In Loco Parent(i)s

Episode 2-10: A Non-April Fools Episode (with Pamela Brown) Apr 01, 2022

Karen and Steve are back, albeit not necessarily better than ever (Steve's in the midst of a pretty nasty cold). After a brief recounting of recent events in their lives, they turn to a wide-ranging interview with superstar CNN anchor and correspondent Pamela Brown, who talks about what it was like to cover the Trump White House (and to do it while pregnant and then with little kids); how the media has been doing with the Russia/Ukraine war; and her really cool side-hustle in the Master of Studies in Law program at George Washington University Law School in D.C.

Episode 2-9: Team Crib for Life (with Neema Sahni) Mar 04, 2022

In their latest episode, Karen and Steve are joined by Covington & Burling partner Neema Sahni, who talks about her experiences as an in-house lawyer at Disney(!); the transition to law-firm life; and what it means to be co-chair of Covington's "Music Industry Group" and vice-chair of its "Sports Practice Group" (including why Steve is really jealous). Before chatting with Neema, Karen and Steve catch up on a busy week on the home-front, and a look back at Karen's first month in her new job (and Steve's two latest losses in court).

Episode 2-8: The Odds of Successfully Navigating an Asteroid Field (with Jennifer Judge) Feb 24, 2022

Karen and Steve reflect on a wacky and wild weekend with the wee ones in Disneyland, and the rather ... sobering ... return to Texas, including the state's proposed attack on tenure at public universities and its very real attack on the rights of transgender minors. After diagnosing Steve with burnout, they then turn to a fun, wide-ranging interview with long-time friend of the pod Jennifer Judge, who talks about the life of an in-house lawyer and doesn't *quite* spill the beans on her big, impending career move.

Episode 2-7: This is *Not* an Ember Ad (with Rachel and Ariel Levinson-Waldman) Feb 17, 2022

In this episode, Karen and Steve reflect on a somewhat-less-crazy week, Valentine's Day, victory on the tennis court, and various other miscellany. They then have a wide-ranging interview with Rachel and Ariel Levinson-Waldman, on everything from the life of non-profit lawyers in Washington to having musical kids music-ing at the same time in the same house to their important work on privacy (Rachel) and legal services for underrepresented communities in D.C. (Ariel).

Episode 2-6: Whistler While You Work (with Amdie Mengistu) Feb 03, 2022

Karen has a new job!! We spend the first half of the episode talking about the big move from law firm partner to legal recruiting, what impelled Karen to make such a big switch, how the process unfolded, and how the first week has gone (spoiler: having both girls' schools closed Thursday and Friday due to weather is not ideal). We're then joined by Karen's new colleague, the savvy and brilliant Amdie Mengistu, to talk about his own move from law firm land (including coming onboard at Dewey in the fall of 2008) to a stint in the Staten Island public defender's office to recruiting, how the market has changed during his time at Whistler, and what he sees as the short-term horizon for lawyers thinking about switching tracks.

Episode 2-5: The Breyer Patch (with Tiffany Atkins) Jan 27, 2022

The fifth episode of season 2 features a fascinating interview with Elon Law Professor Tiffany Atkins, who reflects on transitioning from legal aid to the legal academy; the challenges of raising three children of with a sizeable age gap; and how the legal profession and the legal academy, more specifically, can make access to the professoriate more inclusive and egalitarian. Before that, Karen and Steve reflect a bit on the news of the day — Justice Stephen Breyer's apparent impending retirement from the Supreme Court — and Steve's predictions for how things are likely to unfold from here.

Episode 2-4: We've Made TikToks Together (with Alex Su) Jan 20, 2022

It's déjà vu all over again as Karen and Steve talk about the latest setback in their attempt to have two consecutive days of childcare-less work (spoiler alert: no such luck). Then, they turn to a discussion of social media, how they use social media for their jobs/careers, virtues and vices of being active on Twitter and other networks, and advice for folks thinking about creating or expanding their online persona and presence. All of this is simply an appetizer to their interview with Alex Su, former big-firm lawyer turned Head of Community Development at Ironclad, who reflects on the intersection of legal work and sales; how he came to become a social media maven; and how he and his partner (a pediatric cardiologist) balance the demands of two crazy careers and one three-year-old.

