Stay ConnectedThe Bold Calling podcast tackles the biggest sales challenges through conversations with the industry’s most forward-thinking minds.
From pipeline growth to AI, customer acquisition cost, to ever-evolving competitive landscapes, we’re tackling the question: What keeps you up at night?
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In this episode of Bold Calling, host Adam Sockel is joined by two industry heavyweights—Daisy Chung from Orum and Ernest Owusu from 6sense—to break down why context matters in cold calling. They share insights on using intent data, personalization, and AI-driven automation to drive better conversations and higher conversion rates.
🚀 Key takeaway: Buyers today expect more thoughtful, informed outreach, and sellers who call with context are the ones winning meetings.
What You'll Learn in This Episode:✅ Does context actually matter in cold calls? Ernest and Daisy debate the balance between preparation and execution. ✅ The difference between intent data and personalization—and how to use both effectively. ✅ How much pre-call research is too much? Finding the sweet spot between readiness and action. ✅ How AI and automation are reshaping sales prospecting—without removing the human touch. ✅ The importance of tonality and timing to build rapport fast.
🔥 Standout Quotes:🗣 Ernest Owusu on context vs. no context in calls: "Having context allows you to break down barriers, personalize your outreach, and engage prospects differently. But you can still be a phenomenal cold caller without it—it’s all about how you use the time you have."
🗣 Daisy Chung on making context exciting: "It's not just about knowing where someone went to school or where they work. It’s about how you frame that context to make it engaging and relevant."
🗣 Daisy on AI and automation in sales: "AI isn’t replacing reps; it’s removing manual work so sellers can focus on having more meaningful conversations."
🗣 Ernest on building the right call lists: "You don’t need to over-research—just know your persona, their challenges, and what’s happening in their industry. That’s enough context to open a valuable conversation."
Resources & Links:🔗 Connect with our guests:
🔗 Mentioned in this episode:
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In this episode of Bold Calling, Adam Sockel sits down with Allie Brotherton, Senior Sales Manager at Orum, and Nick Cegelski, co-host of 30 Minutes to President’s Club and co-author of Cold Calling Sucks and That’s Why It Works. Together, they dive into the increasingly critical topic of self-sourcing for account executives. From actionable tips to thoughtful strategies, this episode is a masterclass for any AE looking to take control of their pipeline.
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This episode is a treasure trove of advice for AEs navigating self-sourcing. Whether you're building lists, crafting cold calls, or asking for referrals, success comes down to preparation, consistency, and embracing discomfort. Tune in now to level up your sales game!
Welcome to the latest episode of Bold Calling, Orum's award-winning podcast. Today, we're explore modern demand generation and the art of nurturing leads effectively with two demand generation leaders: Sarah Reece, Head of DemandGen at Orum, and Chris Miller, Head of DemandGen at Warmly.
Key Topics Covered:1. Redefining Nurturing
Sarah’s hot take: “Nurturing used to mean dumping low-quality leads into email workflows. Today, it’s about resonating with your ICP and partnering with sales.”
Chris’s perspective: “Nurturing is a continuation of the brand experience. It’s about trust-building at every stage.”
2. Why Nurturing Matters
Marketing’s role doesn’t end at MQL—it’s about maintaining influence throughout the buyer’s journey.
The importance of “above the funnel” nurturing: 93-95% of your audience isn’t in-market at any given time.
3. Effective Nurturing Channels
Sarah: “Your brand channels—podcasts, blogs, webinars—are the most effective tools for creating trust.”
Chris: “Nurturing is context-dependent. Tailor your approach to the prospect’s journey.”
4. Aligning Sales and Marketing
The importance of collaboration: “Focus on the needs of the prospect, not departmental goals,” says Chris.
Sarah’s approach: Let sales take the lead in nurture touchpoints to make engagement more personal.
5. Quick Wins for Better Nurturing
Simplify: “Do less,” advises Chris. Overcomplicated workflows often lead to poor outcomes.
