Stay ConnectedEvery week, we sit down with an acclaimed and venerable songwriter to intimately discuss what happens behind closed doors in the music industry. There are millions of singers, thousands of artists, and only 40 top songs per genre at a time… this podcast is about the people who make them. Produced by Joe London & Ross Golan in association with Big Deal Music & Mega House Music. And The Writer Is… ™
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And The Update Is…a weekly beat on the industry .
Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.
And The Update Is…a weekly beat on the industry .
Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.
Today's guest is a rising star who's risen so fast he's not really rising anymore — he's just a star.
From a bedroom in Luton playing $50 nylon-string covers and open mics playing for 4 people... Three years later: a billion streams, "Stargazing" on President Obama's summer playlist, two singles that took over pop radio before he'd ever made a debut album, and a debut album sourced from the notes he wrote in therapy that saved him.
He's proof that sometimes all you really need is a guitar, a work ethic, and a Taco Bell-poisoned night in Malibu to write a song people argue about in twenty languages.
And the writer is... Myles Smith!
If you've ever wanted something so badly you didn't think to ask what it would cost when it arrived — this is the conversation.
And The Writer Is... Myles Smith!
In this episode of And The Writer Is, we go deep on:
• Why he scrubbed every song he made before 2023 — and what "I didn't exist before 2023" actually means
• His advice for up and coming artists...
• The end-of-Covid breakdown at 18 that almost ended things — and the therapy notes that became My Mess, My Heart, My Life.
• Meeting Peter Fenn on the last day of a six-week US trip — and writing "My Home" in the first hour
• The Taco Bell food-poisoning night in Malibu that produced "Stargazing"
• The hidden cost of success on his relationships
• "Hey mom, I want to retire you" — and what she said back
And much more...
Hit subscribe and turn on notifications. Every week, we go deep with the most interesting creatives in music.
Follow us on socials: @andthewriteris
A special thank you to our sponsors for making these conversations possible.
Our lead sponsor, NMPA — the National Music Publishers' Association. Your support means the world to us.
CHAPTERS
0:00 Intro
2:21 My Mess, My Heart, My Life.
3:16 The pressure of being "right at the start of the journey"
4:35 "If you take away the hits, you could see where I really am"
4:54 "I wake up some days in a catastrophe"
6:01 The five albums he wore out
7:23 His mum, his absent dad, and a single-parent household
8:22 Singing in church with his grandma
11:41 First talent show: Fix You by Coldplay
13:01 The $50 nylon-string guitar that started it
14:02 Playing "Dream Girl" for his mum at 10
15:23 Growing up Black in Luton and the Labrinth Electronic album that broke his brain open
18:45 Open mics at 11 — his mum driving him to every one
20:18 Why open mics built him in a way the algorithm can't
21:43 "I was really lucky that I got to fail a thousand times"
22:30 The first real gig — 100 cap, 90 friends and family, indie band Bear with a Three
29:18 Covid, isolation, rock bottom
30:44 Therapy — and the notes that became the album
33:06 Trust issues, anxiety, the night at 18 he tried to "ctrl alt delete on life"
35:12 What he'd say to 18-year-old him
36:55 The videographer who pushed him to try TikTok
37:25 "I'm not trying that shit" — and the Sweater Weather cover that changed everything
40:24 How he paved his way onto an Amber Run tour with one recorded song
43:40 NMPA mid-roll
44:22 The day his career actually started: meeting Peter Fenn
46:08 "Music with other people is supposed to be fun" — Peter's first lesson
49:01 "My Home" — written in the first hour of meeting Peter
54:48 After Stargazing: "stuck in the future"
60:06 Brain scans, burnout, smiling through it all
62:30 "Hey mom, I want to retire you" — and what she said
63:31 The UK artists who don't love being famous — Ed Sheeran, James Bay, Niall Horan
66:12 Are you happy?
78:29 "I hated Niall Horan" — and why
80:11 Rapid fire
83:32 Meeting his wife with all this happening
85:00 The album as the closing of the first chapter
90:46 Pulling up the old voice memos
92:02 The Taco Bell night that became "Stargazing"
95:39 The biggest pinch-me moment of the last three years
98:06 Ross and Joe tape notes
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CREDITS BLOCK
Credits:
Hosted by Ross Golan
Produced by Joe London & Jad Saad
Edited by Jad Saad
Post-Production VFX by Pratik Karki
Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.
And The Update Is…a weekly beat on the industry .
Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.
Today's guest came up in the biggest band in the world at seventeen, watched it pause at twenty-two, and built a solo career almost no one in his position has ever managed to sustain. From success, to tragedy, and back... This Irishman makes his triumphant return to the stage and our hearts with 'Dinner Party'.