Episode 2-3: The One Where Steve Gets COVID (with Preet Bharara) Jan 13, 2022

In their latest episode, Karen and Steve sit down with Preet Bharara, former U.S. Attorney for the Southern District of New York, to chat about the life of a federal prosecutor; the upsides (and downsides) of having three *older* children; what he's been doing since President Trump fired him; and his forthcoming children's book, "Justice is..."
Before that, though, Karen and Steve recap what's been a pretty difficult week on the home front, with Steve testing positive for COVID and quarantining, and Karen having to handle all of the parenting with an ... inconsistent ... school situation. It's a tough conversation, but one that more and more parents are having to undertake.

Episode 2-2: I Want a Doggy (with Alexia Korberg) Jan 06, 2022

Karen and Steve celebrate their kids' (potentially short-lived) return to preschool and school by recording a new episode, including updates on life with Omicron; how we survived winter break; and thoughts about how early-career lawyers can try to balance the obligations of firm jobs with the obligations of parenting young children (spoiler: help will be needed). They then sit down with Paul Weiss partner Alexia Korberg to chat about how they balance a high-profile commercial litigation practice with constitutional impact work; what advice they have for up-and-coming lawyers with similar aspirations; and what it's like to be one of the only partners at a major law firm who is openly trans and gender non-conforming.

Episode 2-1: We're Baaaaaaack! Nov 10, 2021

After hunting around the house for the microphones, downloading the right software onto their new laptop, and realizing that the new episode of Dopesick doesn't drop until tomorrow, Karen and Steve decided to kick off Season 2 of "In Loco Parent(i)s" with a bit of a free-form discussion -- of the last few months; of why they've been so busy; about transitions to Kindergarten (and elsewhere); and about future plans for the podcast.

Episode 23: Six Flags Over ... Torts (with Bill Childs) Jun 03, 2021

In the Season 1 finale, Karen and Steve reflect on their own summer experiences growing up, including the pros and cons of sleepaway camp in (different parts of) New Hampshire, before a fascinating and wide-ranging interview with legal polymath Bill Childs, who's currently in house at 3M but whose career has spanned big firms, smaller firms, and the academy (all while hosting a regular radio show about "indie music for indie kids" on the side). Suffice it to say, Bill's wide-ranging experiences provide a fascinating point of comparison for those wondering how to life their lives as lawyers.

Episode 22: Love in a Time of Qui Tam (with Caprice Roberts and Andy Wright) May 20, 2021

In their latest episode, Karen and Steve talk about some of the unforeseen difficulties of things returning to "normal," at least out in the world, and the challenges for those with kids who may be months away from vaccinations. They then welcome their dear friends, Caprice Roberts and Andy Wright, to talk about a whole lot of things, from moving with small kids to chasing your dreams (across the country) to starting a new law school to moving in and out of Congress and the Executive Branch.

Episode 21: "Mommy, That's *Your* Problem" (with Heather Souder Choi) May 13, 2021

In their latest episode, Karen and Steve are joined by Heather Souder Choi, a partner at Baker Botts in Washington, DC, to discuss everything from having a child while up for partner to staying at the same firm from your 1L summer onwards to the difficulties that large firms have retaining and promoting women of color, and what firms, clients, and law schools can and should be thinking about to try to ameliorate them. Before that, Karen and Steve walk through some of their parenting "hacks" (i.e., concessions made out of desperation), along with those that others have shared on Twitter.

Episode 20: The Committee on Committees (with Julie Klaff) May 06, 2021

With Mother's Day and Karen's birthday right around the corner, Karen and Steve talk about some of the (very different) things they do to relax/decompress, including their very different approaches to watching TV. They're then joined by Karen's long-time friend Julie Klaff, now a partner at Origami Capital Partners in Chicago, to discuss her fascinating transition from big law to in-house on the finance side; some of the unique issues faced by large families; and her advice for those thinking about careers on the transactional side of the law.

Episode 19: "Yes, Netflix: I *Am* Still Watching" (with Liz Vladeck) Apr 29, 2021

Karen and Steve are back to talk about the importance of networking in the legal universe, and different attitudes and approaches they have taken both in their own careers and in trying to facilitate connections with friends, colleagues, students, and even strangers. They're then joined by Liz Vladeck (who's quite a lot more than Steve's older sister) to discuss her cutting-edge work on municipal labor and employment law in New York and some of the challenges of being both a parent and a stepparent, and of being a single mom in an era of COVID.

Episode 18: You Guys Are Such Dads!! (with David Lat) Apr 22, 2021

Karen and Steve are back (this time, with better sound quality) to chat about some of the things that surprised them the most about parenting (and also to feature some of the responses they received from listeners). Then, they're joined by David Lat, founder of Above the Law, to chat about everything from the transition from DOJ to ATL to gestational surrogacy to the scariness of being hospitalized last March with COVID to David's new venture, "Original Jurisdiction."

