Craft Beer & Brewing Magazine Podcast

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226: For Cantillon’s Jean Van Roy, Brewing Comes Naturally Feb 18, 2022

Show notes

History can be a heavy weight to bear. Being caretakers for a legacy and advocates for a tradition can win you credibility in small circles, but such victories seem inconsequential in the face of an industry and consumer tide that rolls toward simpler tastes. Cantillon, founded in 1900, survived the industry consolidation and shifting consumer tastes of the 20th century, when the number of Brussels lambic breweries dwindled from dozens to just one. While a cadre of diehards appreciated their adherence to tradition, it was the Jean-Pierre Van Roy’s decision to open as a tourist-focused museum that actually kept the business afloat.

When interest in craft brewing began to rise toward the end of the century, Cantillon saw ripples that broke into serious waves over the past couple of decades. Today, they stand at the pinnacle—not just as one of Belgium’s most respected lambic breweries, but also as one of the finest examples of artful brewing anywhere in the world.

In this episode, recorded in Cantillon’s second-floor tasting room, fourth-generation brewer Jean Van Roy recounts that storied past while discussing how the brewery has adapted to the current environment, embracing an energetic, winery-like approach to making beer. He discusses:

the necessity of keeping an active hand in the production of every beer
brewing in a living building that actively impacts the beer
following the vision of his family while discovering his own natural way to work
the turbid mash process using two boil kettles in the vintage 1800s brewhouse
picking up blending skills without learning them
utilizing long boils to decrease the cheesy flavors in aged hops
hop varieties used in Cantillon lambic
embracing the natural microflora
allowing Pediococcus to work by not pre-acidifying the wort
the ideal temperature range for lambic brewing and impacts of climate change
sustainability measures at the historic brewery
fruit philosophy and techniques
mixing wine lees and lambic in barrel-aged beers such as La Vie Est Belge
their sensory approach to fruit maceration

And more.

*This episode is brought to you by: *

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BSG (https://go.bsgcraft.com/Contact-Us) Support for this episode comes from BSG and Fermentis, the obvious choice for beverage fermentation. SafBrew LD-20 is a new all-in-one Saccharomyces Pastorianus yeast and enzyme blend designed to produce lower-carb, dry lager beers. SafBrew LD-20 is capable of high attenuation at low temperatures, making it the perfect choice for clean lagers with very low residual sugars. To harness the power of SafBrew LD-20, or to learn more about Fermentis’s range of fermentation solutions, get in touch with BSG at go.bsgcraft.com/Contact-Us

Old Orchard (https://www.oldorchard.com/brewer): Is your brewery struggling to source or afford berry ingredients? Historic heatwaves devastated U.S. berry crops, causing supply to dwindle and prices to skyrocket. That’s why brewers are switching over to Old Orchard’s craft concentrate blends, which mimic straight concentrates but at a better price point—and with more reliable supply. Is it any surprise that Old Orchard’s best-sellers are Raspberry and Blackberry flavors? Reclaim your margins and order your craft concentrates at oldorchard.com/brewer

Precision Fermentation (https://precisionfermentation.com/brewing): BrewMonitor, from Precision Fermentation, is the first real-time, comprehensive fermentation monitoring solution. It works with your existing fermentation tanks to track dissolved oxygen, pH, gravity, pressure, temperature, and conductivity in real-time, from any smartphone, tablet, or PC. BrewMonitor provides detailed insight into your fermentations that helps improve beer consistency, reduce tank-time, and increase overall efficiency–saving your brewery time and money. Get started for 30 days, risk-free. Visit precisionfermentation.com/brewing.

