Stay ConnectedJoin Joseph Scott Morgan every week as he explores a world that not many have had a chance to visit, the realm of death. Jo Scott will lead listeners on a journey through the blood soaked death scenes of America and then into the autopsy room to fully understand the science behind each case. Jo Scott is one America’s leading experts on applied forensics and is regularly featured on ‘Crime Stories with Nancy Grace’, ‘The Piketon Massacre’, Court TV and more.
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November 22, 1963: John F. Kennedy, the 35th President of the United States, was shot and killed during a presidential motorcade in Dallas, Texas.
The President is taken to Parkland Memorial Hospital. By law, Dallas County Coroner Dr. Earl Rose had jurisdiction over the case and should have performed the autopsy. However, against Dr. Earl Rose's protestations, the body of President Kennedy was wrapped in a sheet, placed in a casket with a broken handle, and flown over 1,300 miles away to Washington DC, where 2 naval doctors, who had never conducted a forensic autopsy performed the autopsy on John F. Kennedy.
Join Joseph Scott Morgan and Dave Mack as they take a close look at the autopsy that was so bad, 60years later questions are still being asked.
Time Code Highlights
00:01:21 Discussion about the ripple effect of the assassination of JFk
00:04:31 Discussion of the moments following the shooting of JFK in Dealey Plaza
00:06:02 Talk about how autopsy "Standard Procedures" were not followed
00:06:51 Texas state law and jurisdiction over investigation and autopsy
00:07:58 Board Certified Forensic Pathologist Doctor Earl Rose was chief medical examiner for Dallas, Texas at the time and was at Parkland Memorial Hospital
00:09:22 Discussion JFK body taken from Dallas to Washington DC for autopsy
00:10:59 Talk about Secret Service preparing for President trips.
00:11:36 Discussion of JFK physical condition after being shot.
00:12:52 Talk about injuries to JFK, at least 2 gunshot wounds.
00:13:31 Discussion of tracheotomy that was performed to establish an airway
00:15:04 Discussion of Dr. Earl Rose and how his experience was dismissed
00:16:23 Dr. Earl Rose KNEW he was looking at a Murder Investigation.
00:17:47 Discussion Dallas County had jurisdiction over the body.
00:19:03 Talk about autopsy of JFK should have taken place in Dallas
00:20:08 Talk about previous Presidential assassination, Lincoln, Garfield, and McKinley and their autopsies.
00:22:10 Discussion of Dr. Earl Rose did the autopsy for Oswald, Officer Tippit, and Jack Ruby.
00:23:36 Discussion of JFK body being taken to Washington DC
00:25:16 Comparing Bethesda Naval Hospital to Walter Reed Hospital
00:26:04 Discussion about doctors chosen to perform JFK autopsy
00:28:42 Talk about why doctors turned bullet wound into tracheostomy
00:29:55 Presidents body wrapped in sheets. Head wrapped in gauze
00:31:09 Discussion of JFK clothing, tie changed the trajectory of round.
00:32:58 Discussion about clothing worn during the assassination
00:33:44 Talk about "magic bullet" going through JFK and Governor Connally,
00:35:08 Discussion Secret Service agents washed interior of Presidential limo.
00:36:03 Talk about crime scenes - bone fragments found and turned in later
00:37:02 Description of President's head, skull came apart in doctors hands.
00:38:04 Discussion of Assessment
00:40:02 Talk about x-rays that were done on body
00:41:58 Description of the Bethesda autopsy suite
00:43:51 Ballistics expert Dr. Pierre Fink, forensic pathologist, came to Bethesda
00:44:53 JFK brain was removed before Dr. Fink arrived
00:46:05 Description of "Brain Loafing".
00:47:22 The autopsy of JFK was not a complete autopsy
00:49:21 Discussion of "family wishes" as it applies to the murder of the president.
00:50:48 Compare autopsy of John F. Kennedy and Robert F Kennedy
00:52:36 Discussion about other pathologists available to do autopsy on JFK
00:55:09 No way to know if other injuries suffered by JFK could have been lethal
00:56:04 Commentary - no excuse for what happened with autopsy of JFK
See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
Hanna Rhoden,15, gives birth to a daughter. 2-years later, Rhoden and the baby's father, Jake Wagner, fight over custody. A custody battle begins and the Wagner family pressures Hanna to give up her daughter. The Wagners hack Hanna Rhoden's Facebook account and read a private message in which Hanna vows she will not give up the child, quote "they (the Wagners) will have to kill me first." That is exactly what happens.