Episode 17: Chicago is a Beach Town (with Will Baude and Judith Miller) Apr 15, 2021

After a one-week work-caused hiatus, Karen and Steve are back to talk about the parenting ... challenges when it comes to little kids and organized sports, and how they may have turned a parenting fail into a parenting win (to be determined). They're then joined by University of Chicago law professors Will Baude and Judith Miller, who share their own experiences dividing labor with two kids; Judith's difficult jury duty experience as a new mother; and why Chicago is ... a beach town?!?

Episode 16: Parenting Isn't Usually Eloquent (with Tiffany Jeffers) Apr 01, 2021

Karen and Steve are joined by superstar Georgetown law professor Tiffany Jeffers, who, among other things, recounts the experience of having her older child diagnosed with dyslexia and how that has (and hasn't) influenced her approach to parenting. Before chatting with Tiffany, Karen and Steve discuss their own (differing) approaches to pediatric "milestones," and striking the balance between trusting your eyes and ears and listening to the experts (i.e., not us).

Episode 15: The Law School Years (with Adrienne Kirk) Mar 25, 2021

After a one-week hiatus for Spring Break, Karen and Steve return with a law school-oriented episode, starting with some of their own recollections on their individual experiences deciding when to go to law school (and while there) before pivoting to a wide-ranging interview with Adrienne Kirk, currently a 3L at the University of Alabama School of Law, about the experiences of being both pregnant and having a kid while going through law school.

Episode 14: Too Old for TikTok (with Danielle and JJ Citron) Mar 11, 2021

To mark the one-year anniversary of COVID disruptions, Karen and Steve spend the first part of the episode flagging some of the *positives* to come out of the discombobulating circumstances of the past 12 months, along with contributions from folks on Twitter. They're then joined by their first *pair* of interview guests (and their first mother/daughter interviewees), Danielle and JJ Citron, to chat about parenting (and childing) in an internet age; Danielle's pathbreaking work on cyber-stalking and internet privacy; and how a focus on race and the law led JJ to UVa for law school (which just happens to be where her mom teaches).

Episode 13: The Captain and the Cruise Director (with Lindsay Harrison) Mar 04, 2021

Karen and Steve are joined by their long-time friend Lindsay Harrison, who (as those who have listened to the first Patreon bonus episode will know), was there literally at the beginning, and who has (already) had a remarkable career as both a trial and appellate litigator for Jenner & Block LLP. Before their chat with Lindsay, Karen and Steve talk about some of the many ways that they've divvied up parenting responsibilities, and how some of those choices have been by design and others have been more ... innate.

Episode 12: They're Not Going to Get Scurvy (with Elie Mystal) Feb 25, 2021

Karen and Steve (briefly) reflect on things sort of returning to (COVID) normal after the chaos of the last 10 days in Texas (and the difficulties many of their friends are still encountering); an interesting choice of roles for one of their kids in a hypothetical future pre-K play; and other routine meltdowns before a wide-ranging interview with Elie Mystal—on everything from the greatness of the New York Mets and the not-so-great-ness of internet trolls to having the kids at home during COVID times and his forthcoming book, "Allow Me To Retort: A Black Guy's Guide to the Constitution."

Episode 11: Parenting Without Power (with Elliot Williams) Feb 19, 2021

So ... it's been a week. Again. This time, 2021 decided to see how Karen and Steve would handle an unprecedented snow/ice/freeze storm that knocked out power (and heat) to their house for four days, left them without drinkable water (or water pressure), and, well, was basically a miserable experience all around.
After cataloguing their successes (and failures) in surmounting the fun, they chat with Elliot Williams, principal at the Raben Group and CNN legal analyst, about everything from his delightful marriage proposal to his ... troubling ... baseball loyalties, to parenting in downtown D.C. during (and after) the insurrection. It's quite a conversation.

Episode 10: New York State of Mind (with Lisa Rubin) Feb 11, 2021

It's a New York-heavy episode, as Karen and Steve chat about growing up in the Big Apple before chatting with the person most responsible for the existence of this podcast—Lisa Rubin, off-air legal analyst for the Rachel Maddow Show and Steve's law school classmate. Lisa talks about the unique nature of her non-traditional legal job and the challenges of New York parenting during COVID while somehow resisting the urge to tell embarrassing stories about Steve as a 1L.

