economic future and national security will depend on rising to the challenge of addressing this problem. Rob and Jackie discuss how policymakers can be responsible stewards of innovation with John Kao, a leading thinker on innovation.

Mentioned:

John Kao, Jamming: The Art and Discipline of Business Creativity (Harper Business, 1997).
John Kao, Innovation Nation: How America Is Losing Its Innovation Edge, Why It Matters, and What We Can Do to Get It Back (Free Press, 2007).

Robert D. Atkinson, “Understanding the U.S. National Innovation System, 2020” (ITIF, November 2020).

The Case for Improving U.S. Computer Science Education, With Pat Yongpradit Dec 07, 2020

Despite the growing use of computers and software in every facet of our economy, not until recently has computer science education begun to gain traction in American school systems. The current focus on improving science, technology, engineering, and mathematics (STEM) education in U.S. schools has disregarded differences within STEM fields. Indeed, the most important STEM field for a modern economy is not only one that is not represented by its own initial in the acronym “STEM,” but also the field that the fewest high school students study and the one with the most room for improvement, by far: computer science. Rob and Jackie discuss the state of computer science education in the United States and abroad—and why policymakers need to provide support—with Pat Yongpradit, chief academic officer for Code.org.

Mentioned:

2020 State of Computer Science Education: Illuminating Disparities (Code.org Advocacy Coalition, Computer Science Teachers Association, and Expanding Computing Education Pathways, October 2020).
Adams Nager and Robert D. Atkinson, “The Case for Improving U.S. Computer Science Education” (ITIF, May 2016).
Robert D. Atkinson and Merrilea Mayo, “Refueling the U.S. Innovation Economy: Fresh Approaches to STEM Education” (ITIF, December 2010).
Computer Science for All Act of 2019, H.R.1485, 116th Congress. (2019)
Robert D. Atkinson and Caleb Foote, “The 2020 State New Economy Index” (ITIF, October 2020).

Innovating in the Defense Sector to Remain Competitive With China, Featuring Michael Brown Nov 23, 2020

It has become abundantly clear that the United States faces a robust economic and military competitor in China. In at least one respect, this is a more daunting challenge than America faced in the Cold War, because while the former Soviet Union had a strong military, it struggled with a weak economy. In those days, the United States also could rely on specialized defense contractors to provide most of the technologies that the Defense Department needed to maintain military superiority, but that’s no longer true. Now, many of the capabilities the country needs for its defense reside in the private sector. It is, therefore, critical to establish better links between the commercial sector and the military.

Enter the Defense Innovation Unit (DIU), a Defense Department entity that was launched in 2015 to work more closely with the private sector. Rob and Jackie talk to Michael Brown, DIU’s director and a former CEO of Symantec, about remaining competitive by innovating in the defense sector.

Mentioned:

Stephen Ezell and Caleb Foote, “How Stringent Export Controls on Emerging Technologies Would Harm the U.S. Economy” (ITIF, May 2019).
Nigel Cory and Robert D. Atkinson, “Why and How to Mount a Strong, Trilateral Response to China’s Innovation Mercantilism” (ITIF, January 2020).
Robert D. Atkinson, “Emerging Defense Technologies Need Funding to Cross ‘The Valley of Death’,” RealClearDefense, February 15, 2020.

The Nuts and Bolts of Broadband Internet Operations, With Robert Rockell Nov 09, 2020

There was a time, a decade or so ago, when many people thought it would be a long while before telecommunications networks could handle the migration from cable TV to over-the-top video streaming. Clearly a lot of Americans still do both, but it is striking how easy it has become to stream HD content on multiple screens at home at once. Rob talks about what happens behind the scenes to make this possible with Robert Rockell, vice president of network infrastructure at Comcast.
Mentioned:

Doug Brake, “Lessons From the Pandemic: Broadband Policy After COVID-19” (ITIF, July 2020).

The Risks and Life-Saving Rewards of Biopharmaceutical Investment, With Josh Bilenker Oct 26, 2020

America leads in biopharmaceutical innovation and drug development, in large part due to effective life-science policies, including significant federal investment in basic research, robust intellectual property protections, effective technology transfer policies, investment incentives, and, importantly, drug pricing policies that enable companies to invest in high-risk drug development. Rob and Jackie talk about conducive environments for biopharmaceutical startups—and what the federal government can do to maintain U.S. competitiveness—with Josh Bilenker, CEO of Loxo Oncology at Lilly.