The Wagner family decide to not only kill Hanna Rhoden, but the rest of her family, anyone who might stand in the way of the Wagner family gaining custody of the little girl. The Wagner family plan is to take out the Rhoden family in one night, four locations, eight murders.
Join Joseph Scott Morgan and Dave Mack as they dig deep into the Pike County Murders. Joseph Scott Morgan gives a firsthand account of the crime scenes and the forensic evidence left behind.
Time code highlights:
00:00:02 Joseph Scott Morgan asked to take part as a forensic expert in a complex case
00:02:12 Discussion about the investigation of the Pike County Murders
00:02:37 Description: One night. Four Scenes. Eight Murders
00:03:09 Description of two families that have been friends a long time
00:03:16 Discussion about Hanna Rhoden becomes pregnant with Jake Wagner's baby when she is 15-years-old. Hanna Rhoden breaks up with Jake Wagner
00:04:01 The Wagner's tried to force Hanna Roden to sign papers to turn custody of Sophia over to Jake.
00:04:22 Discussion of Wagner family plan to kill Hanna Rhoden to get custody
00:05:01 Discussion of the first person to be murdered and location of murder scene
00:06:50 Discussion of shots fired through wall first, Chris Rhoden was shot 9 times
00:07:36 Discussion of second victim, Gary Rhoden, visiting from Kentucky
00:10:06 Talk about the injuries to Chris Rhoden's arm
00:11:01 Description of head shots to both Chris Rhoden and Gary Rhoden
00:12:24 Talk of how Wagner Sr said "I just killed my best friend"
00:16:25 The Wagner's didn't know Gary Rhoden would be at the scene
00:17:30 Discussion of the Wagner's make silencers for their weapons
00:19:38 Joseph Scott Morgan talks about being at the site and what it looked like,
00:21:56 The Wagner's arrived at Chris Rhoden's house barefoot but put on shoes inside the house.
00:22:44 Investigator researched shoe print found in Rhoden trailer and found a match
00:24:45 The forensic shoe print match the best evidence used to convict
00:25:34 Description of second murder scene. Frankie Rhoden, Hannah Gilley, and two small children.
00:25:26 Older child came to door (the next morning) and said "daddy's playing zombie"
00:27:10 Discussion of Hannah Gilley was shot 5 times in the head
00:30:25 Discussion of distance from Frankie Rhoden's house to Dana Rhoden home
00:32:37 Dana Rhoden's home was unlocked, Dana Rhoden's face was illuminated by her phone, made eye contact with Jake Wagner and he shot and killed Dana Rhoden
00:33:40 Discussion of Hanna May Rhoden being the reason for the murders
00:34:00 Discussion of Hanna Rhoden had baby 4 days earlier
00:34:15 The child Hanna Rhoden had with Jake Wagner was with the Wagner family at the time of the murders
00:34:35 Discussion of Jake Wagner placing baby next to body of Hanna May Rhoden so the baby could feed off the dead mother
00:36:01 Discussion of Hanna Rhoden and Hannah Gilley both shot 5 times in the head
00:36:45 Chris Rhoden jr, 16, shot dead in bed
00:37:45 Discussion of Kenneth Rhoden living in travel trailer 7 miles from the other scenes, shot once in head.
00:41:22 Discussion of Jake Wagner and his brother going to great lengths to get rid of weapons
See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
Over the last few years, more and more death scenes involve dismemberment.
An "obsessed" true crime fan in South Korea thinks she can pull off the perfect murder, so how did Jung Yoo-Jung get caught? Taylor Schabusiness tells police she doesn't remember strangling her boyfriend, but it felt good. She leaves his severed head in a bucket for his mother to find.
And in Tennessee, prosecutors say Joel Guy Jr created a "diabolical stew of human remains" with his mother's head when he finds out his parents are cutting him off.