Personalize: Sarah suggests shifting from automated marketing emails to personalized sales outreach.
Use the phone: Real conversations build trust and gather valuable insights.
“Good nurturing is just good marketing. Marketing’s job isn’t done at MQL or awareness.” – Chris Miller
“Once we know who a prospect is, we should treat them like we know them.” – Sarah Reece
“93-95% of your audience isn’t in-market. Surround them with messaging for when their moment of need arises.” – Sarah Reece
Warmly – A platform for full-funnel orchestration.
Orum – The leading sales dialer for efficient and effective outbound calling.
Share it with your network and subscribe to Bold Calling for more insights into sales, marketing, and demand generation.
On this week's episode of the award winning Bold Calling podcast, host Adam Sockel sits down with Kevin Hopp, founder of Hopp Consulting Group and CEO of Calling Culture, to discuss why cold calling remains a powerful tool in a world obsessed with automation and AI.
Kevin shares his candid insights on the current state of sales development, debunking the myth that cold calling is a thing of the past. They delve into the nuances of outbound strategies, the role of AI in sales, and why businesses need to embrace a calling-first mindset for real human connection.
Key TakeawaysIf you're navigating the ever-changing landscape of sales development or wondering how AI will shape outbound, this episode is packed with actionable advice. Kevin Hopp’s expertise is a must-hear for SDRs, managers, and sales leaders who want to embrace smarter, human-centered strategies.
Resources MentionedLove the episode? Share it with your team and leave us a review! Want to dive deeper into sales development insights? Subscribe to Bold Calling for more conversations that matter.
In this episode of Bold Calling, Adam sits down with Michael Maximoff, founder of Belkins, to explore the evolving world of sales development and how SDR roles are shifting amidst advancements in AI, automation, and omnichannel strategies. They dive into Orum's 2024 State of Sales Development Report findings, touching on the increased demand for SDRs, shifts in sales pipeline responsibilities, and the critical alignment of sales and marketing functions.
Key Topics Discussed:
The Changing SDR Role
Omnichannel Outreach vs. Multichannel Marketing
The Power of the Phone in SDR Outreach
Balancing AI and Human-Centric Sales Strategies
Optimizing SDR Teams and Specialization
The Future of Sales Development
Key Quotes:
On Omnichannel Outreach: “Omnichannel isn’t just using multiple channels; it’s an integrated, step-by-step approach where each touch builds on the previous engagement, creating a seamless customer experience.”
On the Role of the Phone: "The phone is incredibly effective, but it shouldn’t be the first touchpoint. Using it as a third or fifth touchpoint after nurturing leads through other channels makes conversion rates three to five times higher."
On the Importance of Human Sales: “With AI, we’re seeing a rise in volume over quality. Brands that build real relationships with prospects and foster strong teams will ultimately stand out in a market flooded with automated outreach.”
Connect with Michael Maximoff:
Tune in to this episode for a comprehensive discussion on the modern SDR landscape and how sales teams can leverage both technology and human touch to create impactful outreach in today’s market.
In this episode of Bold Calling, Adam Sockel sits down with Troy Barter, Head of Revenue at Rocket Shipping, to dive into the nitty-gritty of sales development. Troy brings his extensive sales experience, from door-to-door hustle to tech sales strategy, to offer hard-hitting insights on the evolution of the SDR role, the power of resilience, and the real impact of sales development.
Key Highlights:
The Value of Perspective in Sales Development: Troy draws a powerful comparison between door-to-door sales and tech sales, emphasizing the “grit advantage” that field experience brings to SDRs. “When you’ve faced a hard ‘no’ in person, a cold call feels like nothing in comparison,” he says.
Changing SDR-AE Dynamics: Troy sheds light on how SDRs today are siloed from AEs, creating inefficiencies and reducing the perceived value of the SDR role. He argues, “SDRs should be incentivized on closed revenue, not just meetings scheduled. If SDRs aren’t setting up closeable pipeline, the model is broken.”