Ss Brewtech (https://www.ssbrewtech.com): From the rotatable pick-up tube on Rogue Brewing's pilot brewhouse to the integrated hopbacks on Sierra Nevada's twin prototyping brewhouses, Ss Brewtech has taken technology they invented working with world-renowned industry veterans and made them available to every craft brewer. To learn more about Ss Brewtech's innovation list, head over to SsBrewtech.com

Hop Revolution (https://www.hoprevolution.co.nz): If you’re looking for a direct partnership with an independent hop grower who is as fanatical about flavour and quality as you are, join the revolution! Hop Revolution’s only reason for being is sustainably farming and processing New Zealand’s most flavoursome hops. They get that great beer is not brewed to a past or a future ideal. It’s an ongoing journey of fresh thinking. Hop Revolution really is only here for your beer. Let them flavour your thinking stateside directly from Hop Revolution, or through Crosby Hops or Mill95. Learn more @ HopRevolution.co.nz.

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225: 3 Fonteinen’s Next Generation Is Going from Grain to Gueuze Feb 11, 2022

Show notes

Groomed by retired master blender Armand Debelder, a new generation has assumed the stewardship of the 3 Fonteinen lambic brewery and blendery in Beersel and Lot, Belgium. Their focus is on preserving their mentor’s approach to brewing, blending, and passion for the lambic tradition, while also looking for ways to root that product more deeply in its history and in its region.

Led by managing director Werner Van Obberghen and brewer Michaël Blancquaert, the 3 Fonteinen team has been navigating the rough seas of the pandemic, looking ahead to ambitious plans for expansion while working to maintain the reputation of 3 Fonteinen Oude Geuze. One project, now under way, is to brew lambic using heirloom wheat and barley varieties grown in the region by Pajottenland farmers.

In this episode recorded amongst the barrels of the famed lambic cellar, Van Obberghen and Lukas Van den Abeele—who has done extensive research on the grains—discuss that program as well as how it fits into Debelder’s vision for the future of 3 Fonteinen.

*This episode is brought to you by: *

G&D Chillers (https://gdchillers.com): For nearly 30 years, G&D Chillers has set the mark for quality equipment you can rely on. G&D stands above the rest as the only chiller manufacturer that engineers your glycol piping for free. G&D also stands alone as the only chiller manufacturer with an in house team of installers and engineers, with 30 years of real world, field labor experience in breweries, wineries and distilleries. Contact the total glycol system design experts today at gdchillers.com

BSG (https://go.bsgcraft.com/Contact-Us) This episode is brought to you by our friends at BSG. We all know that the best brewing results come from the best ingredients. BSG offers the largest variety of quality ingredients to create outstanding beers. BSG brings the best malt, hops and additives from around the world to your brewhouse. Their knowledgeable and dedicated staff comes from the brewing industry and can assist you in product consultation for your recipe formulation. Contact your dedicated sales or customer support rep, or become a customer at BSGcraft.com/BeACustomer

Old Orchard (https://www.oldorchard.com/brewer): Supply chain challenges are here to stay for a while, so why not trust the experts to handle freight for your ingredients? Old Orchard has partnered with a leading logistics firm in the craft beverage industry to transport your craft concentrate blends. When you order two pails or more of concentrate from Old Orchard, you qualify for freight quotes from various carriers and can stay up-to-date on the status of your shipment. To get started on a freight quote for craft concentrates today, head over to [oldorchard.com/brewer](oldorchard.com/brewer)

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224: Julia Herz of the American Homebrewers Association Connects the Dots Between Beer and Flavor Feb 05, 2022

Show notes

Julia Herz is only a couple months into her new role as Executive Director of the American Homebrewers Association, but she's long been a craft beer voice and advocate with deep experience in the realm of food and beer pairing. As the former Craft Beer Program Director for the Brewers Association, she developed a library of resources to help brewers understand the nexus of beer and food, and to increase the number and quality of occasions for beer drinking. Now, in her new role as head of the world’s largest association of homebrewers, she starts her next chapter thinking about how homebrewing, and craft beer in general, can mean more to even more people than it has in the past.

In this episode, Herz discusses:

The immediate challenges to homebrewing and long term goals
Connecting the professional and amateur sides of brewing
Thinking about flavor in a way that’s externally relatable
Understanding the food flavor triangle
Pairing strategies with bridges, links, hooks, and echoes
Developing a mind-palate connection and articulating a language of flavor
Overcoming flavor bias
Making brewing more relevant to those from all walks of like

And more.