Joseph Scott Morgan breaks down the forensics and Dave Mack keeps the stories moving in this fast-paced edition of Body Bags with Joseph Scott Morgan in front of a live audience at CrimeCon 2023 in Orlando, Florida
Time Code Highlights.
00:02:50 South Korean Woman Jung Yoo-Jung is said to be an obsessed crime fan
00:03:17 Discussion of how 23-year-old woman pretends to be a 14-year-old school girl
00:04:19 Jung Yoo-jung wants to commit a homicide and dismember the victim to try and get away with murder..
00:05:33 Her plan is to kill, dismember, and dispose of the victim.
00:06:27 Talks about the tools needed to do the job she wants to do
00:10:19 What would she used to clean up the area?
00:12:00 Talk about Gilgo and Rex Heuermann
00:12:44 Talking about the getaway and getting rid of the remains
00:12:57 To commit the perfect crime she uses a cab as a getaway car, leads to her capture
00:14:39 Joseph Scott Morgan tells story of transporting a head as a young man working in New Orleans with the coroner.
00:15:52 Under no circumstances are you to allow this bot this head out of your sight.
00:16:23 Had to use a cooler with ice to transport the head
00:18:40 Discussion about Taylor Schabusiness case.
00:19:14 The mother of the victim finds his head in bucket
00:20:20 Discussion of the relationship between suspect and victim
00:21:56 Schabusiness told police she didn't remember strangling him, but she remembered liking it.
00:23:16 She told police, you found this part of him, good luck finding the rest
00:25:48 Discussion about the types of knives needed to do what was done to the victim
00:27:46 Talk about the forensics of different types of blades
00:30:47 Joe Scott Morgan talks about the time it takes to dismember a body
00:32:09 Joel Guy Jr, created a game plan for what he was going to do to his parents
00:32:23 Discussion about Joel Guy Jr and why he killed his parents
00:34:18 Joel Guy Jr stabbed his parents to death, then cut them up.
00:35:04 Talk about police interrupted Joel Guy Jr and found his "list" of things to do
00:39:42 Discussion of the medical examiner at the trial
00:40:09 Talk about anti-mortem and post-mortem
00:43:11 Joseph Scott Morgan explains the way a body can be disarticulated
See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
Maleesa Mooney's family hasn't heard from the 31-year-old model for several days.
Worried, they ask police to do a welfare check. Los Angeles police let themselves into her apartment with a key obtained from the manager. The air conditioner has been turned down and the apartment is very cold. Police discover the beaten and bruised body of Maleesa Mooney, with her hands and feet bound, wedged into the refrigerator. There is blood underneath her body.
Join Joseph Scott Morgan and Dave Mack as they discuss how this beautiful and talented woman died.
Time Code Highlights.
00:02:30 Family of Maleesa Mooney ask police to check on her.
00:03:06 Police find Maleesa Mooney, 31, bound, gagged, stuffed in refrigerator with blood
00:04:19 The police are working as a homicide.
00:05:25 Family gets answers from mortuary
00:07:11 Joe Scott Morgan shares story of mistake he made notifying a mother of how her son died
00:08:27 The victim was greatly traumatized.
00:09:39 What it would take to put a person inside a refrigerator
00:11:44 Victim was beaten and broken.
00:14:24 Mooney seen walking into her building on surveillance camera
00:14:42 No forced entry into apartment
00:15:20 The air conditioning in apartment had been turned down and it had been flooded
00:18:00 Items on the table that are commonly associated with needing to be refrigerated, as if the refrigerator been cleaned out.
00:18:58 Is running water an effort to destroy evidence?
00:19:40 Details on the last time anybody talked to Melissa Mooney.
00:21:27 There's a six day window between last communication and when body is found. .
00:22:23 Victim has multiple trauma about her head and her neck.
00:24:03 Victim is pregnant.
00:27:27 Family received vague text messages.
00:30:08 Victim is bound ankles and wrists.
00:33:11 Victim is gagged.
00:35:15 How would body be examined at the morgue?