Mentioned:

Robert D. Atkinson, “Why Life-Sciences Innovation Is Politically “Purple”—and How Partisans Get It Wrong” (ITIF, February 2016).
Stephen Ezell, “Ensuring U.S. Biopharmaceutical Competitiveness” (ITIF, July 2020).

Stephen Ezell, et al., “The Critical Role of Biopharmaceutical Startups in Driving Life Sciences Innovation,” ITIF webinar, July 16, 2020.
Joe Kennedy, “The Link Between Drug Prices and Research on the Next Generation of Cures” (ITIF, September 2019).

Building Digitally Inclusive Communities, With Joshua Edmonds Oct 12, 2020

The COVID-19 pandemic has brought into sharp focus the digital divide affecting millions of American families, especially those in low-income households. One of the most pernicious challenges is the divide between those with reliable access to computers and high-speed Internet in their homes and those without. Rob and Jackie discuss how local governments are on the front lines of addressing this challenge—and what the federal government can do to support healthy and inclusive digital ecosystems nationwide—with Joshua Edmonds, Director of Digital Inclusion for the City of Detroit, Michigan.

Mentioned

Rocket Mortgage, “Detroit’s Vision To Be Fully Connected: Here’s How The City Is Bridging Its Digital Divide,” Forbes advertorial,August 12, 2020.
Connect 313, City of Detroit Digital Inclusion Program.

Robert D. Atkinson, et al., “Digital Policy for Physical Distancing: 28 Stimulus Proposals That Will Pay Long-Term Dividends” (ITIF, April 2020).
Robert D. Atkinson, Mark Muro, and Jacob Whiton, “The Case for Growth Centers: How to Spread Tech Innovation Across America” (ITIF, December 2019).

Technology Panic Attacks, From Radio to Social Media, With Amy Orben Sep 28, 2020

If Netflix’s “The Social Dilemma” is to be believed, social media giants are surely responsible for the breakdown of our mental health, politics, and the economy. Generations of fear mongers have found reasons to believe new technologies—from books and bicycles to video games and email—are to blame for society’s ills. Rob and Jackie take a deep breath and discuss these predictable cycles of technology panic with Dr. Amy Orben, an expert in the history of technology panics at Emmanuel College, University of Cambridge.

Mentioned:

Amy Orben, “The Sisyphean Cycle of Technology Panics,” Perspectives on Psychological Science, June 30, 2020.
Amy Orben, “The Sisyphean Cycle of Technology Panics,” video lecture, July 1, 2020.

Robert D. Atkinson, et al., “A Policymaker’s Guide to the “Techlash”—What It Is and Why It’s a Threat to Growth and Progress” (ITIF, October 2019).
Daniel Castro and Alan McQuinn, “The Privacy Panic Cycle: A Guide to Public Fears About New Technologies” (ITIF, September 2015).

A New Way to Think About Government’s Role in Wealth Creation, With David Sainsbury Sep 14, 2020

For too long, economic policy in the U.S. and Commonwealth nations has been guided by the “market efficiency” school. The result has been a widespread unwillingness to view government roles as critical to boosting innovation, growth, and competitiveness. It’s time for a new approach, which Lord David Sainsbury, author of Windows of Opportunity: How Nations Make Wealth, calls the “production capability” school. Under this school, the key question for economic policy is how well it enables enterprises to be more innovative and efficient. Rejecting the old doctrine in favor of the new is perhaps the most economic important task for our time. Rob and Jackie discuss this and the role for government in “picking winners” at the level of technologies and industries with Sainsbury.

Mentioned:

Lord David Sainsbury, Windows of Opportunity: How Nations Make Wealth (Profile Books, 2019).
Robert D. Atkinson and Stephen J. Ezell, Innovation Economics: The Race for Global Advantage (Yale University Press, 2014).

Accelerating Clean Energy Innovation, With Colin Cunliff Aug 31, 2020

Innovation is central to addressing global climate change while increasing economic growth, boosting international competitiveness, and strengthening energy security. Yet out of a $4 trillion budget, the United States only invests about $8 billion a year—or 0.04 percent of GDP—on clean energy research and development. Rob and Jackie discuss the urgent need for innovation in the clean energy sector—and “must pass” legislation that will accelerate progress—with Colin Cunliff, senior analyst at ITIF’s Clean Energy Innovation Program.