“So many brewers are world-class sensory experts when it comes to beer, but I still want to see brewers come along and understand how to describe flavor and what their beers go with,” says Herz. “Winemakers do know how to do that. Winemakers are in that arena, day in and day out.”

*This episode is brought to you by: *

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223: Matt Sampson of Hacienda Believes in Flavor Over Style Jan 31, 2022

Show notes

Matt Sampson, director of brewing operations for Hacienda Beer and Door County Brewing in Wisconsin, never set out to be a brewer. The PhD chemist figured on life in a lab—but life had something else in store. He found his way into brewing through the side door—vaulting from a somewhat unique position as brand manager and QC tech. That led to cellar and brewing work. Now, years later, Sampson still manages the Hacienda brand while overseeing all brewing for both Hacienda and Door County.

Door County focuses on the reliable, tried-and-true craft standbys. Hacienda, meanwhile, is their hub of experimentation—where flavor and exploration are priorities—and their Milwaukee taproom is the best place to experience it.

In this episode, Sampson focuses on the Hacienda approach, where a focus on tropical flavor spans beer styles, from their high-volume hazy IPAs to their mixed-culture and spontaneous beers. Along the way, he discusses:

focusing on tropical Brettanomyces flavors over “barnyard”
fermenting directly in oak with Brett primaries
transitioning from grown and dreg cultures to commercial pitches
brewing spontaneously with a coolship in the Upper Midwest
foregoing aged hops to allow more tropical hop flavors to emerge
using hops directly in the coolship
understanding Michigan- and Wisconsin-grown hop flavors
taking a fruit-first approach to choosing blending stock
prepping cherries for beer maceration with a carbonic process
controlling THP in finished beer
the importance of dry-hopping every mixed-fermentation beer

And more.

*This episode is brought to you by: *

BSG (https://go.bsgcraft.com/Contact-Us) Support from this episode comes from BSG and The Malt Haus by Rahr. The Malt Haus is your online source for cool and exclusive Rahr Malting Co. gear that you can’t get anywhere else. T-shirts, hoodies, hats, socks, glassware, and even gear for your pets. Rep the malt you brew with and look sharp doing it! Take the tradition home at themalthaus.com

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222: Good Word’s Todd DiMatteo Goes Big on Little Beers Jan 26, 2022

Show notes

Todd DiMatteo never intended to head up the production side of Good Word Brewing and Public House in Duluth, Georgia, a suburb of Atlanta. However, after a rocky start with a previous brewer forced him to quickly step up to the brewdeck, he embraced the role with verve. Thankfully, his homebrew experience plus more than a decade serving beer at Atlanta’s legendary Brick Store Pub provided a palate and a point of view—two things that he’s leaned into while further developing Good Word’s beer program.

Small beers are a big deal for DiMatteo. Through collaborations and core brews, he routinely plays across the beer map—from “petite IPA” to Czech-style dark lager and English-style bitter. In this episode, he talks about the challenges and techniques to brewing small beers, including:

sharpening critical faculties to focus on constant improvement
finding inspiration in source material for beer styles
staying respectful of style and naming conventions, in part to keep styles alive and vibrant
key points for maximizing character and minimizing detracting notes in small beers
the value of decoction in low-ABV beers
evaluating ingredients and selecting them for flavor
using multiple lager and ale strains while remaining efficient from a production standpoint
spunding for natural carbonation

And more.

*This episode is brought to you by: *

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221: Jan Chodkowski of Our Mutual Friend Embraces Both the Bold and the Sublime Jan 18, 2022

Show notes

Denver’s Our Mutual Friend might be better known in brewing circles for their commitment to mixed-culture beers, but ask head brewer Jan Chodkowski, and he’ll admit to being a hophead. It’s no surprise, then, that the case of “palmares” on the brewery wall showcasing their GABF, World Beer Cup, and Craft Beer & Brewing awards is evenly split between funky farmhouse takes such as Saison Trystero and hoppy beers such as Inner Light, their Australian-style pale ale. However, their interest in experimentation doesn’t end there, and they’ve found an enduring customer base that goes along for the ride as they regularly play in polarizing styles such as smoked beer.