See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
On the evening of August 15, Connor and Betty Bowman stay home and have drinks together. The last drink Betty remembered having was a smoothie. The next morning Betty Bowman is sick. So sick she goes to the hospital where they admit her and treat her for what seemed like food poisoning. Betty Bowman is 32 and healthy but over the next 4 days her condition worsens and she dies. When her husband, Connor Bowman, tries to have her cremated right away with no autopsy, alarms bells go off and police are called. It seems that Connor Bowman was researching a particular medication used to treat gout, and what would be the lethal amount for someone the size of Betty Bowman.
Join forensic expert Joseph Scott Morgan and co-host Dave Mack as look into the almost perfect weapon and crime.
Time Code- Highlights
00:00:00 Some natural remedies have been know to humanity for thousands of years. Could one have been used for murder?
00:04:46 Discussion of Betty and Connor Bowman's educations and professions. Both are pharmacists.
00:07:59 Bowman marriage difficulties discussed.
00:09:08 Betty Bowman hospitalized with what is thought to be food poisoning and dies
00:09:12 Connor Bowman has to be smart, based on educational accomplishments
00:09:15 32 years old Betty Bowman found a way to travel. She traveled the world.
00:09:20 Betty went to Hawaii, the Caribbea, Iceland, Grand Canyon.
00:09:35 Connor had such massive debt from college that they kept their money separate
00:09:44 Conner Bowman told a friend there was $450,000 life insurance on Betty Bowman
00:10:05 Betty Bowman was in good health. She and Conner talking about divorce.
00:10:12 August 15, Betty and Connor Bowman at home, drinking and watching movies
00:10:39 Betty wakes up sick, thought food poisoning, went to Mayo clinic, St Mary Hospital August 16
00:10:59 Betty admitted to hospital and they treat her for food poisoning
00:11:05 Treat her for gastrointestinal distress and dehydration
00:11:14 After treatment, nothing gets better and she dies after four days.
00:11:58 Marriage on downhill slope
00:35:21 Connor Bowman says no autopsy, wife doesn't want to be a cadaver.
00:39:02 Connor Bowman asked if cremation would cause more "in depth" tox screen
00:41:35 Bowman looked up colchicine on laptop. What's a lethal dose?
See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
Kathryn Pham, 21. had been dating Daniel Gunnarsson, 23, hardly a month, but the 23-year-old's obsession with Pham grew quickly. He would get angry if anyone else had the young woman's attention. Gunnarsson confided to his stepfather that he thought Pham was breaking up with him. The stepfather's advice? Apologize.
Gunnarsson did and somehow convinced Pham to go with him to his stepfather's home. Once there, painters were on the scene. The couple went in to the garage. Soon after the painters hear screaming, but wait an hour before going to check. Inside the garage, Kathryn Phan is laying on the floor, naked and bloodied. Daniel Gunnarsson struck Pham with an ice axe at least 10 times.
Join forensic expert Joseph Scott Morgan and co-host Dave Mack as they look at the destruction and mayhem caused by one tool.
Time Codes-highlights
00:00:00 Joseph Scott Morgan discusses what it's like to receive a jury duty letter in the mail only to find the possible case is murder.
00:02:29 An ice axe is not a tool found in most homes. Usually it is only in locations with colder temperature. How could it be used for murder?
00:04:14 Description of an ice axe
00:06:50 Dating relationship between Daniel Gunnarsson and Katie Pham introduced
00:07:56 Daniel Gunnarsson red flag behavior details.
00:09:06 Katie Pham's trip to Gunnarsson's stepfather's garage
00:09:38 Painters start hearing a girl's screams. Body is discovered. Scene described.
00:12:28 Katie Pham's injuries described
00:15:56 Injuries occurred in the upper body, the chest, the neck and the head. .
00:20:08 Dead body touched in sexual manner
00:21:34 Suspect was wearing gloves.
00:24:45 Jurors had to hear details of an ice axe murder.
00:25:34 Victim was struck at least 10 times.
00:28:36 Is it possible to determine the order of injuries?
00:29:41 Defense strategy was that someone else snuck into the garage.
00:31:01 Jurors wept
00:31:20 Daniel Gunderson was found guilty.
See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
Kara Nichols is found dead, strangled and buried alongside a horse on a property owned by her murderer's parents, several years after she has been declared missing.