Colin Cunliff, “An Innovation Agenda for Deep Decarbonization: Bridging Gaps in the Federal Energy RD&D Portfolio” (ITIF, November 2018).
Colin Cunliff, “Omission Innovation 2.0: Diagnosing the Global Clean Energy Innovation System” (ITIF, September 2019).
Colin Cunliff, “An Innovation Agenda for Hard-to-Decarbonize Energy Sectors,” Issues in Science and Technology, Vol. XXXVI, no. 1, Fall 2019.
Colin Cunliff, “Accelerating Energy Innovation in the 116th Congress: 10 Priorities for 2020” (ITIF, January 2020).

How Automation Expands Opportunities for Human Labor, With James Bessen Aug 24, 2020

A vocal group of alarmists worry that the pace of automation—particularly advances in robotics and artificial intelligence—will soon displace human labor to such an extent that many workers will be left with nothing to do. Never mind that generation after generation of technological innovations in industries ranging from textiles to steel to banking have always produced the opposite result: expanding the labor force, not wiping it out. Rob and Jackie delve into the evidence with Dr. James Bessen, executive director of the Technology & Policy Research Initiative (TPRI) at Boston University School of Law and author of Learning by Doing: The Real Connection Between Innovation, Wages and Wealth.

Mentioned:

James Bessen, Learning by Doing: The Real Connection Between Innovation, Wages and Wealth, (Yale University Press, 2015).
James Bessen, et al., “Firm-Level Automation: Evidence from the Netherlands,” American Economic Association, AEA Papers and Proceedings, 110: 389-93.
Robert D. Atkinson, “How G7 Nations Can Support and Prepare for the Next Technology Wave” (ITIF, March 2018).
Technology & Policy Research Initiative (TPRI), Boston University School of Law.

ITIF’s @Work Series: “Employment in the Innovation Economy.”
Robert D. Atkinson, “Robots, Automation, and Jobs: A Primer for Policymakers” (ITIF, May 2017).
Robert D. Atkinson, “Robotics and the Future of Production and Work” (ITIF, October 2019).
Robert D. Atkinson, “How to Reform Worker-Training and Adjustment Policies for an Era of Technological Change” (ITIF, February 2018).

The COVID-19 “Reallocation Shock,” With Nick Bloom Aug 17, 2020

The U.S. Labor Department’s jobs report in February 2020 showed the country’s lowest rate of unemployment in 60 years. Two months later, it showed the highest rate of unemployment in 80 years. As The Wall Street Journal put it, “The coronavirus pandemic is forcing the fastest reallocation of labor since World War II, with companies and governments mobilizing an army of idled workers into new activities that are urgently needed.” Rob and Jackie discuss this “reallocation shock”—and which sectors will fare well or bare the brunt—with Nick Bloom, the William Eberle Professor of Economics at Stanford University, who also co-directs the Productivity, Innovation and Entrepreneurship program at the National Bureau of Economic Research.

Mentioned:

Jose Maria Barrero, Nick Bloom, and Steven J. Davis, “COVID-19 Is Also a Reallocation Shock,” University of Chicago, Becker Friedman Institute, working paper No. 2020-59.
U.S. Bureau of Labor Statistics, Monthly Labor Review.
Nicholas Bloom bio: William Eberle Professor of Economics, Stanford University.

The Case for Killer Robots, With Robert Marks Aug 10, 2020

There’s a lot of doomsday hype around artificial intelligence in general, and the idea of so-called “killer robots” has been especially controversial. But when it comes to the ethics of these technologies, one can argue that robots actually could be more ethical than human operators. Humans can commit war crimes. They can deliberately kill innocent people or enemies that have surrendered. Humans get stressed and tired and bring any number of biases to the table. But robots just follow their code. Moreover, U.S. adversaries are deploying these technologies quickly, and stakes are high if we don’t keep up. Rob and Jackie discuss these technologies—and the risks of sitting out the AI arms race—with Robert J. Marks, Distinguished Professor of Electrical and Computer Engineering at Baylor University, and Director of the Walter Bradley Center for Natural and Artificial Intelligence.

