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    Face-Off

    The nuclear age began in secrecy and scientific ambition. The story is familiar, but its implications have never left us. A bomb created in a moment of wartime urgency became the foundation of a global order defined by terror and deterrence. But what happens when that global order breaks down?

    Face-Off: Nuclear Anarchy is an 8-part series tracing the arc of nuclear danger from the Manhattan Project to the Cuban Missile Crisis to the abandonment of the New START treaty and the shattering of the nonproliferation order today. We take you behind the scenes of key moments and key places of the nuclear story to shed light upon the present.

    In each episode, Pulitzer-winning journalist Jane Perlez interviews leading participants in the nuclear conversation: David Sanger, Tong Zhao, Rose Gotemoeller, Alex Wellerstein and more. Plus, Matthew Bunn, of Harvard’s Managing the Atom project, joins for a wrap-up segment to put everything in context. 

    We are living in a more crowded and unstable nuclear world—where proliferation spreads not through ideology or conquest, but through fear, hedging, and the collapse of confidence. Face-Off asks who will hold the line, and for how long? 

    Episodes out every Tuesday in October & November 2026. 

    This project is made possible by the Belfer Center at the Harvard Kennedy School and the Managing the Atom Project. Our special guest is Professor Matthew Bunn, Faculty Chair of the Managing the Atom Project (@matthew-bunn.bsky.social).

    Face-Off is produced and reported by Jane Perlez. Our production team is Nina Porzucki, Louise Morris, and Frank Zhou. Sound design and mixing by John Myers and Rowhome Productions.

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    Copyright: © Airwave Media 2024

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    Latest Episodes:
    Introducing Face-Off: Nuclear Anarchy? Sep 22, 2026
    Show notes

    The nuclear age began in secrecy and scientific ambition. The story is familiar, but its implications have never left us. Face-Off: Nuclear Anarchy is an 8-part series tracing the arc of nuclear danger. A bomb created in a moment of wartime urgency became the foundation of a global order defined by terror and deterrence. But what happens when that global order breaks down?

    This season, we take you back inside the Manhattan Project and a decimated Hiroshima in the hours after the blast. We retrace the Cuban Missile Crisis and the abandonment of the New START treaty with a Pulitzer Prize-winning historian and the State Department decision-makers in the room. We follow China’s rapid expansion, Russia’s threats, Ukraine’s lost deterrent, and the outliers challenging the world’s nuclear order.

    In each episode, Pulitzer-winning journalist Jane Perlez interviews leading participants in the nuclear conversation: David Sanger, Tong Zhao, Rose Gottemoeller, Alex Wellerstein and more. Plus, Harvard Kennedy School Professor Matthew Bunn joins for a wrap-up segment to put everything in context. Episodes out every Tuesday in October & November 2026. Listen wherever you get your podcasts.

    This project is made possible by the Belfer Center at the Harvard Kennedy School and the Managing the Atom Project. Our special guest is Professor Matthew Bunn, Faculty Chair of the Managing the Atom Project (@matthew-bunn.bsky.social).

    Face-Off is produced and reported by Jane Perlez. Our production team is Nina Porzucki, Louise Morris, and Frank Zhou. Sound design and mixing by John Myers and Rowhome Productions.

    Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices


    Trump’s War, Xi’s Opportunity: Ambassador Nicholas Burns on Iran’s Hot War Apr 21, 2026
    Show notes

    As this episode is published - on April 21, 2026 - it’s far from clear which direction the war between the US and Iran is headed. Even so, America’s reputation around the world is in decline, to say the least.

    Trump is unrestrained. He’s invaded Venezuela. Started a war like no other with Iran. Soured relations with traditional US allies in Europe. And not to mention the heavy tariffs he’s imposed across the globe.

    Trump and Xi Jinping are supposed to meet in a delayed summit in Beijing this spring. What is Beijing thinking? How might China capitalize on this very rocky moment?

    With so much at stake, we turn to someone who has often been at the forefront of diplomacy: Nicholas Burns, the former US Ambassador to China under President Biden.

    Our conversation was recorded on April 10th, which is important to note as the news is moving fast, very fast.