Episode 9: The Room Where it Happens (with Meera Deo) Feb 04, 2021

Karen and Steve are joined by Dr. Meera Deo, author of "Unequal Profession: Race and Gender in Legal Academia," for a wide-ranging discussion about diversity in the legal academy (and the legal profession writ large), what we're doing very wrong, and some potential (and hopefully uncontroversial) areas for reform, along with some of the unique challenges of parenting during COVID.
Before chatting with Meera, Karen and Steve reflect a bit on their own experiences trying to improve the diversity of their workplaces, some of the obstacles they've faced, and some of the (significant) work still left to be done.

Episode 8: Talking With Our Kids About Death Feb 03, 2021

CONTENT WARNING: This episode includes a discussion of gun violence and homicide.
In this episode, Karen and Steve react to and reflect upon a recent tragedy in their lives, and how they decided to talk to their kids about it.

Episode 7: Does Anybody Know Weird Al? (with Susan Hennessey) Jan 21, 2021

What a day... Karen and Steve recap the big news (their older daughter's fifth birthday), and the even bigger news (President Biden's inauguration), before tackling some listener e-mail about whether they have any plans to move back to the "Northeast" (the geographic scope of which provoked ... some disagreement). After that, they chat with Lawfare Executive Editor and superstar legal analyst Susan Hennessey about everything from the shift from Trump to Biden to the unique challenges of parenting when the parents' jobs are in different states.

Episode 6: Dotting the I (with Rakesh Kilaru) Jan 14, 2021

In honor of President Trump's (second) impeachment, Karen and Steve devote the first half of the episode to a lay-accessible discussion of where things stand in Congress, and where they're likely to go from here. Then, they're joined by old friend Rakesh Kilaru, partner at Wilkinson Stekloff, to discuss working in the White House Counsel's Office; why he chose a litigation boutique for his next gig; and the time he perfectly pranked Steve by wearing a specific shirt under another specific shirt.

Episode 5: Parenting in an Insurrection (with Sarah Harrington) Jan 07, 2021

How can and should parents experience enormously stressful / chaotic / scary things at work or in the world with their kids? In the first episode of 2021, Karen and Steve talk about some of their reactions to the armed attack on the Capitol on January 6 and the broader topic of parenting through bad days before a far lighter (and earlier-recorded) conversation with Goldstein & Russell partner Sarah Harrington about transitioning from the government to private practice; the lack of (and need for) more diversity in the Supreme Court and appellate bars; and the life of parents of redheads.

Episode 4: 2020 is Hindsight (with Dale Ho) Dec 31, 2020

With the end of 2020 (finally) nigh, Karen and Steve talk about some of their goals for 2021 and some of the worst (and best) professional advice they've received before chatting with Dale Ho, Director of the ACLU's Voting Rights Project, to discuss the challenges of parenting as a traveling trial lawyer; his appearance in the award-winning documentary The Fight; his terrible Civil Procedure TA in law school; and much more.

Episode 3: Parenting is a Mess (with Rep. Mikie Sherrill) Dec 24, 2020

On the first day of winter break, Karen and Steve chat about the unique challenges of entertaining younger kids over the holidays when nothing is open and travel is not advised; their own memories of winter break when they were kids; and that time Steve bought six gallons of cooking oil at Costco.
They then welcome Rep. Mikie Sherrill from New Jersey's 11th District, who talks about her remarkable career as a Navy helicopter pilot; what it's like having two kids while *in* law school; why she decided to run for Congress (after having two *more* kids); and her efforts to rein in the federal government's authority to use the armed forces for domestic law enforcement.

Episode 2: Grumpy Muppets (with Dahlia Lithwick) Dec 17, 2020

Episode 2 opens with a discussion of some of the unique challenges parents face over the holidays, and some things we've tried this year to smooth over some of the rough edges. We also chat a bit about our own experiences with Hanukkah growing up — and the book Steve got five years in a row on "book night."
We are then joined by Dahlia Lithwick, senior editor for Slate and host of the award-winning Amicus podcast about law and the Supreme Court. Stay for a wide-ranging discussion of Dahlia's unusual and remarkable career path, the professional and personal implications of the #MeToo movement in the courts, what it's like to have two teenage boys, and why she always calls Steve a "grumpy Muppet."

Episode 1: Infinite Diversity in Infinite Combinations Dec 09, 2020

Is this on? Karen and Steve Vladeck introduce their new podcast with a little bit of background, including a short history of their relationship, a brief introduction to their family situation (and their two daughters), the impetus for the podcast (including the unique challenges of working high-stress jobs while parenting during COVID); and the first of their regular weekly discussions of "Work Wins" and "Parenting Fails."

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