Leveraging Tech Without Replacing the Human Element: Troy warns SDRs not to rely too heavily on automation, as it threatens their job security. “If you use tools to replace what makes you unique as a salesperson, human SDRs will no longer exist.”
Career Pathing and SDR Motivation: Troy believes in promoting from within but stresses performance as the primary driver. For SDRs looking to move up, he advises a proactive approach: “Crush it at your current role, then ask to close smaller deals once you hit target—this shows you’re ready for AE responsibilities.”
Insightful Quotes from Troy Barter:
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In this episode of Bold Calling, presented by Orum, Adam Sockel sits down with Joe Fontana, the North American Sales Director for BuyerForesight, for a dynamic discussion on building high-performing sales teams, the importance of sales and marketing alignment, and how discipline plays a key role in sales success. With decades of experience in both leading and consulting for sales teams across a variety of industries, Joe brings a wealth of insights into the often-overlooked fundamentals of sales—human connection and discipline.
Key Takeaways from the Episode:The Power of Simplicity in Sales and Marketing Alignment One of Joe's biggest lessons throughout his career is the necessity of simple, clear communication between sales and marketing teams. He stresses, “Talk to me like I’m five until I tell you to stop.” By starting with the basics, Joe believes sales teams can understand the nuances of what marketing is doing and align on a cohesive strategy. According to Joe, salespeople should leave their ego at the door and focus on the common goal: reaching the right customers effectively.
Building Relationships Before the Pitch When it comes to prospecting, Joe advocates for an authentic, relationship-first approach. Whether it’s at executive dinners or during one-on-one interactions, Joe emphasizes the importance of earning the right to pitch. He says, “You can’t put a price on human interaction and authenticity because that’s all sales is—just a series of conversations between someone who has a problem and someone who can solve it.”
Sales Teams Must Learn Discipline and Structure Joe also highlights the importance of personal discipline, noting how his military background has shaped his structured approach to daily routines. He stresses the need for sellers to not only be well-prepared but also manage their time with intention. “I need to be disciplined and I need to be structured. I’m up every morning before 4:30 AM because I know that keeps me mentally sharp.”
Solving for Misalignment in Sales and Marketing One of the most frustrating challenges for Joe is when sales teams don’t take full advantage of the high-quality prospects that marketing delivers. He shares how he often finds marketers frustrated by sales reps who don’t fully understand their ICP or don’t utilize the materials they’re given. His advice? Sales teams need to start seeing marketing as a valuable partner rather than an obstacle.
Joe Fontana brings real talk to the table, offering a candid view of what really works in sales development, pipeline building, and team collaboration. With practical advice for both sales leaders and individual contributors, this episode is a must-listen for anyone who wants to learn how to build a sustainable and scalable sales team. Whether you’re struggling with sales and marketing alignment or looking for ways to improve your personal sales discipline, Joe’s insights will leave you with plenty to think about—and implement.
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Connect with Joe Fontana:
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In this episode of Bold Calling, Adam Sockel is joined by Leslie Venetz to dive deep into sales development strategies for 2025, backed by insights from Orum’s second annual State of Sales Development report. Leslie, with her years of expertise in sales, shares actionable advice on improving outbound strategies, reducing customer acquisition costs (CAC), and shortening sales cycles.
Leslie stresses the importance of an omnichannel approach to outbound sales, explaining how a multi-touch, multi-channel, and multi-media strategy is essential to meeting prospects where they are. The episode also breaks down some of the key findings from the report, including the rising use of social channels and video in sales outreach.
Throughout the conversation, Leslie challenges outdated sales norms, such as spending excessive time researching individual prospects, and offers a fresh perspective on AI’s role in the future of sales development. She advocates for AI as a tool to assist, not replace, salespeople, urging organizations to leverage AI for automating low-value tasks while keeping the human touch at the forefront.