In this episode, Chodkowski discusses how they “toss customers into the deep end” with brash but deeply respectful takes on the farmhouse oeuvre from Northern Norway (such as their recent Stjørdalsøl dark smoked beer), a vast array of beers made with a variety of different mixed cultures, and a commitment to ingredient sourcing that informs everything they make.

Chodkowski specifically addresses:

Using alder wood to custom-kiln and smoke malt
Mixing smoked malts for depth in smoked beer
The impact of malt more than yeast in smoked farmhouse beer
Shifting to pils malt to let hops shine
Dry hopping just before terminal for brightness and polish
Evaluating and adjusting beers as regular practice
Fermenting colder with Chico yeast
Using various Brett strains to build layers of flavor
Using multiple commercial mixed-culture pitches for diverse blending stock, rather than a house culture
Using aged hops in farmhouse beers

And more.

*This episode is brought to you by: *

BSG (https://go.bsgcraft.com/Contact-Us) This episode brought to you by BSG and Rahr Malting Co., the home of fossil-free malt. Rahr’s headquarters in Shakopee, Minnesota is powered by renewable electricity. Malthouses and kilns are fed by an electrostatic boiler fueled by agricultural byproducts, much of which is waste from the malting process. By eliminating the use of natural gas, Rahr Malting Co. reduces CO2 emissions by 260,000 tons per year while filling 25% of the US brewing industry’s malt needs. Put the power of Rahr Malt in your beer at go.bsgcraft.com/Contact-Us

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220: Kyle Harrop of Horus Aged Ales Pushes the Edges of Adjunct Technique Jan 10, 2022

Show notes

If there was a Guinness world record for most beer collaborations, Kyle Harrop of Horus Aged Ales would surely hold it. The 400-plus beers Harrup has brewed with other breweries are even more impressive when you consider that brewing is still a side hustle for the full-time accountant.

Today, Horus Aged Ales is known as much for its collaborations as for the beers he brews and releases to club members from his small fermentation warehouse in Oceanside, California. However, one thing that defines all Horus beers is an aggressive yet nuanced approach to using adjunct ingredients.

In this episode, Harrop discusses the myriad of ways he and his collaborators employ adjunct ingredients in the pursuit of flavor, including:

building base beers with eventual ingredient additions in mind, for better balance
brewing barrel-aged beers to high finishing gravities for more robust aging
the best bourbon barrel ages and sources
developing a family of base recipes for aging and blending
developing Cryst-Ale, a barrel-aged beer made with 100 percent crystal malt
ingredient methods and variety selection for coffee, vanilla, and coconut
using difficult adjunct ingredients, such as nuts
pasteurizing for better longevity and flavor

And more.

*This episode is brought to you by: *

BSG (https://go.bsgcraft.com/Contact-Us) This episode is brought to you by BSG, exclusive distributors of Rahr Malting Co. Since 1847, Rahr malt has been a benchmark of quality and consistency for brewers, from the 19th century through today’s craft beer pioneers. Whether you’re creating classic lagers, resin-clouded hazies, or barrel-aged behemoths, inspired malts like Rahr North Star Pils, Malted Oats, and more are here to make your brewing dreams a reality. Get in touch today at go.bsgcraft.com/Contact-Us

Five Star Chemicals (https://fivestarchemicals.com): Have you heard of PBW Tablets? Yeah, that’s right, the PBW powder you’ve known and trusted is now in tablet form from Five Star Chemicals. Available in two sizes so you can use just one tablet in either 32 ounces or one gallon of water, to optimize your cleaning. Forget measuring, just add a tablet to water and quickly clean all stainless equipment, growlers, kettles, or carboys. Purchase on their website or your favorite homebrew supplier.

