Fathoms | An Enneagram Podcast

Latest Episodes:

Reflections | Aging: Holding Close and Letting Go Jul 06, 2023

Show notes

Wrapping up our mini-series on aging and personhood, the Fathoms hosts reflect upon our episodes with the wonderful and wise Clare Loughrige. They also look ahead to our upcoming conversation with poet/musician Andy Squyres, who has some major and important critiques of the enneagram.

Join our Marco Polo Sharecast: https://onmarcopolo.com/sharecast/dIT4N10HbBKn

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Fathoms | An Enneagram Podcast: “Discovering our inner depths, one fathom at a time.”

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Co-hosts: Seth Abram, Seth Creekmore, Lindsey Marks, Drew Moser

Production/Editing: Seth Creekmore

Follow us on Instagram: @fathoms.enneagram
Follow Abram: @integratedenneagram
Follow Creek: @creekmoremusic
Follow Drew: @typetrailenneagram
Follow Lindsey: @lindseyfaithdm

Interview | Aging: A Meditation on Grief & Letting Go with Clare Loughrige Jun 29, 2023

Show notes

In this episode, we have the second of our 2 part conversation with enneagram author and teacher Clare Loughrige. Lindsey talks with Clare about the aging process and how it impacts the dynamics of personhood, especially the “Third Act” of life. Stick around to the end of this one, as Clare provides a specific encouragement for each type and a profound meditation on our futures.

[0:40] The most productive years of our lives…it’s later than you think

[6:05] On fear about growing older

[16:40] Your enneagram type’s various expressions in different seasons of life

[22:00] The wisdom and power of wrinkles to free people

[25:00] The biases against aging

[29:30] An encouragement for each enneagram type in the third act of life

[37:30] Clare leads us through a meditation for our futures . . . our third acts.

Follow Claire’s work: scottandclareloughrige.org. And buy her books!

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Fathoms | An Enneagram Podcast: “Discovering our inner depths, one fathom at a time.”

—

Co-hosts: Seth Abram, Seth Creekmore, Lindsey Marks, Drew Moser

Production/Editing: Seth Creekmore

Follow us on Instagram: @fathoms.enneagram
Follow Abram: @integratedenneagram
Follow Creek: @creekmoremusic
Follow Drew: @typetrailenneagram
Follow Lindsey: @lindseyfaithdm

Interview | Aging: The Gift of the Third Act with Clare Loughrige Jun 27, 2023

Show notes

In this episode, we have the first of an incredible 2 part conversation with enneagram author and teacher Clare Loughrige. We talk to Clare about the aging process and how it impacts the dynamics of personhood, especially the “Third Act” of life. Have a listen and be on the lookout for part 2 of this series later this week.

[1:40] How Western culture exalts youthfulness, and what to make of this in light of the enneagram’s popularity.

[4:30] The reduction of the enneagram to listicles and the vast wisdom the enneagram truly provides

[6:45] The challenge and the possibility of introducing the enneagram too early.

[7:50] The transition from mentee to mentor

[10:00] The key questions of life’s Third Act

[12:50] Clare’s crash and burn moment

[17:45] The fragility and wisdom that comes with being nearer to death

[24:10] Discussing the “Third Acters” potential for growth and transformation

[29:15] On FLOW in the Third Act of life

Follow Claire’s work: scottandclareloughrige.org. And buy her books!

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Fathoms | An Enneagram Podcast: “Discovering our inner depths, one fathom at a time.”

—

Co-hosts: Seth Abram, Seth Creekmore, Lindsey Marks, Drew Moser

Production/Editing: Seth Creekmore

Follow us on Instagram: @fathoms.enneagram
Follow Abram: @integratedenneagram
Follow Creek: @creekmoremusic
Follow Drew: @typetrailenneagram
Follow Lindsey: @lindseyfaithdm

Reflections | Chronic Illness: Embracing Limitation Jun 22, 2023

Show notes

In this episode, the Fathoms hosts reflect upon our previous two episodes focused on chronic illness. If you haven’t listened to our conversations with Brook Gurrad and K.J. Ramsey, stop what you’re doing right now and have a listen. The hosts also ask for your help on an upcoming episode, and introduce our next topic we’re exploring in this season.

[1:05] Our insights gained and reflections on chronic illness and personhood.

[8:00] Implications for chronic illness and our enneagram type/style, and a healthier approach to growth/development/improvement

[15:00] Can people change?

[16:00] PLEASE HELP US WITH OUR UPCOMING EPISODE ON EGO AND ESSENCE

[19:00] Introducing our next topic: Aging and Personhood.

[24:00] Aging vs. maturing

[25:30] Cultural messaging for women and men regarding body image

DM us with any thoughts, ideas, or questions for our upcoming ego and essence episode.

OR, leaves us a recording on SpeakPipe: www.speakpipe.com/fathomspodcast

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Fathoms | An Enneagram Podcast: “Discovering our inner depths, one fathom at a time.”