And The Writer Is... Niall Horan!
He talks about Liam not as a tribute beat, but as a presence — what fires you up to walk on stage when somebody you love would still want to be there. After the band, after the loss, after four albums — who do you become?
In this episode of And The Writer Is, we go deep on:
- Coming off the 2024 tour that sold over a million arena tickets "without a big smash hit of the show"
- The twelve-week Southeast Asia backpacking trip that came right before "This Town"
- The story of songs like 'Heaven', 'Slow Hands', 'This Town', and Liam's song...
- Pushing One Direction's sound from "What Makes You Beautiful" toward "Story Of My Life"
- Going solo at twenty-three and being terrified the music was about to end
- Julian Bunetta's intervention on "End Of An Era": "this song is about Liam, we just don't know it yet"
- "Dinner Party," the new album, and the next world tour
Hit subscribe and turn on notifications. Every week, we go deep with the most interesting creatives in music.
Follow us on socials: @andthewriteris
A special thank you to our sponsors for making these conversations possible.
Our lead sponsor, NMPA — the National Music Publishers' Association. Your support means the world to us.
0:00 Intro
1:12 Straight back to the studio after the 2024 arena tour
2:13 Over a million tickets sold in 2024 — "and I just wasn't expecting it"
3:23 Meeting on the One Direction tour years ago — abandoned buildings, makeshift studios, 200 fans outside within the hour
5:46 The post-show ritual: shower, shorts, Netflix, no drinking
9:20 Concerts as events now — the fans build it before he arrives
10:08 "I grew up on Slow Hands" — Sombr and the new guard
14:34 Why the Irish footprint is so big — and why Irish men can't say it out loud
17:16 First concert was the Eagles at four — and his mom's Hotel California vinyl
18:44 How Niall's listening drove One Direction's sound toward "Story Of My Life"
24:58 Savan Kotecha asks: sticking to your guns when every era says chase the trend
27:43 "I don't think I'd be able to sell something else that doesn't come from me"
34:34 Going solo at twenty-three — and being terrified it was all going to end
35:32 How watching the other boys release first actually fired him up
40:05 "You can't chase Slow Hands" — the law Niall heard John Ryan name on this podcast
45:15 Why he went backpacking through Vietnam, Cambodia, Thailand and the Philippines after the band
46:39 Why Slow Hands taking twenty weeks to #1 was actually the goal
56:11 "The minute you think you're a household name, it's game over"
57:03 What The Voice actually did to his crowd
66:55 "Heartbreak Weather" — wanting to be the song that stands out, even at the cost of being safe
75:09 Writing Heaven at 1am in Joshua Tree — and John Ryan about to walk away
80:53 Liam Payne, and the song that wrote itself in five minutes once Julian said the thing nobody was saying
89:02 The lowest moment of his career — and it's not what you'd guess
93:36 The waterfall effect — the people you surround yourself with
Credits:
Hosted by Ross Golan
Produced by Joe London & Jad Saad
Edited by Jad Saad
Post-Production VFX by Pratik Karki
Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.
And The Update Is…a weekly beat on the industry .
Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.
Today's guest is a Grammy Producer of the Year who's tied with Babyface for the only three-in-a-row run in the award's history — and whose real story isn't the trophies, the radio, or the run of hits. It's the decision he makes once every few years that almost no other producer at his level makes: which artist he'll spend the next decade building.
From frontman of touring indie band Steel Train to one of the most decorated producers of his generation, he built his career against almost every modern industry instinct.
This is one of the more honest conversations about what it actually takes to bet a decade of your career on one person. When you're quietly refusing the industry's playbook from inside the room — who do you become?
And The Writer Is... Jack Antonoff!
In this episode of And The Writer Is, we go deep on:
• The importance of finding your people
• Why "Album is God" — and what a single actually is
• The Sabrina Carpenter origin: a random run-in two weeks after a Bleachers show
• "Workaholics aren't disciplined. They're sad." — why he refuses all-nighters
• The "Getaway Car" bridge moment Taylor's documentary caught in real time
• 5 voices that feel like 100 — the "Please Please Please" vocal stack walkthrough
• The artists he's passed on who became stars — and why he doesn't regret it
• Why he writes his best on instruments he doesn't understand
And much more...
Hit subscribe and turn on notifications. Every week, we go deep with the most interesting creatives in music.
Follow us on socials: @andthewriteris
A special thank you to our sponsors for making these conversations possible.
Our lead sponsor, NMPA — the National Music Publishers Association. Your support means the world to us.
And @splice — the best sample library on the market. Period.