Mentioned:

Robert J. Marks, The Case for Killer Robots: Why America’s Military Needs to Continue Development of Lethal, e-book (Walter Bradley Center for Natural and Artificial Intelligence), https://mindmatters.ai/killer-robots/.
Forrest E. Morgan, et al., Military Applications of Artificial Intelligence: Ethical Concerns in an Uncertain World (RAND Corporation, 2020), https://www.rand.org/pubs/research_reports/RR3139-1.html.
The Defense Innovation Unit (DIU), https://www.diu.mil/.

Designing a Federal Privacy Standard, With Rep. Suzan DelBene (D-WA) Aug 03, 2020

Congress is rightly considering substantial reforms to federal data-privacy law. In particular, there is a pressing need to preempt states from subjecting organizations to multiple, conflicting privacy rules. The debate now is not over whether to pass new legislation, but how to design such a law to protect consumers while encouraging continued innovation. Rob and Jackie discuss one proposal with its sponsor, Rep. Suzan DelBene (D-WA), honorary co-chair of ITIF.

Mentioned

Robert D. Atkinson, Daniel Castro, and Doug Brake, “Technology Should Be Part of Any Stimulus Plan,” ITIF Innovation Files blog post, March 13, 2020.
Office of Rep. Suzan DelBene (D-WA), “DelBene Introduces Legislation to Protect Consumer Privacy,” news release, March 29, 2019.
ITIF, “DelBene Privacy Bill Would Protect Consumers Without Undermining Innovation,” news release, March 29, 2019.
ITIF, “ECJ’s Irresponsible Decision in Schrems Case Will Wreak Havoc on Global Data Flows,” news release, July 16, 2020.

Daniel Castro, Ben Miller, and Adams Nager, “Unlocking the Potential of Physician-to-Patient Telehealth Services” (ITIF, May 2014).
Daniel Castro, “5 Lessons the U.S. Can Learn from European Privacy Efforts,” Government Technology, July-August, 2019.

The Dangers of Digital Services Taxes, With Clete Willems Jul 27, 2020

There has been a global consensus for nearly a century that countries should tax multinational companies in the jurisdictions where they create value, not where they generate sales. But that consensus has begun to fall apart as digitalization has made it easier to serve regional markets remotely and Internet companies have successfully capitalized on the opportunity. A growing number of countries, from the United Kingdom and France to Chile and Australia, are now looking to impose “digital services taxes” (DSTs) on a select few of these Internet companies—mostly American—on the dubious theory that users are creating a significant share of their value, so their profits should be taxed where their users reside. Rob and Jackie discuss the dangers of this approach—and how policymakers can protect U.S. firms—with trade expert Clete Willems, partner at Akin Gump Strauss.

Mentioned:

Clete Willems, “Digital taxes are an even bigger threat to the US economy during the pandemic,” CNBC, May 27, 2020.
Joe Kennedy, “Digital Services Taxes: A Bad Idea Whose Time Should Never Come” (ITIF, May 2019).
Robert D. Atkinson, Nigel Cory, and Stephen Ezell, “Stopping China’s Mercantilism: A Doctrine of Constructive, Alliance-Backed Confrontation” (ITIF, March 2017).

Joe Kennedy, “Comments to the U.S. Trade Representative Regarding Section 301 Investigations of Digital Services Taxes” (ITIF, June 2020).

COVID and the Future of Work, With Rep. Derek Kilmer (D-WA) Jul 20, 2020

The changing nature of labor markets—and how best to prepare people and society for the jobs of the future—is one of the most crucial public policy challenges that policymakers around the world will face in the coming years. This was already the case before COVID-19, but disruption from the pandemic has made things exponentially more challenging. Rob and Jackie discuss how Congress can address these challenges with Rep. Derek Kilmer (D-WA), chairman of the House New Democrat Coalition.