—

Co-hosts: Seth Abram, Seth Creekmore, Lindsey Marks, Drew Moser

Production/Editing: Seth Creekmore

Follow us on Instagram: @fathoms.enneagram
Follow Abram: @integratedenneagram
Follow Creek: @creekmoremusic
Follow Drew: @typetrailenneagram
Follow Lindsey: @lindseyfaithdm

Bonus | 100 Episodes & an Announcement Jun 15, 2023

Show notes

In this episode, the Fathoms co-hosts, are joined by Lee Fields and Milton Stewart to celebrate Fathoms’ 100th episode and to announce and exciting new partnership with the IEA as temporary hosts of the International Enneagram Association Podcast for this year’s global conference. Listen as they all share what this year’s theme, “Unite & Ignite,” mean to them within the Enneagram community and what they are most looking forward to at the conference.

“I love the Enneagram because it’s a tool for liberation.” - Milton [02:41]

“In relation to what we’ve been building for the past three years of Fathoms, how wide and complex it is to be human, and how the Enneagram is such a beautiful tool to help us navigate that, and I’m looking forward to adding more complexity and seeing how the Enneagram stands up” -Creek [14:16]

“Why is there this factioning, why is there this othering between the new guard and the old guard? What’s up? And it seems like it could be fixed with two lines of dialogue. What needs to happen? And I don’t believe that I’m the secret sauce that’s going to fix all of that, but I believe that naming it and doing something about it and striving to have connections between people is going to be the thing that’s going to do it.” -Lee [19:31]

“Especially in the Enneagram space, we spend so much time looking at ourselves and I feel like this is an opportunity to really look each other in the eye and to see one another more clearly.” -Lindsey [23:34]

“When I think of these United & Ignite, it makes sense to me that we have to come together to experience the fire.” -Abram [30:22]

“I think some of the most meaningful conversations I’ve ever had have been around a campfire and I think that’s a good way to approach a conference like this. It’s kinda like a global campfire of Enneanerds and Enneagram professionals.” -Drew [31:52]

TIMESTAMPS

[00:00] Intro

[01:05] This week’s hosts

[04:59] Icebreakers

[12:13] Most excited at the IEA conference

[21:08] What unite and ignite means

[33:38] Rapid fire questions

Connect with us:

IEA2023.com

Milton Stewart:

IG: @kaizencareers

Web: KaizenCareers.com

Web: Kaizen Enneagram Academy

Pod: Do It For The Gram: An Enneagram Podcast

Seth "Creek" Creekmore:

IG: @_creekmore

Pod: Fathoms | An Enneagram Podcast

Pod: Awareness to Action Enneagram Podcast

Pod: Delusional Optimism with Dr. B

Seth Abram:

IG: @integratedenneagram

Pod: Fathoms | An Enneagram Podcast

Drew Moser:

IG: @typetrailenneagram

Pod: Fathoms | An Enneagram Podcast

Lindsey Marks:

IG: @lindseyfaithdm

Pod: Fathoms | An Enneagram Podcast

Lee Fields:

Web: enneagrammatic.com

IG: @enneagramatic

Interview | Chronic Illness: Becoming An Empathetic Witness with KJ Ramsey Jun 08, 2023

Show notes

We continue the conversation on chronic illness and personhood with our friend, the brilliant author and therapist, K.J. Ramsey. K.J. offers profound and practical wisdom on suffering and chronic illness, and she's ennea-fluent. Her books include:

This Too Shall Last: Finding Grace When Suffering Lingers
The Lord is My Courage: Stepping Through the Shadows of Fear to the Voice of Love
Book of Common Courage

[1:45] What K.J. had for breakfast this morning.

[2:30] Linz nerds out with KJ on all things Michigan and Tennessee

[4:50] K.J.’s experience with and relationship to suffering.

[9:00] K.J.’s complicated relationship with “self care” & needs as signals

[12:15] K.J.’s journey as an enneagram Type 4

[15:05] Pain as a witness

[20:40] The importance of being brutally honest and looking inward

[26:30] The importance of language (poetics) as it relates to our stories of pain and suffering

[32:00] How we can redeem our language when talking about our bodies

[36:00] A practical & somatic example, with Linz as volunteer, of how to have a conversation with our bodies

[44:00] How to hold “positive” language (like hope) in a healthy way

[48:45] Hope as a team sport

[53:00] Managing emotions alongside chronic illness

[1:03:00] K.J. reads an excerpt from her most recent book, The Book of Common Courage

Follow K.J.’s work (and buy her books!): @kjramseywrites on social media and www.kjramsey.com

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Fathoms | An Enneagram Podcast: “Discovering our inner depths, one fathom at a time.”