CHAPTER TIMESTAMPS
0:00 Intro
1:10 Ross gave Jack his first co-writing session
2:42 The myth and folklore of the LA writing scene
8:02 "There's no proof more sessions makes you better"
10:08 What gives energy vs. what takes it
13:12 Body-of-work first, not single first
16:48 "Album is God. Singles are a long hallway to nothing."
17:58 The hit-song tour that sold 12 tickets
19:17 Sabrina, Chappell, Charli — the only lesson from artist development
22:35 Working with artists who already have the vision
23:33 Amy asks: how do you make something timeless?
25:40 Album tracks are like movie scenes — "Scarface doesn't fit in The Holiday"
26:55 How the sonic palette emerges (Mastermind, Tulsa Jesus Freak)
31:43 Bleachers — letting the band teeter
33:22 "I write my best on what I understand the least"
37:47 "Workaholics aren't disciplined. They're sad."
40:18 The "Getaway Car" bridge moment Taylor's documentary caught
41:28 Keeping it small even when the artist is the biggest in the world
44:24 Writing for yourself is how you reach more people
48:48 "Geniuses finish things"
52:01 Why he protects his circle from outside voices
54:37 What Producer of the Year three years in a row actually means
56:36 The producers Jack steals from (Jeff Lynne, Sam Dew)
61:17 5 voices that feel like 100 — "Please Please Please" stack walkthrough
64:10 Dyslexic, Adderall, the VS 840 zip-disk teen years
68:13 Authenticity is the only currency that lasts
68:57 When their song "March" became a MeToo women's marches anthem
Credits:
Hosted by Ross Golan
Produced by Joe London & Jad Saad
Edited by Jad Saad
Post-Production VFX by Pratik Karki
Watercolor by Michael White
Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.
And The Update Is…a weekly beat on the industry .
Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.
Today's guest is a multi-instrumentalist, music educator, interviewer, producer, and songwriter. He is also one of the most influential independent music voices online. His real story isn't the channel he built after a 90-second video of his son's perfect pitch hit 80 million views overnight, it's his incredible value to the music community and the conversations he sparks online about the state of the music industry and his conversations with some of the biggest creators within it's orbit.
This is one of the more unflinching conversations we've had about what's actually happening to music. Two musicians from different generations of the same fight, working it out in real time. Where do you stand when the rules of the music industry keep changing under your feet?
And The Writer Is... Rick Beato!
In this episode of And The Writer Is, we go deep on:
And much more...
Hit subscribe and turn on notifications. Every week, we go deep with the most interesting creatives in music.
Follow us on socials: @andthewriteris
A special thank you to our sponsors for making these conversations possible.
Our lead sponsor, NMPA — the National Music Publishers Association. Your support means the world to us.
Chapters
0:00 Intro
2:14 The beginning of Rick Beato's music career
3:11 The rollercoaster of an early music career
5:32 The Napster era and the dawn of digital recording
9:16 Producing Shinedown — and how "Simple Man" became the hit
10:54 Why "Yellow Ledbetter" was a B-side — and why bonus tracks are back
12:48 What country radio still gets right about hits
14:54 Inside Nashville sessions and the number triangle
17:28 The future of AI in music — and the No Fakes Act
21:20 The future of prompting and curating music
23:54 Would The Beatles be a four-way publishing split in 2026?
25:39 The modern music economy: are album tracks worthless now?
27:58 American writers are chasing global stars now
34:30 The Eli Mercer experiment: a fake artist built with Claude
36:52 The NPR EDM stunt and what it proved about AI on Spotify
41:18 4M monthly listeners. 6,300 followers. AI is winning the algorithm.
42:58 How Rick Beato built a YouTube empire
45:22 The "What Makes This Song Great" era
51:49 1984 vs now — and the search for a modern Bob Dylan and Stevie Wonder
54:18 Who is the Michael Jordan of pop music?
55:51 Queen at 3 billion streams — what counts as "biggest"
1:00:28 Golden, Blinding Lights, and what makes a 2020s standard
1:06:53 Songwriter similarities and the lawsuits that never happened
1:09:42 "Best era of pop music. Am I wrong?"
1:13:56 1998: how Clear Channel and Cumulus consolidated radio
1:20:14 The Music Modernization Act and what's actually next
1:24:54 Is the future of songwriting still bullish?
Credits:
Hosted by Ross Golan
Produced by Joe London & Jad Saad
Edited by Jad Saad
Post-Production VFX by Pratik Karki
Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.
And The Update Is…a weekly beat on the industry . This week Ross dives into No Fake Act, Justin Bieber's comeback to charts since Coachella, Country & KPOP chart toppers & more. Tune into this weeks episode of ATWI with Roget Chahayed.
Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.
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