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219: For Firestone Walker Cofounder David Walker, Innovation and Collaboration Are in Craft Beer’s DNA Dec 31, 2021

Show notes

For this final episode of 2021, David Walker of Firestone Walker (Paso Robles, California) joins the podcast to talk about the brewery’s remarkable evolution—from the earliest days of making pale ale to getting lucky with 805 (and not screwing it up), and accelerating the innovation process in recent years with hop-forward series such as Luponic Distortion and Mind Haze. Walker shares his thoughts on everything from capital investment to risk management, fostering a culture of creativity and quality, and more.

As the brewery continues to grow toward their goal of a million barrels by the end of this decade, they continue to follow concurrent paths that might seem contradictory on the surface, yet they reflect the love, respect, and connection with the idea of craft beer and those fellow brewers who make it. From their small-scale club delivering beers to diehard customers in California to their annual Invitational festival, they continue to sweat the small stuff. Still, scale brings the ability to make bold, values-driven decisions like investing in environmental sustainability, and Walker talks about their moves to reduce water consumption and replace grid power with solar.

“American craft brewers brought flavor and innovation and disruption to a monolithic beer industry worldwide, and they changed the world of beer, and they changed the consumer,” Walker says.

*This episode is brought to you by: *

G&D Chillers (https://gdchillers.com): For nearly 30 years, G&D Chillers has set the mark for quality equipment you can rely on. G&D stands above the rest as the only chiller manufacturer that engineers your glycol piping for free. G&D stands alone as the only chiller manufacturer with an in house team of installers and engineers with 30 years of real world, field labor experience in breweries, wineries and distilleries. Contact the total glycol system design experts today at gdchillers.com.

BSG (https://go.bsgcraft.com/) This episode is sponsored by BSG CraftBrewing. Explore a whole universe of hop sensory with unique varieties like Cashmere, Comet, Triumph, El Dorado, and many more. Sourced directly from growers and processed at BSG’s FSSC-certified facility in Yakima to bring you only the very best hops, from farmer to fermenter. For contracting, spot sales, and more info, reach out to them at LetsTalkHops@bsgcraft.com

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218: Broken Strings’ Charles Frizzell Believes That More is More in Flavor-Forward Beers Dec 21, 2021

Show notes

Brewing is in the family for Broken Strings founder Charles Frizzell. His grandfather spent the better part of his brewing career at Puerto Rico’s Corona, and he grew up hearing the stories. Today, Frizzell brews very different beer, and at a very different scale, than his grandfather did. Yet doing it right is a matter of family pride.

Like many Florida breweries, Broken Strings is unapologetic about brewing flamboyant, flavor-forward beers, indexing first and foremost for customer happiness. Still, Frizzell is guided by a primary directive, no matter what style he’s brewing: to make beer that he’s proud of.

That mission gets tested when he brews their house Kölsch—via three decoctions—on their small three-barrel system. It’s tested even more when brewing creative “soda sour” beers based on soft drinks. Figuring out how to reconstruct the flavors—but with natural ingredients and in a way that works with the acidity, alcohol, and malt inherent in beer—is a true culinary challenge.

In this episode, Frizzell discusses how he builds and brews these flavor-forward beers, including:

strategically balancing extracts with fruit and purée, to maximize intensity without tasting and smelling synthetic
kettle-souring for clean and accessible acidity
how to get the most from pricey fruit and spices
using hop products to maximize yield on a small system
brewing like a chef

And more.