Mentioned

Robert D. Atkinson Jeffrey Brown, “The Future of Work: A Guide for Transatlantic Policymakers” (ITIF, December 2018).
New Democrat Coalition, “A Future that Works,” policy agenda.
Office of Rep. Derek Kilmer (D-WA), “Kilmer, Thompson, Klobuchar and Sasse Introduce Bipartisan Legislation to Help Workers Save for Critical Skills Training they Need to Compete in the 21st Century Economy,” news release, January 31, 2019.
Office of Rep. Derek Kilmer (D-WA), “Kilmer, Brooks, Sewell, Thompson Introduce Bipartisan, Bicameral Legislation to Help Unemployed American Workers Access Skills Training Programs During Coronavirus Pandemic,” news release, May 20, 2020.
New Democrat Coalition, “New Democrat Coalition Chair Statement on Rep. Beyer’s Proposal to Implement Automatic Stabilizers for Unemployment Benefits,” news release, May 5, 2020.
Robert D. Atkinson, “How to Reform Worker-Training and Adjustment Policies for an Era of Technological Change” (ITIF, February 2018).
Rep. Kilmer’s podcast: Quick Questions About Congress With Kilmer.

A National Strategy for 5G, With Doug Brake Jul 13, 2020

5G wireless will drive economic growth for decades to come, but we need a comprehensive strategy to ensure a robust deployment and adoption of secure networks. A U.S. strategy for 5G should play to our strengths to overcome unfair practices that have made Huawei a leader. Rob and Jackie discuss why 5G is important, separating hype from reality, and what a national framework should look like with Doug Brake, Director of Broadband and Spectrum Policy at ITIF and author of “A U.S. National Strategy for 5G and Future Wireless Innovation.”

Mentioned:

Doug Brake, “A U.S. National Strategy for 5G and Future Wireless Innovation” (ITIF, April 2020).
Blair Levin and Larry Downes, “The Internet After COVID-19: Will We Mind the Gaps?” (Aspen Institute, April 15, 2020).
Atkinson and Whisman, hosts. “What the COVID Crisis Teaches Us About Broadband Policy, With Special Guests Larry Downes and Blair Levin,” Innovation Files, ITIF, June 2020.

Advanced Leadership Through Smart Innovation, With Rosabeth Moss Kanter Jul 06, 2020

The entrepreneurial spirit is alive and well in America, but it’s easy for successful organizations to get comfortable and stop innovating to avoid disrupting their success. We see this across industries, as well as in government and the nonprofit sector. Rob and Jackie discuss advanced leadership and the importance of continuous innovation with Rosabeth Moss Kanter, Ernest L. Arbuckle professor of business at Harvard Business School and author of Thinking Outside the Building: How Advanced Leaders Can Change the World One Smart Innovation at a Time.

Mentioned

Rosabeth Moss Kanter, Think Outside the Building: How Advanced Leaders Can Change the World One Smart Innovation at a Time (PublicAffairs, 2020).
Rosabeth Moss Kanter, Change Masters (Free Press, 1985).
Rosabeth Moss Kanter, Move: How to Rebuild and Reinvent America’s Infrastructure (W.W. Norton & Company, 2015).

Transforming Government Operations Using IT, With Bill Eggers Jun 29, 2020

COVID-19 has forced governments at all levels to implement changes in their operating structures that probably should have happened a decade ago. A worldwide shift toward remote work and a more distant lifestyle now means governments will need to find different methods of delivering public services long term. Rob and Jackie discuss e-government opportunities and how flipping orthodoxies can (and should) reinvent government operating models with Bill Eggers, executive director of Deloitte’s Center for Government Insights.

Mentioned

Daniel Castro, Galia Nurko, and Alan McQuinn, “Benchmarking U.S. Government Websites” (ITIF, November 2017).
Daniel Castro and Michael McLaughlin, “Benchmarking State Government Websites” (ITIF, August 2018).
William D. Eggers, Pankaj Kishnani, and Shruthi Krishnamoorthy, “Transforming Government Post–COVID-19: How Flipping Orthodoxies Can Reinvent Government Operating Models,” Deloitte Insights, June 15, 2020.
William D. Eggers, Delivering on Digital: The Innovators and Technologies That Are Transforming Government (RosettaBooks, 2016).
William D. Eggers, Government 2.0: Using Technology to Improve Education, Cut Red Tape, Reduce Gridlock, and Enhance Democracy (Rowman & Littlefield, 2007).
Michael Hammer, The Reengineering Revolution: A Handbook (HarperBusiness, 1995).