Confessed killer Joel Hollendorfer is at the center of this tale that explores not just the murder itself, but its far-reaching repercussions. Joseph Scott Morgan and Dave Mack traverse the winding roads of Kara's life and the cold case that took years to solve. They discuss the forensics of strangulation, the ethics of grief, and the complexities of moral responsibility.
Dave delves into the timeline of Kara's last days, while Joseph navigates the complicated web of legal hurdles that investigators faced. This episode also questions whether it's possible to die of a broken heart, highlighting the psychological and emotional toll a murder can take on the families involved.
Mentioned Podcast:
Zone 7 with Sheryl McCollum on Apple Podcasts
Time-coded Highlights:
00:00:43 — Joseph Scott Morgan discusses the theme of the episode, which is whether people can die of a broken heart, or from grief. He introduces a case where a murderer believes his father died from the shock of his confession.
00:02:03 — Dave Mack shares his philosophical views on the overwhelming power of grief.
00:03:20— Details about the murder of Kara Nichols are shared.
00:05:00—Joseph Scott Morgan talks about the emotional burden for the perpetrator's parents.
006:10, Dave questions the moral responsibility of those who know about the crime.
00:07:58—The close relationship between Kara and her brother is spotlighted.
00:08:27—The discussion shifts to the challenging circumstances of Kara's life.
00:09:14—Joe Scott Morgan reveals that persistence and hard work solved this cold case.
00:10:05 — Dave Mack expresses admiration for cold case workers like Cheryl McCollum.
00:15:05 — The movements of Kara are traced back to a specific suspect via her phone.
00:16:40 — Joel Hollendorfer’s conversation with Detective Gugliotta is discussed.
00:18:20 — The complexities of obtaining a search warrant are outlined.
00:23:11 — Morgan discusses the complexities of using ground penetrating radar in investigations.
00:24:14 — Dave Mack reveals that Joel Hollendorfer confessed to his parents about killing a young woman.
00:28:08 — Explaination of the use of lime on a body to speed up the decompositional process.
00:36:48 — Morgan explains the intricacies of strangulation and the role of the hyoid bone in determining the cause of death.
00:38:20 — The trial and conviction of Joel Hollendorfer are dissected, leaving listeners with the unsettling thought that he still has a chance at a life outside prison.
See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
In an unfathomable act, the lifeless body of young Zion Staples is discovered abandoned in a trash can. The grim finding sends waves through the community, raising existential questions on human morality. Joseph Scott Morgan and Dave Mack dissect the intricacies of the case, exploring topics ranging from the science of decomposition to the societal implications of how we treat our deceased. While Morgan brings his forensic expertise to the table, offering unique insights into time of death estimation and the decomposition process, Mack provides additional context, revealing dark layers of the family's involvement.
Time-coded Highlights:
00:00:20 — Joseph Scott Morgan sets the tone by musing on the value of life.
00:01:20 — The tragic story of Zion Staples is introduced.
00:01:54 — Taking out the trash is discussed as an everyday act with dark implications in the Zion Staples case.
00:03:00 — Dave Mack contextualizes the focus on garbage and decomposition in the case.
00:03:50 — The connection between smell and taste in the context of decomposition is explained by Joe Scott.
00:04:08 — Society's treatment of the deceased is examined.
00:07:14 — Dispelling a common misconception, Joseph Scott Morgan talks about the challenges in determining the exact time of death.
00:09:11 — Morgan shares details about another mysterious case involving a person missing for seven months.
00:14:37 — A detailed explanation of body tissue disintegration after death is given.
00:16:22 — Cause of death's impact on decomposition rates is discussed after Dave Mack brings up the example of a gunshot wound to the head.
00:21:14 — Significant changes that a decomposing body undergoes are highlighted by Morgan, emphasizing the importance of evidence preservation.
00:29:00 — New information about Zion's mother, Sushi Staples, and her history with child services is revealed.
00:30:40 — Joe Scott Morgan discusses the challenges of the investigation due to the time elapsed since the incident and the lack of concrete evidence.
00:32:08 — Morgan reveals that Sushi Staples has only been charged with concealing the body of her 10-year-old son in a garbage can, not with his death.