This episode is a goldmine for sales leaders looking to optimize their teams for the challenges of 2025, from balancing the roles of sales, marketing, and customer success, to creating more personalized and effective outbound strategies.
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In this episode of Bold Calling, presented by Orum, we sit down with Charles Needham, Manager of Revenue Operations and Business Development at Fetch. Charles shares his fascinating journey from Wall Street and private equity to leading sales development teams. He explains how his background in economics gives him a unique lens through which he approaches sales, helping his teams become more efficient and strategic in their outreach efforts.
Charles breaks down the role of risk in sales development, challenging the traditional focus on relationship-building. He argues that reducing uncertainty is key in today’s high-interest, high-risk environment. Charles also dives into how sales strategies must adapt to larger economic cycles, particularly focusing on efficiency and profitability over sheer volume-based tactics.
Join us as we explore the future of sales development, the importance of channel-validated outreach, and how tools like Orum are helping sales teams scale while improving outcomes. Whether in sales, operations, or leadership, this episode is packed with valuable insights to help you rethink your approach to modern sales.
In this episode of Bold Calling, Adam Sockel is joined by Michael Pedone, founder of SalesBuzz, to discuss his incredible journey from being a commission-only sales rep to building a seven-figure business.
Michael shares his insights into the importance of self-investment, overcoming cold calling reluctance, and why most salespeople don’t invest in their own development. Whether you’re new to sales or a seasoned professional, this conversation offers valuable takeaways on mastering the fundamentals and scaling your sales success.
Key Takeaways:
Michael's Sales Journey: From growing up poor with no college education to selling his first company for seven figures, Michael’s story is a testament to how dedication and continual learning can lead to success in sales.
Overcoming Call Reluctance: Michael offers practical tips for conquering the fear of cold calling, emphasizing the importance of following a simple process. As he explains, “You just need to learn what to say, how to say it, and when to say it.”
The Reluctance to Invest in Personal Development: Michael touches on a frustrating reality—many sales professionals refuse to invest in their own growth. He believes the key to long-term success lies in a willingness to learn and invest in yourself.
We've previously discussed how sales is a mix of science and art with Dee Acosta, but it's also equal parts freestyle and structure. It's "Yes, and" with just a bit of A/B testing.
Shaheem Alam has big thoughts on why outbound sequence order doesn't matter and even bigger thoughts on why you need to pick up the phone.
In this discussion, Shaheem and Adam get nerdy about relevance and curiosity while focusing on where sales leaders need to be more rigid and where they need to allow some flexibility within the sales process.
Check out https://fiveringsmarketing.com/ to learn about their business and connect with Shaheem on LinkedIn.
Chris Cicconi works with multiple organizations as a fractional sales leader, which has given him a nuanced understanding of revenue teams' minds. It takes a long time to earn trust, especially in a space where leaders and individual contributors are judged on their latest accomplishments and numbers.
Contrary to popular belief on platforms like LinkedIn, process change in sales takes time. It takes a concerted effort and willingness to be bold, especially when working with founders and early-stage start-ups.
Chris and Adam discuss how creating that genuine change from a tactical standpoint and a 20,000-foot mindset shift.
"Too much can mean not doing as well."
Will Aitken shares this truth with host Adam Sockel when breaking down his biggest challenge- Taking on too many opportunities.
A talented sales professional who found a knack for creating video content that other sellers connected with, Will has spent this year branching out on his own. While this has created endless potential partnerships and opportunities to work with creative brands and people, the biggest struggle for Will is what happens when he says "Yes" too often.
The conversation blossoms out from there, diving into Will's career as a content creator and seller, Adam and Will going deep on the importance of building trust during the sales process, and Will's endless love of cold calling.
Looking for more information on Will's work? Check out https://willaitken.com/. And visit https://www.orum.com/podcasts to view every episode of the Bold Calling podcast.