Robert D. Atkinson, et al., “Digital Policy for Physical Distancing: 28 Stimulus Proposals That Will Pay Long-Term Dividends” (ITIF, April 2020).
Daniel Castro, “Time to Toss Social Security Numbers,” Washington Post, April 27, 2018.

Maintaining America’s Global Competitive Edge, With Rep. Cathy McMorris Rodgers (R-WA) Jun 22, 2020

China engages in egregious “innovation mercantilism,” including massive tech subsidies and forced tech transfer, all designed to have China replace America as the global tech leader. It’s time for America to rise to the challenge by developing its own plan to maintain competitive advantage in advanced and emerging technology industries that are critical to U.S. economic and national security. Rob and Jackie discuss all of this—along with what an Energy and Commerce agenda might look like next Congress--with Representative Cathy McMorris Rodgers (R-WA), Ranking Member on E&C’s Consumer Protection and Commerce Subcommittee.

Mentioned:

Walden, McMorris Rodgers Announce Emerging Tech Agenda
All Information (Except Text) for H.R.6950 - GAINS Act
Daniel Castro and Michael McLaughlin, “Ten Ways the Precautionary Principle Undermines Progress in Artificial Intelligence” (ITIF, February 2019).

Robert D. Atkinson, “How China’s Policies Have Stifled Global Innovation” (ITIF, January 2020).
Robert D. Atkinson, “The Case for a National Industrial Strategy to Counter China’s Technological Rise” (ITIF, April 2020).

Accelerating the Digital Transformation of Healthcare, With Pat Combes Jun 15, 2020

People have been working on digital transformation of health care for decades, but the COVID pandemic has added urgency to the challenge. This is creating a window of opportunity to reinvent how the health care system works—for example, the United States is on track to surpass more than 1 billion virtual office visits by the end of the year, even though only about a quarter of health-care organizations offered virtual visits before the pandemic. But of course, we still need to deal with important issues like privacy, security, and usability of all this new technology. ITIF VP Daniel Castro joins regular Innovation Files host Jackie Whisman to discuss these issues with Pat Combes, worldwide technical leader for health care and life sciences at Amazon Web Services.
Related:

Nigel Cory and Philip Stevens, “Building a Global Framework for Digital Health Services in the Era of COVID-19” (ITIF, May 2020).
Daniel Castro, “Improving Health Care: Why a Dose of IT May Be Just What the Doctor Ordered” (ITIF, October 2007).

The Real History of Silicon Valley and the Lessons It Holds for Innovation Policy Today, With Margaret O’Mara Jun 08, 2020

The dominant narrative about Silicon Valley, and U.S. tech innovation generally, is that it sprang from garages of quirky, but committed entrepreneurs. Yes, but… What many don’t realize is how important federal investments were in kick-starting the growth of Silicon Valley and other tech hubs in the past. Rob and Jackie discuss this history and its potential lessons for federal policy to spur growth in other parts of the country today with Professor Margaret O’Mara, author of The Code: Silicon Valley and the Remaking of America.

Mentioned:

Margaret O’Mara, The Code: Silicon Valley and the Remaking of America (Penguin Random House, 2020).
Robert D. Atkinson, Mark Muro, and Jacob Whiton, “The Case for Growth Centers: How to Spread Tech Innovation Across America” (ITIF, December 2019).
Adams Nager, David M. Hart, Stephen Ezell, and Robert D. Atkinson, “The Demographics of Innovation in the United States” (ITIF, February 2019).
Apple 1984 Super Bowl Commercial Introducing Macintosh Computer.
Margaret O’Mara’s website: www.margaretomara.com.

What the COVID Crisis Teaches Us About Broadband Policy, With Larry Downes and Blair Levin Jun 01, 2020

The COVID-induced isolation economy has demonstrated just how important broadband networks are for work, learning, and entertainment. But it has also highlighted important gaps, such as the rural divide and the “homework divide,” that government policy can play a role in filling. Rob and Jackie discuss these issues with broadband and IT experts Larry Downes, a senior industry and innovation fellow at Georgetown University’s Center for Business & Public Policy, and Blair Levin, a nonresident senior fellow with the Brookings Metropolitan Policy Program and prior director of the 2010 National Broadband Plan.

