Show notes
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bmEOUWQ-MZU
International Human Rights Lawyer Dr. Curtis F. J. Doebbler discusses the destruction of the Middle East by outside forces and how international law must be applied to resolve the precarious situation.
Show Notes
Why the United States’ Use of Force Against Syria Violates International Law
American Hypocrisy on International Law
Court asked to rule Saddam detention unconstitutional
Websites
http://doebbler.net
https://twitter.com/cdoebbler
Books
http://cdpublishing.org
About Dr. Curtis F. J. Doebbler
Curtis F.J. Doebbler is an international human rights lawyer who since 1988 has been representing individuals before international human rights bodies in Africa, Europe, the Americas and before United Nations bodies. He is also an American lawyer authorized to practice before the courts of the District of Columbia in Washington, DC and several federal courts in the United States, including the Supreme Court of the United States.
Doebbler was born in 1961 in Buffalo, New York, and has American, Palestinian, and Dutch nationality.
He is known for his outspoken opposition to human rights violations by the U.S. government and his support of individuals in countries that have been subject to armed attacks by the United States. He has worked almost two decades in Africa, Asia, and the Middle East teaching international human rights law and representing individuals in human rights cases.
In the case of the former Iraqi leader Saddam Hussein, Doebbler argued before the Iraqi Special Tribunal that the court was illegal and did not respect human rights.
He has made representations before the UN Human Rights Council and at numerous side-events of the Council calling for an impartial, fair and equal application of international human rights law and an end the selective punishment of human rights violators, especially by taking steps to end the impunity of powerful countries.
He has advised governments, including the Palestinian National Authority and the Hamas government.
He is currently Research Professor of Law at the University of Makeni, Department of Law in Sierra Leone and a visiting professor at Webster University in Geneva.
Interview Transcript
G & E Podcast: Dr. Curtis Doebbler is an international human rights lawyer who has represented governments, heads of state, and millions of refugees or displaced persons. He is also a professor who researches and teaches at a number of universities. He's constantly traveling between the US, Europe, Africa and the Middle East. We've currently caught up to him at the UN in New York. It's great to have you on the podcast Dr. Doebbler.
Dr. Doebbler: Nice to speak with you.
G & E Podcast: The Middle East has been in crisis since time and memorial, but there seems to be a renewal of tensions given the Syrian war of intervention, the Israeli/Palestine crisis, and the latest temple mount incident, the Saudi sponsored war in Yemen, and now fallout between GCC countries and Qatar due to what some say is Qatar's pursuit of more independent policies and desire to work with Iran. For the first part of this interview, I wanted you, somebody with great authority on this subject and who has skin in the game so to speak, who's on the ground, to give an overview of what you consider to be the main sources of chaos in the Middle East, who's destroying the Middle East? Is it US/EU intervention, Russian meddling, Israel, Saudi Arabia, the struggle between Wahhabism Sunni-Islam? What do you consider are the main driving forces behind the chaos and the human rights violations?
Dr. Doebbler: I think it's probably all of those that you've mentioned and maybe a few more. The Middle East, as many parts of the world, but particularly perhaps the Middle East because of it's geopolitical status over the last at least 100 years, perhaps the most complex geopolitical status of anywhere on the globe. It's been subject to a lot of forces and I would say mainly outside forces that did not always produce good, in part because they weren't concerned with the interest of the people in the Middle East.
If you look at the countries in the Middle East that have been destroyed, Syria, one of the most advanced countries in the Middle East, Iraq, a developed country, Libya, the richest country in Africa, an impoverished continent to a large extent, but the richest country in that continent was destroyed. All of those were destroyed by actions taken or promoted mainly be people outside our countries government outside the Middle East.
I think certainly there's a very strong element of outside meddling that has not contributed to the betterment and the development of the lives of the people in the Middle East. I find that very unfortunate. This body where I'm in today, the United Nations headquarters I think has made a half hearted effort to try to address these issues. I think it's right now in very grave danger of becoming part of the problem and the part of the problem where people will lose faith in it. If you remember, some of these problems were existing, in fact many of them, but some of the more longer standing ones were existing before the creation of the United Nations.
For example, the situation in Palestine, that predates the United Nations by quite a few years. It was on the agenda of the United Nations was created and I think it's unfortunate that it is something that has not now been resolved to date. The United Nations has put some time and energy into it, but they don't have a lot to show for that. I think these types of situations certainly indicate that there were a lot of outside forces at work, either promising solutions, or creating problems in these areas that has not been very valuable.
Having said that though, you can't absolve the people in any country of some degree od responsibility for their own fate. Palestinians as you know are right now the biggest enemy of Palestinians is probably each other. Hamas and Fatah are fighting against each other rather than Israel. In fact, they have a Golden opportunity right now to show the injustice of what Israel is doing, but often that opportunity is handicapped by one side not wanting to show that the other side is being treated unfairly. I think that's unfortunate.
One of the more recent examples that you mentioned is the example of Qatar where the problem in Qatar, although I think it had a hand from outside, but still you can certainly not absolve the countries involved that are pressing against them. I think in my view, I am not hesitant to say in I think a very unfair way, particularly I think that's shown mainly by the fact that one of the conditions that they want to impose on Qatar is the fact that they want to shut [inaudible 00:05:07], a media out. I can't imagine anywhere in the world a country that's not free or that is free that they would accept a condition that they close a media outlet, even their own state media, much less send a more independent one. That is something that the countries that are demanding that should be embarrassed of. Again, it's an example of how Middle Eastern countries are sort of feuding with each other.
G & E Podcast: You mentioned the UN and how it seemed to be losing its legs or influence. Can you tel us a little bit more about that with the recent developments in the recent years? What's happened at the UN and the level of enforcement it has or that it's lost?
Dr. Doebbler: As you know, there's been a lot of resolutions adopted, but very few of these resolutions have been implemented. At least when they don't have a strong country like United States behind it. For example, the resolution against Iraq in August 1991 was implemented, but it was implemented more because of the will of one of the major powers than it was because of the commitment to the standard to the rule of law. I think that that's unfortunate. I think that in fact, is one of the biggest problems that we have right now in the United Nations.
The United Nations is a body, like any international organization, whose heart and soul is its mandate. The mandate of the United Nations is a charter of the United Nations. It's not a country that has an army and political or that same type of political weight and monetary weight that a country has that it can throw around its political power. It is an international organization made up of a community of states in which the different states are technically sovereign equals, but at least have to balance different interests and where it should be able to move forward on areas of consensus. The area bar none that we have that we that we call consensus is international law, either customary international law or treaties. It has not been very successful in implementing the rules that are laid down in those treaties.
The right to self determination is in the UN charter. It's in the first article of two of the three instruments that make up the international bill of rights. Two treaties, legally binding documents signed by each over 160 countries, I should say ratified. State parties of over 160 countries of the United Nations states. Yet still we have Western Sahara where the international court of Justice of 1974 decided said that these people have the right to self determination. They've been giving that right. Again, that's almost two Arab states fighting with each other, the Palestinian people that have the right to self determination, had the right even before the creation of the United Nations and have still not had that right acknowledged.
I think these ongoing failures of the United Nations to ensure respect for the rule of law are eventually going to catch up with them as they do with any government or any body that cannot enforce its own internal rules.
G & E Podcast: You mentioned the right to self determination then if we could go back to Syria, what would you say to Syria and their right to making their own sove
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