*This episode is brought to you by: *

G&D Chillers (https://gdchillers.com): What if you could chill your beer with a more efficient chiller? The Answer? G&D Chillers new Micro Channel Condensers! G&D’s Micro Channel Condensers are highly efficient in hotter regions, use a fraction of the refrigerant over traditional chillers which provides less opportunity for leaks and lower global warming potential. G&D Chillers’ Engineers are committed to green technology design, developing a more energy efficient chiller for the brewing industry. Contact G&D Chillers today at gdchillers.com

BSG (go.bsgcraft.com/T-45) Support for this episode comes from BSG CraftBrewing. Announcing a cool new product offering…T-45 lupulin enriched hop pellets. More efficient than T-90s, T-45 hop pellets contain a higher concentration of aromatic oils and bittering resins, with a reduced level of polyphenols and plant material. This means a big delicious hop flavor with fewer pounds per barrel, creating a more cost-efficient and sustainable beer production thanks to reduced wort losses. Supplies are limited – secure your order today at go.bsgcraft.com/T-45

Old Orchard (https://www.oldorchard.com/brewer): A brewery might have 99 problems, but your fruit supplier shouldn't be one. Old Orchard is already known for their quality concentrates, but they also pride themselves on consistent product and reliable supply. When brewers need assistance, Old Orchard is just an email, phone call, or even a text away. Based in Greater Grand Rapids, Michigan—better known as Beer City, USA—Old Orchard is core to the brewing community. To join their fruit family, learn more at www.oldorchard.com/brewer.

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217: North Park Beer’s Kelsey McNair Is Making Better West Coast IPA By Tinkering with Hazies Dec 12, 2021

Show notes

Kelsey McNair of San Diego’s North Park Beer still can’t quite fathom how the brewery walked away with two medals in IPA categories in the 2021 Great American Beer Festival—a silver for their Art Is Hard hazy IPA, and a bronze for their imperial IPA, Army of the Kinda Dead-ish.

On the surface, it looks improbable—while they’re both IPAs, their executions are very different. However, McNair says their exploration of hazy-IPA brewing techniques that made the medal for their imperial West Coast IPA possible. Specifically, he says it’s the reduction in heat and their move to minimize the amount of boiled hops that has led to marked change in the quality of their IPAs, regardless of style.

On the hazy side, Art is Hard doesn’t see hops until the fermentor (and when it does, they’re not your standard T-90 pellets). On the West Coast side, extensive use of late hopping and advanced hop products mean less vegetal matter and less cooked-hops flavors.

In this episode, McNair outlines their medal-winning approach, touching on:

building a better platform for hop flavor with pilsner malt
the benefit of lower-temperature hop stands
recirculating while dry-hopping with a whirlpool arm inside the fermentor
using Cryo, Lupomax, and Incognito to increase hop saturation
building hop blends
the non-linear nature of hop loads in relation to gravity
increasing bitterness in canned IPAs to extend their shelf life

And more.

*This episode is brought to you by: *

G&D Chillers (https://gdchillers.com): For nearly 30 years, G&D Chillers has set the mark for quality equipment you can rely on. G&D stands above the rest as the only chiller manufacturer that engineers your glycol piping for free. G&D stands alone as the only chiller manufacturer with an in house team of installers and engineers with 30 years of real world, field labor experience in breweries, wineries and distilleries. Contact the total glycol system design experts today at gdchillers.com.

BSG (https://bsgcraftbrewing.com/) This episode is brought to you by our friends at BSG. We all know that the best brewing results come from the best ingredients. BSG offers the largest variety of quality ingredients to create outstanding beers. BSG brings the best malt, hops and additives from around the world to your brewhouse. Their knowledgeable and dedicated staff comes from the brewing industry and can assist you in product consultation for your recipe formulation. Contact your dedicated sales or customer support rep, or become a customer at BSGcraft.com/BeACustomer

Old Orchard (https://www.oldorchard.com/brewer): The most common complaint about hard seltzers? They need more flavor. Extract alone is a weak flavoring agent and can leave a chemical aftertaste. But there's a better way. The craft concentrate blends from Old Orchard are packed with REAL FRUIT FIRST, no added sugars, and just enough natural flavor. Breweries are turning to Old Orchard concentrates for seltzer with more body, color, and aroma. Turn seltzer skeptics into supporters with seltzer that drinks like a beer. Get started at www.oldorchard.com/brewer.

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