Ali is the Founder of Simple Strat and hosts the wildly successful HubSpot Hacks YouTube show. She joined the latest episode of Bold Calling to discuss how she consults organizations to navigate AI to ensure scalability, and her heightened awareness about shifting marketing strategies as a founder.
AI is constantly changing the tech stack sales and marketing teams are using, as well as the platforms where we traditionally learn more about customers and prospects, making it essential to find ways to stay in the know.
Dee Acosta, Senior Director of Sales and Strategic Growth at Modigie, joins Adam Sockel on episode three of the Bold Calling podcast to discuss how cold calling technology has gone from “nice to have” to “need to have” in the last 18 months.
They also discuss the role of positivity and fun in sales and the importance of building strong relationships between sales and marketing teams. They talk about the importance of giving positive feedback to build a cross-team culture, the impact of cold calling, the value of practical advice in content marketing, the essentiality of quality customer success, and Dee's ideal workday.
This special episode of the Bold Calling podcast is an audio version of Orum's new State of AI in Sales Development report.
AI has become a table-stakes aspect of the sales process, as 95% of organizations use AI in sales in some capacity (Salesloft). Sellers agree that it can sharpen their focus as 78% of sales professionals agree that AI can help them spend more time on the most critical aspects of their jobs (Hubspot).
The rise of AI in sales directly correlates with lengthening procurement procedures, with customer acquisition costs rising in the last 12 months (Orum). AI is designed not to replace seller but to optimize how they spend their time. Currently, sellers only spend 28% of their time selling (Salesforce), often spending 25-30 hours weekly on administrative tasks.
AI’s power is dependent on sellers' data enrichment capabilities. It works best to keep humans involved in the sales process rather than eliminate them. This is especially true in more complicated sales processes, where buyers prefer to speak with a human seller when nuance is involved in purchasing.
The future of the seller is directly related to the future of AI. They are intertwined, and while AI will likely replace some sales roles, it will ultimately create a better experience for buyers and sellers alike.
Jonathan Pogact, VP of Marketing at Seamless.AI, recognizes that the SaaS world moves quickly. Finding ways to ensure your prospects know who you are and what you do when they enter the sales cycle means being willing to take risks.
In this discussion, Jonathan and host Adam Sockel discuss how Seamless.AI carves out time for innovative thinking. They break down what data can inform marketing investment and how automation through AI empowers his team to spend more time on creative thought.
Experimentation can be the key to owning every situation your brand is in, partnerships can dramatically expand your audience, and inspiration can come from unlikely places.
The conversation ends with Jonathan sharing where that inspiration strikes him and how his TikTok FYP page brings him calm.
Anshul Gupta, Co-Founder of Actively.ai, delves into the practical applications of AI for outbound teams. He explains how this technology can significantly boost pipeline generation by freeing sellers from spending 20-30 hours weekly on mundane administrative tasks.
He then shares his biggest challenges as a tech start-up, beginning with knowing where to start, what tasks need his attention first, and how to triage obstacles as they come, given the reality of limited resources.
The show closes with Anshul sharing stories about childhood entrepreneurship and the years that laid the groundwork for his current role as a co-founder.
Check out orum.com to discover how Orum can help grow your pipeline.
Royalty-Free Music is provided by Tunetank.com. Track: Spy Adventures by TrendingAudio
Every two weeks, Bold Calling, the new podcast from Orum, will bring on leaders in the SaaS, tech, and AI industries to discuss their biggest challenges and how the innovative ways they're working to solve them.
Season one's theme is No Sleep 'Til Closed-Won and we'll center each discussion around a simple question with complicated answers.
"What keeps you up at night?"
The biggest influencers, revenue leaders, and founders work with Orum daily to build pipeline and elevate their productivity. Now, you have an exclusive seat at the table as they share their challenges and solutions to the problems we all face.
Opportunity is Calling, and fortune favors the bold.
Subscribe at Orum.com or wherever you get your podcasts.
Royalty Free Music from Tunetank.com
Track: Spy Adventures by TrendingAudio
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