—

Co-hosts: Seth Abram, Seth Creekmore, Lindsey Marks, Drew Moser

Production/Editing: Seth Creekmore

Follow us on Instagram: @fathoms.enneagram
Follow Abram: @integratedenneagram
Follow Creek: @creekmoremusic
Follow Drew: @typetrailenneagram
Follow Lindsey: @lindseyfaithdm

Interview | Chronic Illness: When Health Means Standing Still with Brooke Gurrad Jun 01, 2023

Show notes

Interview | Chronic Illness: When Health Means Standing Still with Brooke Gurrad

In this episode, we interview Brooke Gurrad of The Bonus Years Podcast. Brooke is an important voice in telling the story of those who live with chronic illness. She has profound wisdom to share about the dynamics of personhood for chronically ill persons and how to see and live as whole persons when life doesn’t go as planned.

[1:00] Brooke’s favorite memory of Lindsey

[3:00] A bit about The Bonus Years Podcast

[8:45] On the stakes of having a podcast that isn’t “easy to digest”

[10:15] Brooke’s story of chronic illness(es)

[19:00] Navigating the enneagram, chronic illness, and the dynamics of personhood

[23:45] What does it look like to see others as whole people?

[27:20] How Brooke’s story with chronic illness brought forward her personhood?

[31:40] The people groups that the enneagram does not serve well (and her career as a bowler!)

[37:15] Brooke cautions against some ableist tendencies in “personal growth”

[42:00] How Brook practically approaches suffering

Follow Brooke’s work and the community she leads on Instagram and Facebook: @thebonusyears. Check out her coaching and writing work at www.brookegurrad.com. And listen and subscribe to her podcast, The Bonus Years, on all major podcasting platforms.

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Fathoms | An Enneagram Podcast: “Discovering our inner depths, one fathom at a time.”

—

Co-hosts: Seth Abram, Seth Creekmore, Lindsey Marks, Drew Moser

Production/Editing: Seth Creekmore

Follow us on Instagram: @fathoms.enneagram
Follow Abram: @integratedenneagram
Follow Creek: @creekmoremusic
Follow Drew: @typetrailenneagram
Follow Lindsey: @lindseyfaithdm

Reflections | Race: The Bypassed and The Bypassing May 25, 2023

Show notes

Reflections | Race: The Bypassed and The Bypassing

Co-hosts: Seth Abram, Seth Creekmore, Lindsey Marks, Drew Moser

Production/Editing: Seth Creekmore

Follow us on Instagram: @fathoms.enneagram
Follow Abram: @integratedenneagram
Follow Creek: @_creekmore
Follow Drew: @typetrailenneagram
Follow Lindsey: @lindseyfaithdm

Interview | Race: Living by the Platinum Rule with Dr. Deborah Egerton May 18, 2023

Show notes

In this episode, we interview Dr. Deborah Egerton (Dr. E). Dr. E is a Diversity, Equity, & Anti-racism Specialist, Author, Executive Coach, Keynote Speaker, and Culture Transformation & Leadership Development Expert. Dr. E. brings all kinds of brilliance and new insights on the enneagram

[1:40] When’s the last time Dr. E’s had a good belly laugh?

[6:30] About Dr. E’s book Know Justice, Know Peace

[10:50] Dr. E’s perspective as a Black woman in the enneagram space

[16:40] On loneliness and the current state of the enneagram community

[21:10] Dr. E’s vision of a humanity mosaic

[38:30] The Platinum Rule

[40:40] An example of a well-intentioned but counterproductive attempt to apply the Golden Rule

[45:30] How can we challenge others appropriately?

[50:50] The centers of intelligence as bridge builders, healers and defenders

Follow Dr. E’s work : https://www.deborahegerton.com/ and buy her book Know Justice, Know Peace!

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Fathoms | An Enneagram Podcast: “Discovering our inner depths, one fathom at a time.”

—

Co-hosts: Seth Abram, Seth Creekmore, Lindsey Marks, Drew Moser

Production/Editing: Seth Creekmore

Follow us on Instagram: @fathoms.enneagram
Follow Abram: @integratedenneagram
Follow Creek: @_creekmore
Follow Drew: @typetrailenneagram
Follow Lindsey: @lindseyfaithdm

Interview | Race: Embracing our Armor with Chichi Agorom May 16, 2023

Show notes

In this episode, we continue our series on race and the enneagram and interview Chichi Agorom, author of the brilliant book, The Enneagram for Black Liberation.

[0:45] What’s energizing Chichi right now?

[3:00] The importance of considering the collective, not just the individual, when using the enneagram

[7:35] A bit about Chichi’s Nigerian background

[9:10] What’s challenging about being from a collectivist culture

[11:00] The difference between individualism and individuality

[14:00] What Chichi wishes people truly understood about the enneagram

[18:15] The role that our armor plays in our lives

[25:45] If our type/strategy is armor, is it ever ok to get rid of it?

[29:30] On the concept of “centered”

[33:30] On the importance and nuance of vulnerability . . . and the role privilege plays

[37:50] Chichi turns the tables and asks us about our armor

[49:00] What can listeners do to increase understanding of the collective?