Mentioned:

Blair Levin and Larry Downes, “The Internet After COVID-19: Will We Mind the Gaps?” (Aspen Institute, April 15, 2020).
Larry Downes and Paul Nunes, Big Bang Disruption: Strategy In The Age Of Devastating Innovation, (Portfolio, 2014).
Federal Communications Commission, The National Broadband Plan, March 17, 2010.
Doug Brake, “A U.S. National Strategy for 5G and Future Wireless Innovation” (ITIF, April 2020).

COVID and Its Impacts on Technology, the Tech Industry, and Tech Policy, With David Moschella May 20, 2020

The COVID crisis has highlighted more than ever the importance of information technology and the tech companies that produce it as many of us work at home, rely on e-commerce, and enjoy streaming video and social media. What is the impact of this on the so-called “techlash” and on broader perceptions of technology companies? What gaps has the COVID crisis exposed in current IT system that need more innovation and investment? And what does all of this say about government’s role in spurring the digitalization of the economy? Rob and Jackie discuss these issues with IT expert David Moschella, a research fellow at the Leading Edge Forum and author of Seeing Digital: A Visual Guide to the Industries, Organizations, and Careers of the 2020s.

Mentioned:

Robert D. Atkinson, et al., “A Policymaker’s Guide to the “Techlash”—What It Is and Why It’s a Threat to Growth and Progress” (ITIF, October 2019).
Robert D. Atkinson, “The Task Ahead of Us: Transforming the Global Economy With Connectivity, Automation, and Intelligence” (ITIF, January 2019).
David Moschella, Seeing Digital: A Visual Guide to the Industries, Organizations, and Careers of the 2020s (DXC Technology, 2018).

The COVID Privacy Challenge, With Amitai Etzioni May 18, 2020

The COVID crisis has shifted the data privacy debate away from its prior focus on individual rights to one more focused on collective needs and responsibilities—for example, when it comes to sharing and analyzing medial data related to the pandemic, or tracking individuals’ contacts. Rob and Jackie discuss these issues with noted scholar and public intellectual Amitai Etzioni, professor of international affairs and director of the Institute for Communitarian Policy Studies at George Washington University.

Mentioned:

Amitai Etzioni, The Limits of Privacy (Basic Books, 2000).
Amitai Etzioni, Privacy in a Cyber Age: Policy and Practice (Palgrave Macmillan, 2015).
Amitai Etzioni, “Congress Should Suspend Privacy Laws for 90 Days to Fight the Coronavirus,” The National Interest, April 1, 2020.

The Post-COVID China Challenge, With James McGregor May 11, 2020

The COVID crisis has exposed new vulnerabilities in U.S. supply chains, as well generated even more distrust of the Chinese government. At the same time, China is doubling down its “Made in China, 2025” ambitions to be the global technology leader. How will these developments affect U.S. technology competitiveness? What should the next administration do vis-à-vis U.S.-China trade relations? Rob and Jackie discuss these issues with James McGregor, Chairman of APCO Worldwide’s greater China region and a leading expert on China and Chinese economic policy.
Mentioned in this episode:

Books by James McGregor: jamesmcgregor-inc.com/books.
Robert D. Atkinson, “The Case for a National Industrial Strategy to Counter China’s Technological Rise” (ITIF, April 2020).
Orville Schell, Wealth and Power: China’s Long March to the Twenty-first Century (Random House, 2013).
William H. Janeway, Doing Capitalism in the Innovation Economy: Markets, Speculation and the State (Cambridge University Press, 2012).

Global Supply Chains Under Pressure, With Willy Shih May 05, 2020

Global supply chains have been under intense pressure during the coronavirus pandemic, particularly when it comes to medical supplies and drugs. What should the U.S. policy response be? Rob and Jackie discuss the issue with Willy Shih, a renowned professor of management practice at Harvard Business School.
Mentioned in this episode:

Willy C. Shih, “Bringing Manufacturing Back to the U.S. Is Easier Said Than Done” Harvard Business Review, April 15, 2020.
Joshua Murray and Michael Schwartz, Wrecked: How the American Automobile Industry Destroyed Its Capacity to Compete (Russel Sage Foundation, 2019).
Manufacturing USA: manufacturingusa.com.
Willy Shih’s faculty page at Harvard Business School.
Willy Shih on LinkedIn.
Willy Shih on Twitter.

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