    ***PLEASE TAKE OUR AUDIENCE SURVEY*** It only takes a minute and will help guide the future of Face-Off: https://bit.ly/faceoffsurvey

    Face-Off: The U.S. vs. China is produced in partnership with ⁠Rowhome Productions⁠.

    Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices


    Climbing the Great Firewall: Freedom, Censorship, and China’s Internet Apr 07, 2026
    Show notes

    In this episode, we take you inside the Chinese internet.

    China is currently home to the world's most sophisticated, far-reaching internet censorship regime. Chinese censors are trained to comb the web for off-limits words and phrases. Offending posts often disappear into thin air. And entire US-based platforms like Google, Youtube, Instagram, and Amazon, not to mention the New York Times are all banned.

    But it’s one thing to talk about the regime and another to live under it. That’s the subject of a great new book, The Wall Dancers: Searching for Freedom and Connection on the Chinese Internet by Yi-Ling Liu. Yi-Ling is an American reporter based in Hong Kong.

    So today on Face-Off, we hand over the mic to our Associate Producer Frank Zhou for a fascinating conversation with Yi-Ling Liu.

    Guest: Yi-Ling Liu, Writer & Editor covering AI and Chinese society

    Further Reading:

    The Wall Dancers: Searching for Freedom and Connection on the Chinese Internet https://www.yi-lingliu.com/the-wall-dancers

    ***PLEASE TAKE OUR AUDIENCE SURVEY*** It only takes a minute and will help guide the future of Face-Off: https://bit.ly/faceoffsurvey

    Face-Off: The U.S. vs. China is produced in partnership with ⁠Rowhome Productions⁠.

    Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices


    How Far Will China Go for Iran? Mar 24, 2026
    Show notes

    This week: China and Iran.

    The two countries have close ties and, yet, while China initially condemned the US-Israeli war on Iran, the Chinese government has stayed mostly quiet even as the bombing continues.

    Meanwhile the Iranian government is doubling down on this friendship. As of this taping, Iran has opened up the Strait of Hormuz to Chinese ships.

    To learn more about what this all means, Jane interviews Yun Sun, a Senior Fellow at the Stimson Center in Washington where she focuses on China’s relations with other authoritarian regimes. In her most recent article in Foreign Affairs - entitled “Why China Won’t Help Iran” - she points out that China is Iran’s most important partner in the Middle East. But she questions, how important is Iran to China?

    Guest: Yun Sun, Senior Fellow & Director of the China Program, Stimson Center

    Further Reading:

    Why China Won’t Help Iran by Yun Sun, Foreign Affairs: https://www.foreignaffairs.com/china/why-china-wont-help-iran

    ***PLEASE TAKE OUR AUDIENCE SURVEY*** It only takes a minute and will help guide the future of Face-Off: https://bit.ly/faceoffsurvey

    Face-Off: The U.S. vs. China is produced in partnership with ⁠Rowhome Productions⁠.

    Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices


    Stolen in China, Raised in Texas: Twins Caught Between Two Superpowers Mar 17, 2026
    Show notes

    In this episode, Journalist Barbara Demick talks with Jane about her latest book Daughters of the Bamboo Grove. It’s the story of Chinese twins separated as toddlers. One twin grows up with her family in rural China. The other twin is adopted by an American family in Texas. It’s a haunting, moving narrative about the harsh repercussions of the One-Child policy, and the realities of life in rural China and rural America.

    Barbara and Jane know each other from their time together as reporters in China. They both lived in Beijing - Barbara the bureau chief for the Los Angeles Times, Jane the bureau chief of the New York Times. Jane thought of her as one of the bravest reporters - always fearless and open to getting the stories of real people.

    Daughters of the Bamboo Grove is another example of her excellent reporting and her unique ability to shine a light on the lives of ordinary people.

    Guest: Barbara Demick, author & journalist, former bureau chief in Beijing for the Los Angeles Times

    Book Recommendations:

    Daughter’s of the Bamboo Grove byBarbara Demick

    *Also, we want to hear from you! We have a listener survey that takes less than a minute and we would love to hear your thoughts. Fill out the survey here: https://bit.ly/faceoffsurvey


    Face-Off: The U.S. vs. China is produced in partnership with ⁠Rowhome Productions⁠.

    Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices


    The Black Box: Inside China’s Military Mind Mar 03, 2026
    Show notes

    We’re back! We’ll be publishing five brand new episodes of Face-Off bi-weekly starting today. In this episode, we welcome back Zhou Bo, a retired colonel in the People’s Liberation Army.

    Xi Jinping has unleashed a massive purge of the Chinese army, the biggest since the early days of Communist China. Nearly three dozen senior generals have been demoted or disappeared. Almost all have been accused of corruption. Then this past January the most senior general, General Zhang Youxia, essentially Xi Jinping's number two in the army, disappeared.

    No-one outside of China, and not many inside China, seem to know what’s going on. There's a reason the Chinese military is known as a black box.

    With Colonel Zhou, Jane discusses everything from Greenland to Taiwan to China’s military strength in the South China Sea.

    Guest: Zhou Bo, Retired Senior Colonel in the People’s Liberation Army

    Book Recommendations:

    Should The World Fear China byZhou Bo

    China’s Quest for Military Supremacy by Joel Wuthnow and Phillip Saunders

    Face-Off: The U.S. vs. China is produced in partnership with ⁠Rowhome Productions⁠.

    Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices


    The Chip Whisperer Jan 20, 2026
    Show notes

    Jensen Huang built the company that powers the AI revolution—and he's playing both Washington and Beijing. The Taiwan-born Nvidia CEO holds the keys to artificial intelligence. But whose side is he really on? Inside the rise of tech's most important power broker.

    Guest: Tripp Mickle New York Times Tech Reporter

    Book Recommendations

    The Thinking Machine: Jensen Huang, Nvidia and the World’s Most Coveted Microchip by Stephen Witt.

    After Steve by Tripp Mickle


    Face-Off: The U.S. vs. China is produced in partnership with ⁠Rowhome Productions⁠.

    Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices


    The Charm Offensive That Isn't Jan 13, 2026
    Show notes

    As Trump trashes American soft power, can China fill the void? A top Chinese academic explains why Beijing struggles to win hearts and minds and why being feared isn't the same as being loved. Plus: How American influencers are going viral in China.

    Guest: Da Wei, Professor, Tsinghua University

    Book Recommendations

    Sparks: China’s Underground Historians and their Battle for the Future by Ian Johnson

    Other Rivers: A Chinese Education by Peter Hessler

    Face-Off: The U.S. vs. China is produced in partnership with ⁠Rowhome Productions⁠.



    Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices


    Clash on the High Seas Jan 06, 2026
    Show notes

    High-seas drama as Chinese warships hunt Filipino fishing boats in their own waters. Beijing is testing America's oldest Pacific ally with dangerous games of maritime chicken. With Philippine politics in flux, can Manila hold the line or will China fracture another US alliance?

    Guest: Marites Vitug, Filipino Journalist & Author, editor-at-large for Rappler and chair of the Journalism for Nation Building Foundation

    Reading Recommendations

    Rock Solid: How the Philippines Won Its Maritime Case Against China by Marites Vitug

    The U.S. and China Are One Misstep Away From Warby Chris Rosenbach and Chris Li
    Face-Off: The U.S. vs. China is produced in partnership with ⁠Rowhome Productions⁠.

    Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices


    The Rugby Gambit Dec 16, 2025
    Show notes

    The strangest geopolitical deal you've never heard of: Australia trades rugby league spots for an agreement not to make an agreement with China. Papua New Guinea's players get to compete Down Under and in return, China gets locked out of a strategic Pacific island. Sports diplomacy at its most serious.


    Guest: Oliver Nobetau, Papua New Guinea Government Lawyer & Fellow at the Lowy Institute


    Book Recommendations

    Lost In Shangri-La: A True Story of Survival, Adventure and the Most Incredible Rescue Mission of World War 2 by Mitchell Zuckoff

    If you are looking for other interesting books about China, do check out the China Books Review section of the Asia Society webpage at https://chinabooksreview.com/


    Face-Off: The U.S. vs. China is produced in partnership with ⁠Rowhome Productions⁠.

    Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices


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