See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
Two horrific murders shake a university town to its core, as Channon Christian and Christopher Newsom fall prey to a monstrous crime. In a dilapidated house in East Knoxville, Tennessee, the young couple are kidnapped and tortured in an environment that can only be described as hellish. In this gripping episode, Joseph Scott Morgan and Dave Mack unravel the gruesome details, chilling forensics, and unfathomable cruelty behind the case. With firsthand experience and unsettling revelations, they bring you closer to understanding the harrowing ordeal these victims went through. The episode delves into forensic complexities, offers insights into the minds of the perpetrators, and discusses the pivotal moments that led to their capture. Brace yourselves for a haunting journey through one of the darkest chapters of true crime.
Time-coded Highlights:
00:00:20 — Joseph Scott Morgan sets the stage for the episode’s chilling focus: two horrific murders in a university town, considered among the most horrifying covered by Morgan.
00:01:20 — The names of the victims, Channon Christian and Christopher Newsom, are introduced alongside the setting—a rundown house in East Knoxville.
00:01:40 — Joseph Scott Morgan discloses his personal involvement in covering the Eric Boyd trial.
00:03:00 — A visceral account of the kidnapping and the setting is provided by Dave Mack.
00:04:40 — It's revealed that the atrocities committed against Channon and Christopher are akin to acts of “Satan himself."
00:07:31 — The suffering endured by Christopher Newsom, including torture and being set on fire, is hauntingly detailed by Dave Mack.
00:08:04 — The agonizing torment Channon Christian went through is elaborated upon by Joseph Scott Morgan.
00:08:46 — The seclusion and inaccessibility of railway tracks as common dumping grounds for victims are discussed.
00:10:02 — Dave Mack specifies that Christopher was not killed at the house but was later taken to the railway tracks.
00:10:54 — Dave Mack reveals that unusual activities at the house on the night of the crime were noticed by a dump truck driver.
00:11:27 — Treatment of the victims is equated to "torture," akin to how prisoners of war are treated.
00:15:04 — The crime scene’s dehumanizing aspects and the extreme physical abuse suffered by the victims are dissected.
00:23:05 — Psychological manipulation used on the victim by promising release is exposed.
00:30:27 — The discovery of the female victim's body in a garbage can, constricted into a fetal position, adds another layer of horror to the narrative.
See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
Dorothy Dusold's life comes to a chilling end, her body marred by manual strangulation and the telltale signs of anoxic encephalopathy—a gruesome testament to oxygen deprivation and ensuing cardiac arrest. True crime experts Joseph Scott Morgan and Dave Mack join forces to dissect this unsettling narrative, where familial love crumbles into fatal brutality. Diving deep into the psychosocial underpinnings, forensic evidence, and medical realities of the case, they guide us from the eerie echoes of the 911 call to the contentious forensic findings that sway the court. Through their exhaustive analysis, they illuminate not only Dorothy's agonizing final moments but also the grim medical trajectories that culminated in her tragic demise. This episode serves as a poignant and intellectually rigorous examination of the shadowy corners where family ties fray into lethal violence.
Time-coded Highlights:
00:00:20—Joseph Scott Morgan introduces the unique case of a daughter allegedly squeezing her mother to death.
00:02:40—Joe Scott and Dave Mack discuss the physical strength required to squeeze someone to death.
00:03:20 — The 911 call made by Cassandra Dusold is discussed.
00:04:20—Morgan lauds the invaluable role of first responders in high-stakes situations.
00:06:20 — The concept of deception in the case is introduced.
00:07:04 — Joe Scott Morgan explains what a 'code' means in a hospital setting, specifically a 'code blue' which indicates cardiac arrest.
00:08:31— The crucial steps in emergency cardiac care are outlined.
00:14:09 — Dave Mack opens up a dialogue on the unusual circumstances surrounding Dorothy Dusold's death.
00:16:40—Dave highlights inconsistencies in Cassandra's story, creating doubt about her credibility.
00:18:40, the possibility of Dorothy having bilateral black eyes and ear bleeding is explored.
00:27:49 — A medical breakdown of how the victim's throat was constricted is presented.
00:30:00, Joe Scott delves into various methods of manual strangulation, questioning the story told by Cassandra.
00:31:40 — The episode wraps up with the conviction of the perpetrator, Cassandra Dussault, for manslaughter.
See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
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